Whisper Behind the Curtain: As the ACC turns under the covers...

[arbitragegls]

There is a lot of discussion going on as to how conference expansion plays out. Obviously the NC final decision will play a major role. But the other elephant out there remains Notre Dame and this university has several confernces pining for it to join in one way or another. Interestingly, from Wolfpack country and Senior administrator (cousin), the discussion is heating up. For example, does Notre Dame going to the Big 12--what a poor fit academically, geographically, and from a culture perpsective--have a detrimental effect on the ACC. It could. Does FSU and Clemson for example want to go to the Big 12 and join Notre Dame. Does Notre Dame want to come to the ACC--YES for all non football sports because it is the best fit...private schools, academics, one of fastest growing areas of US; East Coast stretching along water from Florida to Boston, Olympic sports etc better teams than any other conference. Heck they placed their hockey team in eastern league not the midwest with the B1g universities; it plays one heck of a lacrosse game...damn, Big 12 doesnt even know what hockey and lacrosse are let alone play them.
So what is the hurdle, the creative out of box need to get Notre Dame to committ to the ACC. Several areas are being explored, but the biggest hurdle should be the easiest to jump: revenue sharing. So here is our discussion question that is also being considered in the ACC:
1. What if all Notre Dame Teams come in except for football (TBD if and when).
--will those teams increase value of conference
--will those teams hold the primary football powers of FSU-Clemson-and VT in the conference
--will a financial sharing of revenue (remember that football accounts for 80% of TV contract give or take) among the remaining 20% be doable
2. Would ACC teams accept Notre Dame under a 3-4 game a year rotation that must include minimally one of the following every year: FSU, Clemson, VT...and then others such as BC, Pitt, 'Cuse, GT when possible
--two of the games must be road games for Notre Dame and revenue split for TV and gate
3. Would ACC teams accept Notre Dame and let Notre Dame keep TV contracts beyond 2015 as long as Notre Dame does not share in TV football revenue from ACC
--additionally if an ACC team is in the NC, Notre Dame does not receive any of that money
--and if Notre Dame is in the NC than the ACC receives no money

These are some of the discussions i am told are being discussed. No one has an answer as yet but the feeling is if Notre Dame lands partially in the Big 12 it could have a negative effect on the ACC.

What are your thoughts?

 

[SU2NASA]

Notre Dame isn't joining any other conference.

 

[arbitragegls]

Notre Dame isn't joining any other conference.

It most likely will not be in the BE within the next two years or sooner...Football maybe not but all other sports being told probably

 

[Toga]

If ND isn't taking their FB team to the B12 - I'm not clear on why having all other sports in B12 makes the B12 more attractive to any ACC team looking to jump.

 

[arbitragegls]

If ND isn't taking their FB team to the B12 - I'm not clear on why having all other sports in B12 makes the B12 more attractive to any ACC team looking to jump.

It signals two things...Notre Dame is not going to the ACC and it makes the Big 12 look stronger...lets say those 3-4 games are now played against Big 12 opponents.

 

[phil77]

The biggest question is-----Can the ACC afford to let ND go and make a deal with the BIG10 or BIG12 or whatever conference. Do all members want ND even at a partial status if they get games against ND? Does this keep FSU, Clemson, GT and VT happy?

I wouldn't care if they are apart of the conference if they are not getting any football money and an equal share of all the other money. They can not take the place of an ACC team in the playoff or the Orange bowl. And all bowl money is independent.

 

[shantydaze]

Heck they placed their hockey team in eastern league not the midwest with the B1g universities;

I would not read to much into this. B1G started its own hockey conference, which starts play in 2013.

It signals two things...Notre Dame is not going to the ACC and it makes the Big 12 look stronger...lets say those 3-4 games are now played against Big 12 opponents.

Did it make the BE look stronger? Granted, I have a bias, but a league that is forced to capitulate and accept ND without football appears weaker than the conferences (B1G, ACC) that told them "no".

I will be disappointed if the ACC offers an associate membership to ND. imo, one of the inherent weaknesses of the Big East was the disparate interests of its football schools, basketball onlies and ND. The B12, the only other BCS conference poached in the latest round of expansion, weakness was the unequal revenue sharing and the ability of Texas to start its own network. Why would the ACC want to invite both of these issues into the league?

 

[SU2NASA]

It most likely will not be in the BE within the next two years or sooner...Football maybe not but all other sports being told probably

The other schools that don't play Big East football are all Catholic schools. They'll always have a home with those schools. Why does no one think about this?

They're going nowhere.

 

[Orangello]

"What if all Notre Dame Teams come in except for football (TBD if and when).
--will those teams increase value of conference"

That's the only real question in my mind. Does permitting ND to park all of its teams in the ACC sans FB increase the overall value of the conference ? They have made it clear that they are not joining a conference and believe they can go it alone as long as they have their own TV gig.

I would have to believe that whatever value ND BB or lacrosse brings to the ACC is de minimis and if you're never getting their FB, what's the real point ? You're not going to get another $2-3M per team per year. I'm just not buying the argument that having them park their non-FB sports in the Bevo "makes it stronger" while "weakening" the ACC. Why wouldn't it also weaken the SEC, Pac10 or BiG ? We've seen this movie before folks and it most certainly didn't "strengthen" the BE.

 

[rrlbees]

I don't know how to answer because I have been convinced there have not been discussions between ND or any conference nor FSU or Clemson. It's all internet talk.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[Guinness]

 

[orange79]

I just can't see ND their alumni and fans, a great number located up and down the east coast. Trading Boston for Ames, and Miami for Lubbock? I just don't see it.

 

[omniorange]

Last time around, ACC was only willing to consider a partial membership for 7 years and then ND had to be "all-in".

So, at minimum, I think the price would realistically have to be:

1) a commitment that once ND decided to have its football in a conference, that conference would have to be the ACC without boxing ND into a set time table.

2) a 6 game commitment for football

Both conditions are probably ones the Irish pass on, which is fine with me.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[IthacaMatt]

The biggest question is-----Can the ACC afford to let ND go and make a deal with the BIG10 or BIG12 or whatever conference. Do all members want ND even at a partial status if they get games against ND? Does this keep FSU, Clemson, GT and VT happy?

I wouldn't care if they are apart of the conference if they are not getting any football money and an equal share of all the other money. They can not take the place of an ACC team in the playoff or the Orange bowl. And all bowl money is independent.

We've seen in the past that these Partial Scheduling Commitments are bullshit. ND has had them with the Big East for years. How many times have we seen them during that relationship? Big deal that they offer you a few games among the ones they rotate.

 

[OrangePA]

It doesn't seem to me that the NC State source has gotten much of anything right.

 

[omniorange]

We've seen in the past that these Partial Scheduling Commitments are bullshit. ND has had them with the Big East for years. How many times have we seen them during that relationship? Big deal that they offer you a few games among the ones they rotate.

Actually, the only official, meaning publicly spoken (not necessarily in writing) scheduling "deal" with ND was made back when White was AD. It was suppose to be 4 games annually once the schedule a few years down the line freed up, but once White left, the new AD never felt they were obligated to go through with said "verbal" deal. Of course, not getting the terms they wanted from Rutgers and UConn didn't help.

"Oh, you mean not only do we have to schedule you, but you expect us to play at your place?!? Deal's off!" :rolling:


Cheers,
Neil

 

[Jake]

I'm in the minority, but I'd be fine with nd as a partial member.

 

[omniorange]

I'm in the minority, but I'd be fine with nd as a partial member.

It would give the ND administrators time to work on their fans to eventual membership for football.

Unlike the Big East or even the Big 12 (should they so choose), nobody would truly believe they would put their football in either league. The two options for football conference membership remain the BiG and the ACC, imho.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[MaxwellCuse]

I'm in the minority, but I'd be fine with nd as a partial member.

Partial membership would be okay with me as well but ONLY if it were the only way to keep ND from moving to the B12. And I wouldn't be interested in bringing along any little buddies (i.e. UCONN, RU or Villanova) for "balance." 15 works fine for a hoops conference.

 

[TexanMark]

Partial membership would be okay with me as well but ONLY if it were the only way to keep ND from moving to the B12. And I wouldn't be interested in bringing along any little buddies (i.e. UCONN, RU or Villanova) for "balance." 15 works fine for a hoops conference.

I would be cool with that...after ND there is no must have team...but we should put a few teams on the Rolodex (Nova, Hoyas, SJU as possible Hybrids) and of course UConn, Louisville, Cincy and Rutgers for Full Membership considerations. Notre Dame is the plum and as I said earlier...you take them as a hybrid now to stave off the B12. I like the idea they sign an exclusivity relationship that the ACC is the only Conference they would join for FB w/o paying a penalty. The ACC should expect 4-6 games a year with ND and all NBC money should be split on days ND hosts an ACC team. I'm sure SU would fall over themselves to get ND at MetLife 2-3 times a decade.

I don't want the ACC to bloat past 16 Full Time Members plus 2 Hybrids.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Partial membership would be okay with me as well but ONLY if it were the only way to keep ND from moving to the B12. And I wouldn't be interested in bringing along any little buddies (i.e. UCONN, RU or Villanova) for "balance." 15 works fine for a hoops conference.

Forget the rumblings. There is NO WAY that Notre Dame's alumni and donors want them playing the teams from the Big 12, except for maybe Texas. The rest of them are farmer schools with little academic prestige, that sit in the middle of nowhere.

 

[All4SU]

Forget the rumblings. There is NO WAY that Notre Dame's alumni and donors want them playing the teams from the Big 12, except for maybe Texas. The rest of them are farmer schools with little academic prestige, that sit in the middle of nowhere.

Agree. This whole set of rumors and posts about ND to the B12 is just so bizarre. It's not happening folks.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I would be cool with that...after ND there is no must have team...but we should put a few teams on the Rolodex (Nova, Hoyas, SJU as possible Hybrids) and of course UConn, Louisville, Cincy and Rutgers for Full Membership considerations. Notre Dame is the plum and as I said earlier...you take them as a hybrid now to stave off the B12. I like the idea they sign an exclusivity relationship that the ACC is the only Conference they would join for FB w/o paying a penalty. The ACC should expect 4-6 games a year with ND and all NBC money should be split on days ND hosts an ACC team. I'm sure SU would fall over themselves to get ND at MetLife 2-3 times a decade.

I don't want the ACC to bloat past 16 Full Time Members plus 2 Hybrids.

Here's what's stupid about partial membership and partial scheduling of games with Notre Dame - for ANY conference. If you don't play a full slate of games, then they don't count in the standings. And if the games don't count in the standings, then they aren't part of your conference. End of discussion.

There is nothing to be gained from having Notre Dame as a non-member of your conference, who occasionally schedules a couple teams from your league, when they can fit it into their schedule.

 

[Scooch]

Agree. This whole set of rumors and posts about ND to the B12 is just so bizarre. It's not happening folks.

Come on, it's such an easy sell to an alumni base that has always proven to be rational and flexible.

I can see it now...

"Dear Notre Dame alumni, it with great excitement that we move our basketball team to the Big XII. Gone are the days of having to travel to such backwater burgs as New York City, Chicago, Washington D.C., and Philadelphia to see your beloved Irish play ball. A new era dawns where you can catch the excitement of ND hoops in such exotic locales as Lubbock, Ames, Manhattan (no, not that one, the other one), and Stillwater."

 

[All4SU]

The ACC's position on ND should be to remain cordial, keep the lines of communication open, and let them know you're interested in them as a full member. Demonstrate the logic and financial benefits. Beyond that, don't do them any favors without getting something of equal value in return. Don't make it difficult for them, but don't make it easy for them to remain an independent either.