What is the deal with Pomeroy ?

[memcorsu]

Riddle me this... This is a guy that "knows" college basketball? Really? He really look like he laced them up and understands the game.

I have read some of his writing and he comes off as such a pompous jerk. His number are so subjectively skewed it is unbelievable. The pac 10 is a joke. Watching the ASU game last night teams in the ACC, Big 10, Big East, AAC look so much better. I could create a laundry list of teams in the East that would run through the Pac. Arizona and Wichita have had a much cushier road to travel then most teams in the East.

I can't wait for his shtick to get old... Although for some reason we always get another numbers Bieber (Serigan anyone?) :bang:

Speaking of the Orange — those who believe Syracuse has had a much stronger season than Wichita State should think twice, Ken Pomeroy said. The respected stats guru pointed out in his blog that before the Pitt game, all five of Syracuse’s road victories — St. John’s, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Miami (Fla.) and Wake Forest — were less than intimidating based on the weaker home-court advantages in those buildings. Along the same lines, folks should take into account the incredible home atmosphere at the Carrier Dome, which has been well-documented. So like the Shockers, Syracuse has benefited from a lighter schedule as well, Pomeroy argued, although things should get considerably more dicey down the stretch. Pomeroy gives the Orange only a 6.1 percent chance at finishing the regular season undefeated, compared to 70.2 percent for Wichita State.​

http://www.startribune.com/sports/245635121.html

I was looking for Wichita's schedule but realized I was looking in the D3 conferences...ooopppsss...
http://www.d3hoops.com/conferences

Numbers can tell a lot but they don't tell the whole story. Just chaps me that this guy comes off that he is the end all be all of basketball.

I struggle inside myself to speak ill of other people. I have never met the man and perhaps he saves kittens from fiery infernos and Ewoks from "Death Stars". The two things that get me faster than anything and I really have to fight against it is rudeness and arrogance and he just seems to have them both.

 

[jncuse]

I find it amusing thar you say his individual team ratings are subjectively skewed (which they are not) and then go on to make many subjective assessments

 

[SWC75]

Going into the season our schedule seemed intimidating. Now it's a liability?

 

[CusefanATL]

you do realize that we are led by this guy who laced them up...

 

[Knicks411]

I think whoever summarized his article did a really poor job of it. Almost totally missed the point.

 

[cusetown1]

you do realize that we are led by this guy who laced them up...

 

[HOFCeluck]

Riddle me this... This is a guy that "knows" college basketball? Really? He really look like he laced them up and understands the game.

I have read some of his writing and he comes off as such a pompous jerk. His number are so subjectively skewed it is unbelievable. The pac 10 is a joke. Watching the ASU game last night teams in the ACC, Big 10, Big East, AAC look so much better. I could create a laundry list of teams in the East that would run through the Pac. Arizona and Wichita have had a much cushier road to travel then most teams in the East.

I can't wait for his shtick to get old... Although for some reason we always get another numbers Bieber (Serigan anyone?) :bang:

Speaking of the Orange — those who believe Syracuse has had a much stronger season than Wichita State should think twice, Ken Pomeroy said. The respected stats guru pointed out in his blog that before the Pitt game, all five of Syracuse’s road victories — St. John’s, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Miami (Fla.) and Wake Forest — were less than intimidating based on the weaker home-court advantages in those buildings. Along the same lines, folks should take into account the incredible home atmosphere at the Carrier Dome, which has been well-documented. So like the Shockers, Syracuse has benefited from a lighter schedule as well, Pomeroy argued, although things should get considerably more dicey down the stretch. Pomeroy gives the Orange only a 6.1 percent chance at finishing the regular season undefeated, compared to 70.2 percent for Wichita State.​

http://www.startribune.com/sports/245635121.html

I was looking for Wichita's schedule but realized I was looking in the D3 conferences...ooopppsss...
http://www.d3hoops.com/conferences

Numbers can tell a lot but they don't tell the whole story. Just chaps me that this guy comes off that he is the end all be all of basketball.

I struggle inside myself to speak ill of other people. I have never met the man and perhaps he saves kittens from fiery infernos and Ewoks from "Death Stars". The two things that get me faster than anything and I really have to fight against it is rudeness and arrogance and he just seems to have them both.

The people who bitch about Ken Pomeroys system never mention which one they prefer. Maybe they should develop a superior formula?

 

[Knicks411]

The people who bitch about Ken Pomeroys system never mention which one they prefer. Maybe they should develop a superior formula?

It seems to me that Pomeroy is basically held to an impossible standard. No one has ever claimed it's perfect because of course its not. You'll often see posts if a team Pomeroy likes higher than the general consensus loses, crowing about how Pomeroy is off on that team or whatever. No one says the AP poll is flawed if the 10th team beats the 5th team, it's just accepted as something that happens.

And I've said this a million times; Pomeroy's projected game lines are almost always right in line with Vegas; if Pomeroy is so off then just bet the games, you'd make a killing.

 

[HoustonCuse]

Yeah the interpretation of whoever summarized that was off. VTech is supposedly one of the tougher road venues, WTFU was undefeated at their place since last season. Who cares. We ain't on the bubble needing to fret over this stuff.

 

[pearl31]

The people who bitch about Ken Pomeroys system never mention which one they prefer. Maybe they should develop a superior formula?

But that's kind of the point - anyone who relies on advanced stats and metrics to assess the teams is misinformed—regardless of what "formula" it may be.
The eye test and common sense combined with a little homework will serve a person just fine.

 

[Waltdods]

But that's kind of the point - anyone who relies on advanced stats and metrics to assess the teams is misinformed—regardless of what "formula" it may be.
The eye test and common sense combined with a little homework will serve a person just fine.

I watch 100 percent of the games Syracuse plays and roughly 0.01 percent of the games every other D-1 team plays. With one notable, uconn hating exception, I think that's true of just about everyone on this board. So the idea that I can use the eye test in any sort of rigorous way (or that anyone can) to compare teams strikes me as pretty unconvincing.

 

[TheCusian]

All that he is saying is that our schedule isn't as hard as most think. That is a completely separate argument as to how good we are. That's what these advanced metric guys can't get a handle on. They only deal in the past - what happened. Not "how good is this team" as it portends to future games.

You play who is on your schedule. If you win them all - or if you win your last game in the tourney - KenPom will be forced to lick your boot.

 

[SWC75]

24-0 is a stat.

 

[orangetrojan]

This is one aspect of college bball I love over football - really what these people think matters very little. His opinion of us does not change the fact that as long as we take care of our business on the court we should make a deep tourney run, regardless of what his stats or Boris durke's in-game analysis says.

 

[HOFCeluck]

But that's kind of the point - anyone who relies on advanced stats and metrics to assess the teams is misinformed—regardless of what "formula" it may be.
The eye test and common sense combined with a little homework will serve a person just fine.

But no one relies on kenpom entirely. We all use the "eye test." Good luck using it on 351 teams though.

 

[HOFCeluck]

This is one aspect of college bball I love over football - really what these people think matters very little. His opinion of us does not change the fact that as long as we take care of our business on the court we should make a deep tourney run, regardless of what his stats or Boris durke's in-game analysis says.

LOL @ his "opinion"

 

[HOFCeluck]

BTW...love how the original poster whines about his numbers being "subjectively scewed"... The same numbers that have Syracuse as the number two team in the land...and gaining on number one every day.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

He's not a pomme. He's not a Roy. What's the deal?

 

[pearl31]

that's true of just about everyone on this board.

Wrong.

 

[Waltdods]

Wrong.

Teams in the ACC alone have played about 300 games. Have you really watched a meaningful percentage of them? If you have, more power to you. I certainly haven't. I am at least a little skeptical that I'm in the minority here.

 

[strumpfasaurus]

I also think these stats go out the window once you get to the NCAA tournament which is single elimination when a great team can get upset by a hot team and things like, luck, match ups, being hot at the right time, having a player that can carry your team and coaching come into factor and all those stats mean nothing in that environment.

 

[AZOrange]

Teams in the ACC alone have played about 300 games. Have you really watched a meaningful percentage of them? If you have, more power to you. I certainly haven't. I am at least a little skeptical that I'm in the minority here.

You might not be but there are plenty of people watching a lot of games. And I don't bother with teams outside of the top 50-100 or so but probably watch 15-20 games a week (in whole or part...part being at least 20 min of game action.

 

[AZOrange]

It's so funny to me why people care about this potatoe-y stuff.

 

[Knicks411]

All that he is saying is that our schedule isn't as hard as most think. That is a completely separate argument as to how good we are. That's what these advanced metric guys can't get a handle on. They only deal in the past - what happened. Not "how good is this team" as it portends to future games.

You play who is on your schedule. If you win them all - or if you win your last game in the tourney - KenPom will be forced to lick your boot.

He's not even really saying our schedule isn't that difficult. Just that it's backloaded, and if we lose some of the tough road games we have coming up it doesn't meant we still aren't awesome.

But that's kind of the point - anyone who relies on advanced stats and metrics to assess the teams is misinformed—regardless of what "formula" it may be.
The eye test and common sense combined with a little homework will serve a person just fine.

It's not really an either/or though. I would like to see how those people would do picking games against Pomeroy's system though.

 

[Waltdods]

24-0 is a stat.

Definitely, and it's a useful one. As are all the stats you put together on a regular basis (which are awesome). But the 24-0 isn't the only statistic available and others can also be informative.