Who redshirts?

[OrangeDW]

Buddy Boeheim, Brewster Academy, Shooting Guard

I really hope he shines, but 64th or whatever he is ranked here isn't one of the best shooters in the class.

Maybe fans should give this kid a chance to play a game or two before giving him so many expectations, unrealistic or otherwise.

There’s probably a chance he’s the “best shooter on the team” in drills and practice but isn’t the best shooter on the team in games yet due to limited looks, minutes, and not quite being ready for prime time yet. We’ve had a lot of guys with obviously great shooting strokes who weren’t quite ready to produce much as freshmen...Nichols, Rautins, Shumpert, Cooney, and Southerland come to mind.

 

[OttoMets]

Mark it down in ink: if Howard, Battle, and Carey are healthy, there won't be more than 30 (total, not average) ACC minutes for the Boeheim kid. At Syracuse, fourth guards hold down the bench. Best-case scenario, if he's really that good a shooter, he'll have a Mookie Jones season and his time to shine will come the next year.

As an aside, can somebody offer any historic precedent to support the thought that Boeheim will come in and produce? Displacing upperclass guards is rare enough, but I can't think of any freshman shooter at SU who's been able to overcome inconsistent minutes and the steep learning curve of the college game with any early success.

 

[Orangezoo]

I'd be surprised if nobody redshirts. In fact, I could see 2 of the 3 redshirting.

Washington is unlikely to play 100 minutes on the season, IMO. Coming off the knee injury, it would make the most sense for him.

Braswell probably won't play much, assuming Hughes can handle Forward minutes and foul trouble doesn't plague us.

Buddy will really have to shoot well to earn minutes, so we'll see.

So we purposely only have 9 guys available all season??? Seriously? I don't follow the logic of just because a kid may not see many minutes he should redshirt. I don't think that really is the purpose of using it. If a guy is medically incapable of playing or is a total shot in the dark project I think it makes sense. As it stands no one on the roster meets those scenarios.

 

[Orangezoo]

From all reports Hughes will be the 3rd forward this year. Both bras and HW make sense to redshirt. 4 years from now we’re gonna be saying damnit why did we burn bras’ RS for 4 min a game.

The other side to this is we will likely lose Oshae, Battle alongside Frank and PC. Add the unknown of Carey and at least those 4 mins provide some experience vs just practice time returning the following year.

 

[rrlbees]

Why are people voting for Braswell? Are they assuming Hughes will slide to the 3 when Oshae or Marek need a breather? If not, that makes no sense to me.

Hughes will play both the 3 and the 2. Probably more 3.

 

[Ajflood12]

I’ll b

I think we press more so more guys see some limited minutes just to spread the load out.. If anyone was to RS I think it would be braswell but we really only have 4 forwards so not sure we dont still have a need but we may end up running hughes/battle down there and fill that spot out with the 2 extra guards.

I hope you are right and they do press more but I’ll belive it when I see.

 

[two3zone]

So we purposely only have 9 guys available all season??? Seriously? I don't follow the logic of just because a kid may not see many minutes he should redshirt. I don't think that really is the purpose of using it. If a guy is medically incapable of playing or is a total shot in the dark project I think it makes sense. As it stands no one on the roster meets those scenarios.

Was Cooney or Moyer a shot in the dark project or medically incapable?

 

[Owens guy]

No one. JB will enjoy having the freedom of a quick hook if a player isn't ready to play or commits a bad turnover. Competition for playing time is a good thing. JB won't let this team rest of last year's sweet 16 success knowing they can do more this year.

Also, I expect JB will also try out several lineup combos in the pre-ACC season. JB will be able to go with big or small lineups depending on the opponent.

 

[RF2044]

Was Cooney or Moyer a shot in the dark project or medically incapable?

Moyer was, right?

 

[two3zone]

Moyer was, right?

He wasn’t medically incapable. He played at Orange Madness and JB even said he wasn’t going to play.

Judging by his season last year it’s clear why he redshirted.

 

[two3zone]

Moyer was, right?

It would be foolish, Boeheim said, to burn an entire season playing behind Andrew White, Tyler Roberson and Tyler Lydon, to maybe squeeze out 3-4 minutes of playing time his freshman year.
"Even if he gets better," Boeheim said, "there's not playing time for him. Next year, we'll have four or five guys, maximum, coming back and now you have a great opportunity to play."

 

[RF2044]

He wasn’t medically incapable. He played at Orange Madness and JB even said he wasn’t going to play.

Judging by his season last year it’s clear why he redshirted.

Not true -- he injured his foot and was in a walking boot for a significant portion of preseason practice. That set him back, impaired his conditioning, etc.

Moyer redshirting was a function of that.

 

[two3zone]

Not true -- he injured his foot and was in a walking boot for a significant portion of preseason practice. That set him back, impaired his conditioning, etc.

Moyer redshirting was a function of that.

Based on what you saw last year of him after playing in the system for a year, how many minutes was he getting over White, Lydon and Roberson?

JB wasn’t seeing the point of him playing 3 minutes a game, and even with our limited roster last year he barely played at the end of the year.

He redshirted because he just wasn’t ready, you don’t play in a public scrimmage a month before the season and get to use an injury excuse as a reason to redshirt.

Even the head coach said he wasn’t going to play.

 

[RF2044]

Based on what you saw last year of him after playing in the system for a year, how many minutes was he getting over White, Lydon and Roberson?

JB wasn’t seeing the point of him playing 3 minutes a game, and even with our limited roster last year he barely played at the end of the year.

He redshirted because he just wasn’t ready, you don’t play in a public scrimmage a month before the season and get to use an injury excuse as a reason to redshirt.

Even the head coach said he wasn’t going to play.

Enough with the H0T Takes -- he got injured. The other things you mentioned are all peripheral to why he was redshirted, and supplemental to why the decision was made.

 

[reedny]

Hughes will play both the 3 and the 2. Probably more 3.

He'll get some backup minutes at SG, maybe 5 a half. And think you're right that he'll get some time at forward since we only have one backup (freshman). But i wouldn't sleep on Bas. I think Hughes is a lot better than his numbers at ECU (27% from 3), but Bas shot almost 50% from 3 in the EYBL - and he's 6'9 with pogo sticks. So I can see a scenario where Hughes comes in for OB for a few minutes and Bas spells MD.

 

[two3zone]

Enough with the H0T Takes -- he got injured. The other things you mentioned are all peripheral to why he was redshirted, and supplemental to why the decision was made.

He played in the exhibition game against Indiana before he redshirted to.

It’s not a hot take. How many minutes would he have played over Roberson, Lydon and White? Just want your opinion on how many.

 

[Dinkyspond]

I think Buddy will play some 3. Out of position, but he will scrap, fight and claw for rebounds and we know he'll have no problem playing the zone down there. He's 6-6 too, I think he can handle it.

 

[Orangezoo]

Was Cooney or Moyer a shot in the dark project or medically incapable?

I would argue yes. Cooney was far from ready as was clear during how he performed as a Redshirt Frosh as well. If Braswell or Buddy fit that mold where they are just nowhere near ready then sure it makes more sense.

 

[RF2044]

He played in the exhibition game against Indiana before he redshirted to.

It’s not a hot take. How many minutes would he have played over Roberson, Lydon and White? Just want your opinion on how many.

It's a hot take because you are making a false attribution about why he was redshirting, and expressing the narrative that it was due to him being subpar, while simultaneously completely [and conveniently] ignoring the documented fact that he got injured prior to his freshman season.

Here's what actually happened:

• Moyer got injured in July, during the summer session prior to his freshman year. The injury was a severe turf toe, which made it nearly impossible for him to play or run
• Matt spent quite a bit of time that summer / fall in a walking boot, which prevented him from working on his game, playing pickup ball / developing chemistry with his teammates, and set him back with respect to conditioning
• By the time he was able to resume basketball activities, he was substantially behind the curve
• Since we had what the coaches expected to be a very deep frontcourt, with two returning starters off of a final four team in Roberson / Coleman, the top frontcourt returnee, and two healthy backups in Chukwu / Thompson, the decision was made to redshirt him instead of having him squander a year of eligibility as the sixth guy in that deep rotation

Don't take my word for it:

Matthew Moyer discusses Syracuse basketball injury and timetable for full return

Him playing in the exhibition is completely irrelevant, because he was allowed to play without compromsing his ability to redshirt. There was no downside to him playing and getting at least a simulated game experience under his belt. It doesn't mean nor prove anything.

 

[two3zone]

It's a hot take because you are making a false attribution about why he was redshirting, and expressing the narrative that it was due to him not being good enough, while simultaneously completely [and conveniently] ignoring the documented fact that he got injured prior to his freshman season.

Here's what actually happened:

• Moyer got injured in July, during the summer session prior to his freshman year. The injury was a severe turf toe, which made it nearly impossible for him to play or run
• Matt spent quite a bit of time in a walking boot, which prevented him from working on his game that summer, playing pickup ball with his teammates, and set him back with conditioning
• By the time he was able to resume basketball activities, he was substantially behind the curve
• Since we had what the coaches expected to be a very deep frontcourt, with two returning starters off of a final four team in Roberson / Coleman, the top frontcourt returnee, and two healthy backups in Chukwu / Thompson, the decision was made to redshirt him instead of having him squander a year of eligibility as the sixth guy in that deep rotation

Don't take my word for it:

Matthew Moyer discusses Syracuse basketball injury and timetable for full return

Him playing in the exhibition is completely irrelevant, because he was allowed to play without compromsing his ability to redshirt. There was no downside to him playing and getting at least a simulated game experience under his belt.

He played in an exhibition for 9 minutes too and Jb said what I posted above about him playing 3 or 4 minutes a game.

Plays in a public scrimmage
Plays in an exhibition
Coach says he won't play ahead of 3 guys at his potion
Coach says he won't play more than 3 or 4 minutes a game.

Those 4 things tell me he was healthy enough if we needed a forward.

 

[rrlbees]

He'll get some backup minutes at SG, maybe 5 a half. And think you're right that he'll get some time at forward since we only have one backup (freshman). But i wouldn't sleep on Bas. I think Hughes is a lot better than his numbers at ECU (27% from 3), but Bas shot almost 50% from 3 in the EYBL - and he's 6'9 with pogo sticks. So I can see a scenario where Hughes comes in for OB for a few minutes and Bas spells MD.

I think hughes will come in for marek or brissett.

 

[RF2044]

He played in an exhibition for 9 minutes too and Jb said what I posted above about him playing 3 or 4 minutes a game.

Plays in a public scrimmage
Plays in an exhibition
Coach says he won't play ahead of 3 guys at his potion
Coach says he won't play more than 3 or 4 minutes a game.

Those 4 things tell me he was healthy enough if we needed a forward.

"If we needed one."

And the coaching staff didn't believe we did, due to the perception that we had 5 guys ahead of him who were all going to play. So given Moyer's injury setback, they redshirted him.

Perhaps the coaching staff would have made a different choice if they'd had a crystal ball informing them that Coleman / Chukwu would both get injured and miss 2/3 of the season each.

 

[OrangeYaGladi]

Hughes will play both the 3 and the 2. Probably more 3.

I generally like the idea of going small, when possible, but a concern about Hughes at 3 is definitely rebounding. Especially since Battle is not a great rebounding guard, despite his size.

 

[two3zone]

"If we needed one."

And we didn't, due to the perception that we had 5 guys ahead of him who were all going to play. So given the injury setback, they redshirted him.

Perhaps the coaching staff would have made a different choice if they'd had a crystal ball informing them that Coleman / Chukwu would both get injured and miss 2/3 of the season each.

I’m sure he wouldn’t have redshirted if they knew the center situation.

He was capable of playing the season and wasn’t injured enough to be held out of exhibitions and practice. He wasn’t going to play based on the roster as it stood when the decision to redshirt was made.

 

[reedny]

I think hughes will come in for marek or brissett.

You might be right, especially early. Bas may not be ready. But the minute he is, I'd prefer size at forward -- especially someone that can stretch the floor.

What's the word on Hughes in practice? He's certainly a thickburger at 215. Can he shoot? Can he scrap inside and rebound?