Will be extremely disappointed if there isnt some new blood at WR Saturday

[Ottoble]

Funderbuck wasn't on the injury report he needs some run this game IMO. At the end of the NW game him and Hunt seem to have a connection. I don't care if he can't practice well. Lets see if this guy is a gamer like Sales. Put him out there it can't get any worse.

My thoughts exactly Funderburk has to be a gamer. Everybody recruits (in this case Arkansas) based on Game film and he lit it up but now he can't beat out people in practice, hmmm Gamer.

 

[SUFan44]

I’m assuming they’re going with the players who practice best and even if Funderburke’s a gamer how do you justify going with him if he’s a poor practice player. I don’t know but I know it’s a quick way to ruin your team if you do.

I have to believe the only way these other kids get game time run is if they improve their practice play. (just speculating)

If fairness to Wales I think they've only thrown the ball to him 2 times.

So you keep running the same guys on the field who can't get it done and can't get open?

Maybe we are jumping the gun a bit with all of this - the team has lost to two Top 10 teams and the third loss was the season opener with a brand new coaching staff and new starters littered around the field. I'm willing to give everyone at the very least the next two games against teams more at our level.

But my basic point is this - games are what matter. I could give two craps about the best practice player in the history of Syracuse football. If he doesn't do it in the games, what is he worth? And how can you continue to run the same non-factors onto the field?

 

[rrlbees]

I agree but some kids are just gamers and some kids can practice well but choke on game day. It seems as if Hunt didnt practice well but it is obvious that he picks it up on game day. In watching Funder he sure as heck looks the part. Big Fluid with good hands. By all accounts Funder is a really good kid with a great attitude. At the end of the day it is about game production i say give him a shot

Gamer to me means someone who performs better in games than in practice. Not someone that is a slacker in practice plays hard in a game. There is a big difference.


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[rrlbees]

i would say that 99% of guys in the NFL have amazing practice habits.

and at some point...they ALL practiced hard in college.

just let the inmates run the asylum. yep, great idea.

Yep. Hey, if you got skills you don't have to work hard in practice.


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[TheCusian]

Coach said flat out that there won't be changes at WR this week.

 

[RMH44]

I’m assuming they’re going with the players who practice best and even if Funderburke’s a gamer how do you justify going with him if he’s a poor practice player. I don’t know but I know it’s a quick way to ruin your team if you do.

I have to believe the only way these other kids get game time run is if they improve their practice play. (just speculating)

If fairness to Wales I think they've only thrown the ball to him 2 times.

Agreed...the TE appears to be the forgotten position in McDonald's offense. Makes no sense to me.

As an a side to some of the remarks related to Kobena above...I never understood why a few here were high on this kid. By all accounts, I hear he's a very hard worker and one of the better WR blockers on the team. But he's not strong enough to beat press coverage and his hands are...well, lets just say ...questionable at best.

There has to be someone within the WR group that can get separation and make a play. Even if its a simple 7-10 yard curl or crossing route over the middle. I'd give Lewis and Cornelius a shot...certainly couldn't be any worse.

 

[SUFan44]

i would say that 99% of guys in the NFL have amazing practice habits.

and at some point...they ALL practiced hard in college.

just let the inmates run the asylum. yep, great idea.

Stick to your "playoff-bound" Giants, please.

 

[TBCuse11]

It has been proven thru what we have seen on the field that West and Kobena can not get open vs even mediocre D1 talent. They need to step aside. There is almost zero chance that Estime and Funderburke could do as bad or worse. I hate to constantly harp on the "Free Brisly" theme, but the kid needs to play.

Rumors that he will be returning kicks with Morris out are music to my ears. Our return game is crap anyways. This kid is electric, lets get him more than 1 touch per week.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

How did we determine that Funder was a gamer?

Because he caught a couple of balls against NW's scrubs in garbage time?

Funderburk = Mookie Jones. Everybody's favorite player.

 

[GoSU96]

5 games into the season a few things are coming clear, our linebackers have played pretty well, our Run D is pretty good, we found our punter for the forseeable future, Jerome Smith is still really good, our Secondary is a gigantic dissapointment and our WR's have been beyond abysmal.

I think it was clear going into the season that the loss of Lemon and Sales was going to be huge for this team. Myself and a few others raised the alarm over the summer that the returning WR core was probably our biggest issue compounded by the fact that the highest rated incoming Frosh (Cooper) was an academic casualty. Unfortunately as bad as I thought the WR situation might be, at this point its reaching Tim Lane/Rice Moss levels.

Losing Flemming now appears to have been a disasterous blow, we simply dont have any WR that can A. Get open and B. Catch the ball in tight situations (outside of Broyld). Based on all that its mystifying why guys like Funderburk, Lewis, Cornelius, and even one of the Frosh hasnt gotten some or more PT.

Right now were playing with a WR core that really has no #1 or even a #2 receiver. Clark has done a nice job as a Juco transfer who really is undersized for the Div 1 level but he was swallowed up in man to man press coverage last week and tends to dissapear for a few games. If Clark has a tendency to dissapear for a few games, Kobena goes MIA for whole stretches of the season. Outside of that one catch at PSU hes been pretty much non existent, even against Tulane and Wagner when Clark was putting on a show Kobena was no where to be found. I know a lot of people on this board were high on Kobena but at what point do we admit its simply not working and try someone else, the Kobena experience needs to end were not getting anyting close to what we need out of a #2 WR. That leads me to the two biggest dissapointments so far this year in the passing game West/Wales - Both of these guys have been pretty much invisible this year through 5 games. Wales might have two catches on the year and West has been held without a catch for at least 2 if not 3 games so far this year, totally unacceptable. To be fair play calling has certainly played a role, we are not throwing many deep passes and when we do we seem to want to throw them to West for what reason I have no idea. But at this point its clear West is not a #1 and that we have totally abandoned any type of medium range passing game that Hackett and Marrone finally went to in the second half of last year. What happened to all the 12-20 yard routes we were running last year? Now its a 5 yard pass or deep pass to a possession WR who is double covered.

At this point we need to see what guys like Funderburk, Cornelius, Moore, and others can bring to the table. Moore tore up NW for two series and then dissapeared of the face of the earth. Why is he not getting at least a couple series a half? At this point its clear were brining in 3-4Wr's next year so why waste a red shirt if Avant or another Frosh can make an impact. Most of all Funderburk and Estime need to play. I dont care how far in the doghouse Funderburk is or if we have to draw the play with a marker on Mackys back in the huddle for Estime to understand the route, we need to get playmakers and talent on the field. 65 yards passing with zero catches by a natural WR is totally unacepptable at any level less major Div 1. I am really hoping Mcdonald and Shafer realize the need to change things up and start showing some fresh faces at WR starting Saturday, I have had more then enough of the West, Kobena, Clark experiment.

This is an overreaction. Clemson is one of the best pass defenses in the country. The game plan and situations that they were throwing in didn't help the WR's or the So. QB in his second start.

Clemson is 17th in the country in passing yds allowed, 14th in pass . defense, 7th in ints, 16th in scoring defense, 5th in 3rd down defense, 1st in sacks, 2nd in tackles for a loss, 6th in redzone defense. They are really, really good.

Comparing these guys to Rice Moss and Tim Lane is silly.

Not counting Hunt 17 different guys have caught balls this year. There hasn't been much continuity. Being able to spread the ball around is a good thing but it could be there's been too much of a good thing.

I have no problem playing Funderburk, but there has to be a reason why he's been a DNP in last two games, which were two blowouts.

 

[GoSU96]

It has been proven thru what we have seen on the field that West and Kobena can not get open vs even mediocre D1 talent.

It has huh? West was working on a 17 game catch streak, that's an awful lot of less than mediocre teams in a row.

 

[Chip]

I think I've read about 15 times now that we didn't complete a pass to a WR in the Clemson game.

So I need a football lesson. Why is Broyld considered an H-back instead of a slot WR (the position he actually seems to line up in every single play). I thought an H-back was essentially a pass catching TE who just lines up one step behind the LOS, but next to the OT.

Is Broyld an H-back because that's what we decided to call him?

 

[GoSU96]

I think I've read about 15 times now that we didn't complete a pass to a WR in the Clemson game.

So I need a football lesson. Why is Broyld considered an H-back instead of a slot WR (the position he actually seems to line up in every single play). I thought an H-back was essentially a pass catching TE who just lines up one step behind the LOS, but next to the OT.

Is Broyld an H-back because that's what we decided to call him?

He's a WR, and so is Estime. That's who they practice with. There might be some wrinkles where they take a sweep now and then, but it's not like they are a wing back and running the ball half of their touches.

 

[SoBristol]

People make the comparison to Sales, but Sales had proven even as a frosh that he could get open and catch the ball. Not convinced that "not practicing well" was the full reason why he was on double secret probation, even though that is what the coaches said publicly.

As for Funderburke, is it not practicing hard (or attending meetings or classes) or when practicing, not getting separation, running good routes, making catches? I'd feel better about his prospects if those attending practices were reporting that he stands out when he does try.

West has shown enough that he stays in his role. But something needs to be done to get a player on the right side. Try something new -- Gulley? Cornelius?

 

[SoBristol]

He's a WR, and so is Estime. That's who they practice with. There might be some wrinkles where they take a sweep now and then, but it's not like they are a wing back and running the ball half of their touches.

Yes -- the difference is that Broyld is always in the slot, and not a true wide-out, and that is fine. It is the best way to use his size.
But Estime is a different story. He might be better as a true wide-out. Why keep him behind Broyld, when the need at wide-out is glaring?

 

[All4SU]

Again, I don't know why he doesn't play. But if it is because he doesn't work hard in practice, then I wouldn't play him regardless of the production we get. Just my opinion but that precedence can lead to making a bad situation worse.

Agree with this. If you push all of the players and let them know that every spot is up for grabs to the guys who demonstrate the effort in practice, and they still won't do it, then they have made that choice themselves.

 

[JeremyCuse]

This is an overreaction. Clemson is one of the best pass defenses in the country. The game plan and situations that they were throwing in didn't help the WR's or the So. QB in his second start.

Clemson is 17th in the country in passing yds allowed, 14th in pass . defense, 7th in ints, 16th in scoring defense, 5th in 3rd down defense, 1st in sacks, 2nd in tackles for a loss, 6th in redzone defense. They are really, really good.

Comparing these guys to Rice Moss and Tim Lane is silly.

Not counting Hunt 17 different guys have caught balls this year. There hasn't been much continuity. Being able to spread the ball around is a good thing but it could be there's been too much of a good thing.

I have no problem playing Funderburk, but there has to be a reason why he's been a DNP in last two games, which were two blowouts.

Its not an overreaction, Our two starting WR's are lucky to have 10 total catches between them in 5 games. West has been held without a catch in at least 2 if not 3 games and Kobena has been non existant since the PSU game. Clemsons D is good but lets not pretend its suddenly the 85 Bears, that was a putrid performance. I dont care if Lewis and Cornelius or Avant get PT, we need to change things up.

 

[KaiserUEO]

Stick to your "playoff-bound" Giants, please.

doesnt seem to be likely now, but doesnt make your statement any less Fn stoopid.

 

[JeremyCuse]

People make the comparison to Sales, but Sales had proven even as a frosh that he could get open and catch the ball. Not convinced that "not practicing well" was the full reason why he was on double secret probation, even though that is what the coaches said publicly.

As for Funderburke, is it not practicing hard (or attending meetings or classes) or when practicing, not getting separation, running good routes, making catches? I'd feel better about his prospects if those attending practices were reporting that he stands out when he does try.

West has shown enough that he stays in his role. But something needs to be done to get a player on the right side. Try something new -- Gulley? Cornelius?

You really think West has shown enough? You might want to check his stat line so far this year.

 

[upperdeck]

without seeing the all 22 view most of us here have little information to go by. how many actually watch the routes instead of the plays during a game.. on TV you mostly just follow. the ball. we have Wr who are running routes the coaches think they can handle.

Kobena does mostly single angle plays. usually just straight routes. he couldnt beat the press so never go up to speed

Clark does some short pass trying to get him in space , but against clemson he was running mostly long double move type routes, we didnt hold the ball long enough to even progress to his route. he was open quite a bit

West always gets pressed because he has no extra gear. he struggled getting separation, but had 2-3 chances last week and Hunt made poor throws including one INT that was underthrown.

Broyld usually gets the slot, and he usually gets no pressure. much easier to get off the line and find holes and he is the one getting open because of this

Estimie comes in and gets different routes than AB does even from the same position so he never gets chances to get down field.

Who knows what Funderbrook can do. maybe he wont block and in our scheme you have to. maybe he doesnt know the play book.. This isnt HS where you can dominate running the same play over and over.

I wonder about play design or execution.. Too many times we have routes where there is no decent check down or Hunt is way too slow to go to it passing up 5 yd gains for low chance throws. Too many times we have guys over lapping and bringing coverage too close.

we need more Hot reads. if teams want to give us pitch and catch 5-10 yd gains then check to that hot read and take it, screw the initial play. I think we overlook how long it took Nassib to learn this and there is a reason he didnt do it when Paulus was here.

Hunt in week 10 will probably be better than Hunt in start 2..

 

[Chip]

You really think West has shown enough? You might want to check his stat line so far this year.

I don't want to speak in absolutes because I don't know enough about the chicken or egg situation (QB or WR fault?), but it if someone were to say that West looked better last year because he had a #1 and #2 out there taking away attention, I think they'd have a pretty good argument.

Against 1A this year, in 4 games, West has 6 catches for 64 yards.

I hope I'm a jinx and he breaks out this weekend. But up until now...

 

[JeremyCuse]

I don't want to speak in absolutes because I don't know enough about the chicken or egg situation (QB or WR fault?), but it if someone were to say that West looked better last year because he had a #1 and #2 out there taking away attention, I think they'd have a pretty good argument.

Against 1A this year, in 4 games, West has 6 catches for 64 yards.

I hope I'm a jinx and he breaks out this weekend. But up until now...

I think your post is spot on. Not to sound like im trying to puff my chest out but before the season started I specifically mentioned that I thought West was going to have a realy hard time transitioning from a 3rd and fourth option to a #1 based on his skill set as mostly a possession guy. Unfortunately that has played out so far. I really hope we can do something either game plan wise or strategically to get him going.

 

[javadoc]

IMHO, prepare to be disappointed. The new blood you wish for won't be available until next year.

 

[JeremyCuse]

IMHO, prepare to be disappointed. The new blood you wish for won't be available until next year.

I agree, but if the peformance of our WR's continues (Unfortunately I think it probably will), Mcdonald and Schafer will be forced to make a change or at least give some PT to Lewis, Funder, Cornelius etc.

 

[SoBristol]

You really think West has shown enough? You might want to check his stat line so far this year.

Yeah, I know. His only stats were in one big game against Wagner.
I meant that West in his career here has shown something. At least he has some size to compete and is OK as a possession receiver -- but not a #1 type.
I would focus more on the other side and see if anyone else can get off the line against pressure better than Clark/Kobena. We won't find two replacements on our bench, so West plus who?