Class of 2023 WR Johntay Cook (TX) TRANSFERRING TO SYRACUSE (5/1/25)

[OrangeFreek]

Not even 3 years ago most posters would have been drooling over the THOUGHT of a 5 star mentioning Syracuse let alone visiting.. Now 3 years later it is happening often and there is concern about someone’s past?? My humble opinion is everyone makes mistakes!! Some are small and some are massive! But if has learned or payed the price let that person move on and try and better themselves! Fran said in his first time at the mic he grew up from welfare and got his way out of it.. Why can’t a young athlete learn from that and find his way under fran? Seems to make the most logic.. giving someone a chance to prove they can change is not a bad thing at all!!

 

[dan7800]

Not even 3 years ago most posters would have been drooling over the THOUGHT of a 5 star mentioning Syracuse let alone visiting.. Now 3 years later it is happening often and there is concern about someone’s past?? My humble opinion is everyone makes mistakes!! Some are small and some are massive! But if has learned or payed the price let that person move on and try and better themselves! Fran said in his first time at the mic he grew up from welfare and got his way out of it.. Why can’t a young athlete learn from that and find his way under fran? Seems to make the most logic.. giving someone a chance to prove they can change is not a bad thing at all!!

To be fair, he was a 5* several years ago and has essentially done nothing since then. Dan Villari has basically twice the number of catches compared to him in the last 2 years.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Not even 3 years ago most posters would have been drooling over the THOUGHT of a 5 star mentioning Syracuse let alone visiting.. Now 3 years later it is happening often and there is concern about someone’s past?? My humble opinion is everyone makes mistakes!! Some are small and some are massive! But if has learned or payed the price let that person move on and try and better themselves! Fran said in his first time at the mic he grew up from welfare and got his way out of it.. Why can’t a young athlete learn from that and find his way under fran? Seems to make the most logic.. giving someone a chance to prove they can change is not a bad thing at all!!

He could and he also could not. I don't disagree with your premise, just not sure I want to the proving ground to be at Syracuse. If it was, well i would hope for the best as we all would. I as many just don't know if the juice is worth the squeeze on this one as the kid has pretty much been a non factor on the field as well

 

[David321]

Giving someone a second chance is consistent with the faith in which Fran professes to have is all about.

 

[Qbobby]

Not just giving, but helping with that second chance. Fran clearly sees himself as a mentor to young men and after talking to them, if he thinks he can help them AND get a talented played maybe he moves forward.

 

[JRHEETER]

I think some people need to get off of their high horse and remember that we all make mistakes.

Fran will do the investigating on these young men and determine if they are a good fit. If he thinks they are he will bring them in.

If he does not he will move on... two examples of this are Will Norman and Matthews from Rutgers.

Until I am proven otherwise, ill trust Coach Fran

 

[SUFan44]

I think some people need to get off of their high horse and remember that we all make mistakes.

Fran will do the investigating on these young men and determine if they are a good fit. If he thinks they are he will bring them in.

If he does not he will move on... two examples of this are Will Norman and Matthews from Rutgers.

Until I am proven otherwise, ill trust Coach Fran

To continue with this, I can give you with nearly 100% certainty that the men's basketball and football programs have brought kids in that had similar profiles as Cook and they have been successful at SU.

Not every one of them, but you're telling me Tommy Kane and DeShaun Williams were saints prior to their days at SU?

Kane beat up a cop while at SU, Williams was a scumbag throughout his time on the hill and punched the damn female mascot out on campus. There are many other examples of this.

Everything is much more public these days with social media. That's the biggest difference.

 

[orangemass]

To continue with this, I can give you with nearly 100% certainty that the men's basketball and football programs have brought kids in that had similar profiles as Cook and they have been successful at SU.

Not every one of them, but you're telling me Tommy Kane and DeShaun Williams were saints prior to their days at SU?

Kane beat up a cop while at SU, Williams was a scumbag throughout his time on the hill and punched the damn female mascot out on campus. There are many other examples of this.

Everything is much more public these days with social media. That's the biggest difference.

Didn’t stop Deshaun from hoisting up 3s

 

[CuseMan4]

Listen, I think Fran is a good football coach and a very solid guy. He knows what he is doing and I trust him. Sure there are certain criminal charges on someone that I don’t think should be allowed in a program. But that’s doesn’t mean people can’t change. Fran has been around those type of people his whole life where he grew up. Fran was able to be Successful and not be the product of his environment. Maybe some of these kids just need to be coached and mentored by someone that looks like them and comes from the same environment as them and know what it’s takes to get out of the environment. Now I’m not saying Fran is a miracle worker by any stretch. But ask yourself, how many P4 football coaches, look and come from the background that Fran does. It may be an uncomfortable topic but kids see that out of Fran. They know he’s a real one. Im not saying EVERY KID Fran brings in for a second chance is going to work but I always come back to this video.

 

[RF2044]

Listen, I think Fran is a good football coach and a very solid guy. He knows what he is doing and I trust him. Sure there are certain criminal charges on someone that I don’t think should be allowed in a program. But that’s doesn’t mean people can’t change. Fran has been around those type of people his whole life where he grew up. Fran was able to be Successful and not be the product of his environment. Maybe some of these kids just need to be coached and mentored by someone that looks like them and comes from the same environment as them and know what it’s takes to get out of the environment. Now I’m not saying Fran is a miracle worker by any stretch. But ask yourself, how many P4 football coaches, look and come from the background that Fran does. It may be an uncomfortable topic but kids see that out of Fran. They know he’s a real one. Im not saying EVERY KID Fran brings in for a second chance is going to work but I always come back to this video.

That's powerful.

And I think that the answer is somewhere in the middle. Some transgressions might be so bad, you just have to pocket veto. And others might warrant a second chance, with guardrails / conditions around what the expectations are.

The line is blurry.

 

[JKinPhilly]

That's powerful.

And I think that the answer is somewhere in the middle. Some transgressions might be so bad, you just have to pocket veto. And others might warrant a second chance, with guardrails / conditions around what the expectations are.

The line is blurry.

and it may end up being that for every 3 kids with questionable pasts that Fran brings on and ends up turning their life around there's 1 who doesn't and continues the behavior. The question will be what's the tolerance level for those swings and misses? Nobody is perfect.

 

[SUFan44]

Didn’t stop Deshaun from hoisting up 3s

Nor did it stop Jim Boeheim from giving him about 30 second chances.

I took a class with the guy - come final exam time, we all sit down, he gets up less than a minute after he gets the test, goes up and hands it in to the teacher and walks out.

Could be 100 different reasons why that might have happened, but the talent got him that many chances. It isn't unlike many other industries.

 

[SUfanNC]

and it may end up being that for every 3 kids with questionable pasts that Fran brings on and ends up turning their life around there's 1 who doesn't and continues the behavior. The question will be what's the tolerance level for those swings and misses? Nobody is perfect.

Unless it’s more misses than swings I don’t believe there is a tolerance.

In addition why would coach want a kid he feels would make it harder on him to succeed?

It’s hard enough to come in and turn a program around, last thing I imagine he wants is to babysit or have sour locker room.
Gotta have strong captains too

(the second part is not directed at you, just got my brain going)

 

[CuseMan4]

Unless it’s more misses than swings I don’t believe there is a tolerance.

In addition why would coach want a kid he feels would make it harder on him to succeed?

It’s hard enough to come in and turn a program around, last thing I imagine he wants is to babysit or have sour locker room.
Gotta have strong captains too

(the second part is not directed at you, just got my brain going)

Yes. It’s not all Fran. Fran has to trust the coaches around him, the players in the locker room and the leaders of the team when you bring in kids with a past like this. That’s why establishing a culture is so important.

Why do you think NFL teams, like the Chiefs, Bills and Eagles are willing to take in some risky talented players? They have an established culture, strong leaders, a strong locker room and coaches. If it doesn’t work you cut bait.

 

[RF2044]

and it may end up being that for every 3 kids with questionable pasts that Fran brings on and ends up turning their life around there's 1 who doesn't and continues the behavior. The question will be what's the tolerance level for those swings and misses? Nobody is perfect.

That's why I think the situation matters. Let's take Alton Robinson for example, who played here under Dino.
Kid was a big time recruit, who had a situation that seemed worse than it was, because of the nature of the allegations against him. By all accounts, prior to his incident, he was a good kid / good student. But he had some situation with his girlfriend where he thought she was cheating on him, he confronted her, snagged her phone from her to check her texts, and pushed her down into a bush. I think he might have even broken her phone.

So, in the heat of the moment, he suddenly has theft and assault charges, with the assault coming against a female. On the surface, that seemed bad. But then you discover that the ex-girlfriend eventually decided not to press charges, and that he had no prior issues.

And he paid the price; Texas A&M dropped him and he lost his scholarship. He had to go to a JUCO just to have a "chance." And Dino threw him a lifeline, but I think it was because of the other factors. It didn't absolve his dumb choice, but it was pretty clear that this was a good kid who made a bad choice and did something dumb. He didn't hit the girl, he didn't actually "steal" something -- but he deserved the penalties he got.

And he also deserved a second chance, instead of letting that heat of the moment / passion-driven mistake define the rest of his life.

Other recruits might not be as squeaky clean.

But the ones who are deserve at least a face-to-face discussion with Fran. Will a kid like that Georgia OT, who was one of a million guys @ Georgia who got caught driving over 100mph -- a dumb mistake, but in and of itself not a life defining mistake -- be willing to come here under no-tolerance conditions, like what Lequint Allen agreed to? If so, then probably not a bad thing to give a kid a second chance.

I'm not quite as sure about the UNC OT. He wasn't the one driving the car that crashed, but he was allegedly racing that car. So, in this gray area, is this someone we pocket veto, or does he warrant a second chance?

But burglary, like the one WR? Now we're really starting to get into the black area, off the "gray" part of the spectrum.

Tough decisions for a relatively new coach like Fran.

 

[wfschrec]

Fun fact my high school basketball coach was none other than Jeff Cornish. For those who know the ins and outs of the hoops program you know exactly who he was. I have heard some stories … whoa.

Suffice to say the sanctimonious ones in this thread would be burning jerseys if they knew but ignorance is bliss. Better to pretend these things didn’t exist or happen so they don’t compromise their superior morals.

 

[baggerbob]

Listen, I think Fran is a good football coach and a very solid guy. He knows what he is doing and I trust him. Sure there are certain criminal charges on someone that I don’t think should be allowed in a program. But that’s doesn’t mean people can’t change. Fran has been around those type of people his whole life where he grew up. Fran was able to be Successful and not be the product of his environment. Maybe some of these kids just need to be coached and mentored by someone that looks like them and comes from the same environment as them and know what it’s takes to get out of the environment. Now I’m not saying Fran is a miracle worker by any stretch. But ask yourself, how many P4 football coaches, look and come from the background that Fran does. It may be an uncomfortable topic but kids see that out of Fran. They know he’s a real one. Im not saying EVERY KID Fran brings in for a second chance is going to work but I always come back to this video.

For all the self righteous people on the board this needs to be pinned to the top of all the boards, and watched by everyone.

 

[bnoro]

Yes. It’s not all Fran. Fran has to trust the coaches around him, the players in the locker room and the leaders of the team when you bring in kids with a past like this. That’s why establishing a culture is so important.

Why do you think NFL teams, like the Chiefs, Bills and Eagles are willing to take in some risky talented players? They have an established culture, strong leaders, a strong locker room and coaches. If it doesn’t work you cut bait.

But no college team on the player side is going to be able to build an established, sustainable positive culture because of roster turnover. And if you have one year of weaker leadership, the dissenting voices can get loud quickly (literally look at our current basketball team) and it takes years to fix.

Furthermore, who are the strong senior leaders on this current roster? We don't have a ton of guys that put up stats and have been here for a while. That's what scares me in the transfer portal era.

 

[wfschrec]

But no college team on the player side is going to be able to build an established, sustainable positive culture because of roster turnover. And if you have one year of weaker leadership, the dissenting voices can get loud quickly (literally look at our current basketball team) and it takes years to fix.

Furthermore, who are the strong senior leaders on this current roster? We don't have a ton of guys that put up stats and have been here for a while. That's what scares me in the transfer portal era.

Ok it’s the same problem a Tennessee faces or an Alabama or Colorado but these teams all look at talent like this. You either have confidence that the coach can minimize the mistakes or he has no control over his locker room and based on recent events I’d say with our program it’s the latter not the former. No one is saying Fran won’t make mistakes to errr is human but he will minimize their impacts better than many. Hell DeBoer can’t keep players out of his daughters DMs … you think that would fly here?

 

[ImperialOrange]

That's powerful.

And I think that the answer is somewhere in the middle. Some transgressions might be so bad, you just have to pocket veto. And others might warrant a second chance, with guardrails / conditions around what the expectations are.

The line is blurry.

I don't think it's that blurry. Non violent offense vs violent...

But hey what do I know, people still buying Tyreek Hill jerseys and Brian Kelly still coaching

 

[RF2044]

I don't think it's that blurry. Non violent offense vs violent...

But hey what do I know, people still buying Tyreek Hill jerseys and Brian Kelly still coaching

I do -- see: the Alton Robinson example above. But I agree 100% that circumstances matter.

Lequint Allen got in a fight, and beat up a guy [who attacked him first, so it was probably self-defense]. Clearly a "violent offense" -- which is the approach that the student judicial process took with Allen.

But that approach was unfair, because of the circumstances of the altercation, and Allen's squeaky clean history prior to that event. And thankfully, he wasn't kicked out of school like the initial process disposition dictated, because it would have been too harsh of a penalty. Context matters.

That's why it isn't as clear cut as the name of the allegation in and of itself should determine the outcome.

 

[kcsu]

But no college team on the player side is going to be able to build an established, sustainable positive culture because of roster turnover. And if you have one year of weaker leadership, the dissenting voices can get loud quickly (literally look at our current basketball team) and it takes years to fix.

Furthermore, who are the strong senior leaders on this current roster? We don't have a ton of guys that put up stats and have been here for a while. That's what scares me in the transfer portal eraI I

But no college team on the player side is going to be able to build an established, sustainable positive culture because of roster turnover. And if you have one year of weaker leadership, the dissenting voices can get loud quickly (literally look at our current basketball team) and it takes years to fix.

Furthermore, who are the strong senior leaders on this current roster? We don't have a ton of guys that put up stats and have been here for a while. That's what scares me in the transfer portal era.

Its why a strong head coach and staff is critical.

 

[dasher]

I hope these last two posts make Baggerbob and Wfschrec feel better about themselves. I said earlier in this thread that this is my view but others are free to have theirs. Not to you two, the people who disagree with you are self righteous. Or we are pretending to have superior morals. I would agree with pinning this to the top of all of the boards. I know the way I want my school represented. I know the type of person I want representing my school.

 

[dasher]

I don't think it's that blurry. Non violent offense vs violent...

But hey what do I know, people still buying Tyreek Hill jerseys and Brian Kelly still coaching

Is drunk driving a violent offense? Or reckless driving?

 

[AngryOtto]

Is drunk driving a violent offense? Or reckless driving?

Not in the traditional sense but it should be. Everyone knows it’s dangerous to drink and drive and some could be killed.