Will Cooney be redshirted?

[osullfam]

Not asking will he or won't he.
Asking, is it likely?

 

[CUSEBB1]

By the way the other payers gush about him and how good his 3 point shot is,I don't see how can can afford to redshirt him.If he is as deadly as the other players say his is,he could be the guy to get us back into a game or hits the game winner.

 

[DomeStranger]

By the way the other payers gush about him and how good his 3 point shot is,I don't see how can can afford to redshirt him.If he is as deadly as the other players say his is,he could be the guy to get us back into a game or hits the game winner.

Agreed. I think Cooney fills a void this team has had since Wes & Andy left us for the NBA. I think Jim has missed that and has been anxious to work a pure shooter back into the lineup. I really don't think he wants to wait another year for this.

I also think with the expectations of this year you may see JB go "All in". Why redshirt Cooney? So we have him 4 years from now? The way recruiting has been SU will reel in 2 five star shooters in that time frame (if they want to).

 

[tbonezone]

i know it's hard to grasp in this instant gratification age we live in but the basic redshirting concept remains do we need his 2 mpg as a frosh more than his 20+ minutes as a veteran senior leader ? we have 6 talented guards right now.two are true frosh and the PT simply isn't there .ya gotta look down the road sometimes.

 

[CUSEBB1]

i know it's hard to grasp in this instant gratification age we live in but the basic redshirting concept remains do we need his 2 mpg as a frosh more than his 20+ minutes as a veteran senior leader ? we have 6 talented guards right now.two are true frosh and the PT simply isn't there .ya gotta look down the road sometimes.

But do we have a guy that can consistantly hit the 3?I know we don't know if Cooney can or not.But his teammates seem to think he can.

 

[jordoo]

I hope that they redshirt him! I don't see how he gets any meaningful PT.

 

[DomeStranger]

i know it's hard to grasp in this instant gratification age we live in but the basic redshirting concept remains do we need his 2 mpg as a frosh more than his 20+ minutes as a veteran senior leader ? we have 6 talented guards right now.two are true frosh and the PT simply isn't there .ya gotta look down the road sometimes.

Did you see any outside jump shots go in the basket Tuesday? Neither did I. Unless MCW shows he can really shoot the ball well and sink outside shots I think we see Cooney. Even if it's 5-10 minutes a game when he's needed and 0-5 minutes a game when he's not needed.

I guess it all depends on if he is needed. If this team can play like a veteran team and not get themselves into big holes and not come out laying bricks then he won't be needed much. But if this team finds itself behind frequently and a shooter doesn't emerge then I think we'll definitely see him.

 

[tbonezone]

just to be clear i didn't say which of the frosh would be the best candidate for the red shirt. just my thoughts on the redshirt in general.

 

[hoopsupstate]

With the only apparant weakness on this team being consistant outside shooting, why would you redshirt your best three point shooter. People get too caught up with Dion's crazy drives to the basket, but he still is not a good shooter. When push comes to shove, Cooney will play if he can make shots. DITTO MCW.

 

[DomeStranger]

just to be clear i didn't say which of the frosh would be the best candidate for the red shirt. just my thoughts on the redshirt in general.

Ah ha! Got me!

You did say,"sometimes you have to look down the road".

I don't think JB is "looking down the road" ... he has one goal and knows this year he has the opportunity to make that goal. Redshirting a player is definitely not one of his goals. I think he is much more concerned with this years (and next years) team than the ones further off in the future.

But like you said the truth is, if JB doesn't have the need to bring you off the bench then you will be redshirting.

 

[dash-30-dash]

He red shirts. Jb is not going to take out one of the guys in front of trevor to put him in the game. Just not going to happen. If he doesn't red shirt, we will all regret it down the road.

 

[newmexicuse]

I do nothave a strong opinion on whether he should shirt or not. My only thoughts are that if he doesn't shirt he will be a monster as a fifth year senior. I would not want to see that entire season not happen if he is going to average less than 5 MPG & not be part of the rotation.

 

[SaintTristan]

if TC is going to get 15 mins a game and if he is as good of a shooter as peeps say, keep him. otherwise RS him. Right now we dont have a single "very good" shooter and would be great to have one. we have an average shooter and a below average shooter and need a 3 pt specialist.

really excited about this devo clone. hate the idea of wasting a yr of eligibility.

 

[nycfan]

Agreed. I think Cooney fills a void this team has had since Wes & Andy left us for the NBA. I think Jim has missed that and has been anxious to work a pure shooter back into the lineup. I really don't think he wants to wait another year for this.

I also think with the expectations of this year you may see JB go "All in". Why redshirt Cooney? So we have him 4 years from now? The way recruiting has been SU will reel in 2 five star shooters in that time frame (if they want to).

This is a great point that no one is really talking about. While Jordoo, Newmexicocuse and a few others have valid points that it is a bit of a waste if he doesn't play much, why not put it all on the table and go "all in" this year ??!!! When was the last time we were ranked top-5 pre-season? Last season, nobody could shoot. One would assume a few guys will be better from three this year, but will it be better enough? Cooney probably won't get major minutes in many games this year, but why not use him in key stretches and key spots in "crunchtime" (a specialist of sorts, as it would be a game by game thing). The counter argument would be how can you just bring in a freshman with no experience during "crunchtime". And this is a fair argument---JB would need to play him in a number of games throughout the season 10-15 min to get him the game experience (and this shouldn't be a problem in Nov/Dec). If Cooney's shooting gets us even 2-3 more wins (conservatively) that we wouldn't have had, wouldn't it be worth it? More importantly, by tourney time, he would have more experience---what if he helps us get a win in the BET or the Big Dance? Wouldn't that in itself be worth it? He wouldn't even need to be half as great as GMac was in the first half against Kansas---just a couple big threes could be the difference in some games. (maybe even one could be huge) Anyway I'm sold--every year it seems some people say "just think how good we'll be next year, or in two years". We don't have a Carmelo Anthony this year, and most likely don't have enough 3-point shooting to win 6 straight games in the Tourney without Cooney. So, let's put that "next year" talk aside this year for a change and as DomeStranger said, let's go "all in" right now!!!!

 

[General20]

Not asking will he or won't he.
Asking, is it likely?

The only way Cooney does not get a red shirt is if he refuses it. There is absolutely no good reason to waste a scholarship year of him if he is going to be fifth on the depth chart this year (which is what he will be).

We were not a great shooting team last year, but we still had a 27 win season, which should tell you that the right move is to play the best players, and not just plug a shooter into the equation simply because we need more shooting.

The fact that we were weak shooting last year does not mean we will be weak this year, I actually dont think we will. Joseph has made great strides shooting the ball every year he has been here and I dont see any reason why that wont continue. Fair seems to have made great strides in the shooting department, and Jardine and Triche have been working too hard not to improve.

Besides, if we need a shooter to come in for 5 or 10 minutes a game a hit a few shots we have Mookie to do that.

On the other hand, 5th year seniors are better than gold. Look at the SU team that got a 1 seed, they had two 5th years seniors and it payed off. Notre Dame last year got a 2 seed with limited talent but lots of red shirt experience.

To me it would be absolutely crazy to waste one of Cooney's four years at a time when there are no minutes for him.

 

[pfister1]

i know it's hard to grasp in this instant gratification age we live in but the basic redshirting concept remains do we need his 2 mpg as a frosh more than his 20+ minutes as a veteran senior leader ? we have 6 talented guards right now.two are true frosh and the PT simply isn't there .ya gotta look down the road sometimes.

The other aspect though is... is he good enough that he won't be here 5 years? He will play this season as a 19 year old (August 1992 d.o.b.). His fifth year of eligibility would be as 23 year old, not terribly old, but not young either. If he has pro aspirations will he be good enough to leave before his 5th year old eligibility has been completed or will he simply want to leave to get started trying to make a roster before he's used 5 years? If he is unlikely to stay and play for a fifth year then there is no reason not to burn the year of eligibility now. I don't know the answer, the coaches might. It would be more obvious with a guy like MCW who IMO would be an unlikely 5 year player.

 

[John]

Who was the last Cuse player that redshirted that wasn't injured?

It seems like in this day non big men rarely red shirt. You also have to factor in that he (could) get hurt later in his career which would be even worse. What if Andy or Arinze had redshirted his freshman year?

 

[dash-30-dash]

devo clone? Is Jb going to run tc out before his sr year too?

 

[slidingdown]

Who was the last Cuse player that redshirted that wasn't injured?

It seems like in this day non big men rarely red shirt. You also have to factor in that he (could) get hurt later in his career which would be even worse. What if Andy or Arinze had redshirted his freshman year?

Gorman?

 

[newmexicuse]

This is a great point that no one is really talking about. While Jordoo, Newmexicocuse and a few others have valid points that it is a bit of a waste if he doesn't play much, why not put it all on the table and go "all in" this year ??!!! When was the last time we were ranked top-5 pre-season? Last season, nobody could shoot. One would assume a few guys will be better from three this year, but will it be better enough? Cooney probably won't get major minutes in many games this year, but why not use him in key stretches and key spots in "crunchtime" (a specialist of sorts, as it would be a game by game thing). The counter argument would be how can you just bring in a freshman with no experience during "crunchtime". And this is a fair argument---JB would need to play him in a number of games throughout the season 10-15 min to get him the game experience (and this shouldn't be a problem in Nov/Dec). If Cooney's shooting gets us even 2-3 more wins (conservatively) that we wouldn't have had, wouldn't it be worth it? More importantly, by tourney time, he would have more experience---what if he helps us get a win in the BET or the Big Dance? Wouldn't that in itself be worth it? He wouldn't even need to be half as great as GMac was in the first half against Kansas---just a couple big threes could be the difference in some games. (maybe even one could be huge) Anyway I'm sold--every year it seems some people say "just think how good we'll be next year, or in two years". We don't have a Carmelo Anthony this year, and most likely don't have enough 3-point shooting to win 6 straight games in the Tourney without Cooney. So, let's put that "next year" talk aside this year for a change and as DomeStranger said, let's go "all in" right now!!!!

I am all for going "all in" personally, but the fact is that Jimmy really has never used anybody as a specialty player unless they good enough to make the rotation. A great example is Mookie, far & away the best pure shooter on our roster, yet he never sees the court except blow outs & garbage time no matter how badly our rotation players are shooting. I have zero confidence that things would be different with Cooney. Either the kid is good enough to make the rotation or not. If not, then he certainly wouldn't see the court in any important close games. So the bottom line is that you can play him as a scrub & waste a season or shirt him & have a dynamite 5th year senior down the road. If he plays and isn't part of the rotation he will not be given the opportunity to win those 2 or 3 games you allude to.

 

[HoustonCuse]

Couple things:
1. Jimmy has never used the "designated shooter" concept where a guy plays 8 minutes and is told to just hit some 3's. At least I can't remember him doing that. And if he wanted to do this there is Mookie.
2. Cooney will not play in Big East games.
3. Would love to have him redshirt and get this year's eligibility moved to a point where he's got 4 years of college experience under his belt. He could be a huge contributor.

All that said, I doubt he will be redshirted. JB won't be here for that 5th year and there is the "all-in" philosphy. But also - at the current rate of recruiting, there is all reason to think we'd have an even better guy a few years to take minutes from Cooney, or at least someone comparable. So with that logic, the redshirt doesn't buy you much and there is always the spectre of negative recruiting based on redshirting healthy guys.

 

[SU94]

i know it's hard to grasp in this instant gratification age we live in but the basic redshirting concept remains do we need his 2 mpg as a frosh more than his 20+ minutes as a veteran senior leader ? we have 6 talented guards right now.two are true frosh and the PT simply isn't there .ya gotta look down the road sometimes.

A highly intelligent post. ^^^^^

 

[DJR44]

No way do we redshift cooney. He can play, and he is more than a shooter as his handle is good. The guy to red shirt is southerland. We red shirted Gorman his senior year and next year kj leaves and there will be some mins at 3 for JS.

How about this for a lineup off bench. Coney, waiters, mcw, Keira, fair against a small quick team. Just an idea.

 

[asj410]

How about this for a lineup off bench. Coney, waiters, mcw, Keira, fair against a small quick team. Just an idea.

Not sure how effective the girl from Pirates of the Caribbean will be at anchoring that 2-3 zone

 

[arbitragegls]

...doesnt the player have a say in this...maybe Cooney does not want to red shirt...