Don't shoot the messenger... | Page 4 | Syracusefan.com

Don't shoot the messenger...

chugg21 said:
I know how...it resides in NJ.
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I was being facetious.
I don't have nearly the "woe is us" outlook on the football program, or the City of Syracuse. I believe we can and will have major success again- and HCDB is the prime candidate to make that happen. I also believe he WILL stay and finish the job, or at the very least lay a foundation, a la' Coach Mac, that his successor, a la' Coach P, can follow for future success.
JMHO
 
FrancoPizza said:
Then why is it hush-hush? We're not talking HIPPA here. What's the incentive to not disclose these details to the public? Is it so crazy to say, hey, we're breaking ground on the new roof in fall 2017 with a projected completion of all 3 phases by 2019?
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How deep of a hole are they digging to build this roof? ;-)

It's not that they don't know. It's because nothing is finalized and everything is subject to change. As long as Dino is happy with the progress (or lack there of) than so am I.
 
Much ado about nothing in this thread. Look guys, if a big time program comes calling, Babers is likely gone. SU won't be able to compete monetarily; whether it be compensation or facilities. There are many schools that can offer both and unfortunately, SU isn't one of them at the moment. We have seen the state of the Syracuse facilities. One of the biggest issues truly is the lack of fan support. SU is averaging 32,411 fans per home game in 2016 (65.8% of capacity). Preaching to the choir around here, I know, but it's the current state of the program. I'd hypothesize that even if SU offered him $4M-$5M a year, it'd merely be a band-aid to keep him around an extra year or two. I personally would hate to see Babers go, but I know that deep in my heart, I'd make the jump too.

Personally, I hope that the VaTech win, at a minimum, incites the community to flood the Dome for NC State. Babers is doing his part and it's time for the community to do its part. Babers preached "faith is belief without evidence." Well, now he's given the fence sitters evidence of what he can do given the appropriate amount of support. He's our best shot of seeing SU get back to national relevance.

The University is trying to upgrade the facilities, albeit, at a snails pace. If we nourish him with fans in the seats, show him what the Loud House is all about, we won't have to worry about a peer program snatching our golden ticket.
 
- Fan support: WIN and they will come
- As stated when he was hired, he's older and sometimes you get tired of moving/rebuilding
- His youngest daughter is at Syracuse for 3 more years
- We don't know what Wildhack, the new Chancellor, and the BoT will do
- He turned down an SEC job to come here
- How many P5 teams play half their games indoors in perfect conditions?
- In-between now and the end of next season, we'll know the details of what the dome overhaul will look like (if Babers doesn't already know or have way, way more info than people here)
- If he does well enough to earn an extension at the end of next season or middle of his 3rd - Wildhack and Babers will have a good idea of what the ceiling of the program is. That is a significant bargaining chip in negotiations with the BoT/Chancellor

No matter what - please, please stay with the same system.
 
Orangepace said:
Much ado about nothing in this thread. Look guys, if a big time program comes calling, Babers is likely gone. SU won't be able to compete monetarily; whether it be compensation or facilities. There are many schools that can offer both and unfortunately, SU isn't one of them at the moment. We have seen the state of the Syracuse facilities. One of the biggest issues truly is the lack of fan support. SU is averaging 32,411 fans per home game in 2016 (65.8% of capacity). Preaching to the choir around here, I know, but it's the current state of the program. I'd hypothesize that even if SU offered him $4M-$5M a year, it'd merely be a band-aid to keep him around an extra year or two. I personally would hate to see Babers go, but I know that deep in my heart, I'd make the jump too.

Personally, I hope that the VaTech win, at a minimum, incites the community to flood the Dome for NC State. Babers is doing his part and it's time for the community to do its part. Babers preached "faith is belief without evidence." Well, now he's given the fence sitters evidence of what he can do given the appropriate amount of support. He's our best shot of seeing SU get back to national relevance.

The University is trying to upgrade the facilities, albeit, at a snails pace. If we nourish him with fans in the seats, show him what the Loud House is all about, we won't have to worry about a peer program snatching our golden ticket.
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Great summary and I totally agree with you.
 
Orangepace said:
Much ado about nothing in this thread. Look guys, if a big time program comes calling, Babers is likely gone. SU won't be able to compete monetarily; whether it be compensation or facilities. There are many schools that can offer both and unfortunately, SU isn't one of them at the moment. We have seen the state of the Syracuse facilities. One of the biggest issues truly is the lack of fan support. SU is averaging 32,411 fans per home game in 2016 (65.8% of capacity). Preaching to the choir around here, I know, but it's the current state of the program. I'd hypothesize that even if SU offered him $4M-$5M a year, it'd merely be a band-aid to keep him around an extra year or two. I personally would hate to see Babers go, but I know that deep in my heart, I'd make the jump too.
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Ugh. Wow. I give up.

If Dino has success here/is happy and leaves for 5 million because a $2.5 million contract that escalates after 3 years is not enough, then 2 things:

#1. Screw that. See ya

#2. 80% chance he'll find the grass is not greener on the other side. THAT school will expect at least 10 wins a year with major bowls year in and year out. Anything less and he'll begin to feel the administration and fan base foot on his back

That's why it's foolish just to leave for more money

Facilities are no longer an issue.

Dino already took less to come here
 
TheCusian said:
- His youngest daughter is at Syracuse for 3 more years
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Has this been confirmed? I thought I remember Dino saying she would be on the volleyball team. But I checked the roster about a month ago and didn't see a Babers on it
 
clayman32 said:
Has this been confirmed? I thought I remember Dino saying she would be on the volleyball team. But I checked the roster about a month ago and didn't see a Babers on it
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The volleyball daughter is at Texas A&M
 
Cuse'91 said:
Baylor is the Duke of Texas...
Just as we are the Harvard of CNY...
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Disagree, we are the only p5 program in the state. we are the UT (Texas) of NY.
 
Orijinal said:
I knew that was going to be the reply. No. Not realistic. Fatalistic. Realism lies somewhere between unbridled optimism and devoted pessimism.

Of course, coaches who do well will always be offered other opportunities. This happens all over the country, not just at Syracuse. Our coach does not have to take the offer. Neither does any other coach. But we all say, "of course he will."

And for everyone who says that Dino will go: What you are really saying is that Syracuse should never expect to have prolonged success ever again. Deny it all you want, but that's what you are really saying.

"Oh. But we'll just keep our offensive coordinator and keep rolling." Oh really? What happens in the year he wins 8 games? He's gone too, right? Because Syracuse has nothing to offer their coaches, and coaches will always leave for somewhere else.
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Ok, before I respond to this, let me ask you a question..

Define success for me.

Consistent winning seasons of 7-5 with an occasional 8-4 or better?
Consistent 8-4s and 9-3s with an occasional 10-2 or better?
Consistent 9-3s or better?

You define success for me and then I'll respond to your post...
 
Forza Azzurri said:
Ok, before I respond to this, let me ask you a question..

Define success for me.

Consistent winning seasons of 7-5 with an occasional 8-4 or better?
Consistent 8-4s and 9-3s with an occasional 10-2 or better?
Consistent 9-3s or better?

You define success for me and then I'll respond to your post...
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My definition of success is consistent 8/9 win seasons with an occasional 10
 
Orijinal said:
My definition of success is consistent 8/9 win seasons with an occasional 10
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Schiano took over a Rutgers program that was 40-80 over its previous two coaches (11 seasons)...he had four losing seasons before he had his first winning season. In his remaining 7 seasons, he averaged 8 wins and 4.7 losses and was rewarded with the Tampa Bay job.

Coach Mac took over an SU program that was 44-66 in the seventies. He started off 24-21 and then went 36-10-1, averaging 9 wins a season over his last four years. He was rewarded with the Patriots job.

Since 2001, Syracuse has gone 59-99, averaging 4.5 wins and 7.5 wins a season. We've had 3 winning seasons in the last 13.

I think the pro ship has sailed because of the lack of success of Spurrier, Saban, Schiano etc...

But, if Babers is able to take our dumpster fire of a program, turn it around in a reasonable time frame and start churning out 8 and 9 win seasons on a regular basis, you really think that LSU or Georgia or Texas (or whatever really big time program happens to need a coach at the time) isn't going to come and offer the guy a multiple of what SU can afford to pay him?

And if they do, you don't think he is going to accept?
 
Forza Azzurri said:
Schiano took over a Rutgers program that was 40-80 over its previous two coaches (11 seasons)...he had four losing seasons before he had his first winning season. In his remaining 7 seasons, he averaged 8 wins and 4.7 losses and was rewarded with the Tampa Bay job.

Coach Mac took over an SU program that was 44-66 in the seventies. He started off 24-21 and then went 36-10-1, averaging 9 wins a season over his last four years. He was rewarded with the Patriots job.

Since 2001, Syracuse has gone 59-99, averaging 4.5 wins and 7.5 wins a season. We've had 3 winning seasons in the last 13.

I think the pro ship has sailed because of the lack of success of Spurrier, Saban, Schiano etc...

But, if Babers is able to take our dumpster fire of a program, turn it around in a reasonable time frame and start churning out 8 and 9 win seasons on a regular basis, you really think that LSU or Georgia or Texas (or whatever really big time program happens to need a coach at the time) isn't going to come and offer the guy a multiple of what SU can afford to pay him?

And if they do, you don't think he is going to accept?
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Money isn't everything. Plus, if you can get close to a number one of those schools offer AND he likes some of the other things going on here? Not a done deal.
 
I agree that money isn't everything - it is for some coaches but I don't think it is for this coach. I mean, how many millions is enough? If we offered ten years at two million yearly isn't that better than a three or four year gig? The stability alone is worth it.

Then again, Marrone brought his special book of plays with him and left with the top staffers so ... what do I know? I stupidly believed him. But in retrospect I think he sold out at his peak b/c he knew he couldn't do better with recruiting. Babers looks like he can recruit what he needs to be successful. Why not stick around and make this program your cash cow rather than sweat it out every year at a progrM like LSU?
 
No way Baylor would ever hire someone from the old coaching staff. They have to gut the system and bring in an entirely new crew. No one who worked for Briles will ever coach at Baylor.
 
I look at this a little differently: if we feel like our success is either Babers or bust then we will never be a long term success.

I care more about building the program. If we build the program up to the stature that we all know it's capable of sustaining, then living or dying by a single coach is no longer necessary. With some success other great coaches will say, 'if Dino can do it, so can I'. Once we reach that level of success, it becomes sustainable from coach to coach. Now you're attracting experienced HCs and not serving as the dumping ground for paying millions to assistant coaches who are HCs in training.
 
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