Dungey as the #2

[blue&orange]

Disagree completely. Do people not remember Drew Allen? What? You know the guy that looked like Dan Marino in practice and Dan Maffei in live action?

I'm sure this staff is well aware of that disaster. Get your guy and verify he's the guy with game action and go forward.

I agree. Shafer's first decision was to go with Drew Allen. Had Hunt been given some meaningful time the year before we may have avoid that rough start to the season. Can't spend the first month of next season struggling to pick a starter.

 

[Finwad32]

I'd be comfortable with Long. I'm a believer. I think a lot of people are selling him short. He's actually an excellent case study - most freshmen shouldn't see live game action at quarterback. They just aren't ready. We saw glimpses of what he could be last season, and we saw how much he struggled. Even if Dungey is way, way better, he's at the very same real risks Long was exposed to. What's he really learning by coming in when outcomes are pretty much decided just to hand the ball off.

Glad you asked this question about what it means to be game tested. Long played in real games, with outcomes in doubt, and lead his team to a road win. Along the way he threw 165 passes, completed 89 for nearly 1000 yards, and had 6 total TDs between passing and rushing.

Some consider what he did to be dubious in terms of speaking to his game readiness.

On the other hand, we have some posters suggesting that Dungey playing mop up duty as a glorified hand off expert for the running backs gets him "game ready" for next season.

Hmm.

Just to clarify, if I'm the OC and my futures getting snaps and burning a shirt, bet your ass he's running the full offense or close to it. I don't need to see him hand off. I need to see him read coverages and deliver in the face of pressure. But, you also bring him in slow, easy reads with comfortable plays at first and then dive deeper.

 

[jkmac]

The most important part about being number 2 is being involved in the game planning and reps of your system. The other 2 qb's will split scout team reps running the opponents offense. It's obvious Dungey is their guy. You also need separation for Culpepper. Very few quality QB's will sit for 4 years and wait their turn. Very smart in my opinion.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This is what I honestly believe.

This staff is being constantly told they're on the hot seat, might not even get a 4th year. So why stash what could be the future for what would be your 8th year as a staff.

The way I see it is, if he's your guy moving forward, absolutely play him when you can. Now 20 throws for the year in mop up? That's not a good decision. But if that number doubles, then without a doubt get him work.

5 throws a game and 10-15 snaps, every day I'll take it.

Does playing Dungey this season help them win now and ensure year 4? I have a hard time buying the answer is yes if playing him means mop up duty handoffs.

Nassib's redshirt freshman season makes sense as the model to me. Heck, I wanted to see more of him back then. That kind of playing time got him ready to start, I have no doubt. If that's what Dungey gets under his belt, I'm on board. If Hunt goes down and its like Long last season, where they feel Dungey is the best option to win, that's a completely different set of circumstances and obviously you play him.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Just to clarify, if I'm the OC and my futures getting snaps and burning a shirt, bet your ass he's running the full offense or close to it. I don't need to see him hand off. I need to see him read coverages and deliver in the face of pressure. But, you also bring him in slow, easy reads with comfortable plays at first and then dive deeper.

I'm gonna go Cusian here and say we just don't know what Lester is going to do, so we can't really judge that, now can we?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The most important part about being number 2 is being involved in the game planning and reps of your system. The other 2 qb's will split . . . . . team reps running the opponents offense. It's obvious Dungey is their guy. You also need separation for Culpepper. Very few quality QB's will sit for 4 years and wait their turn. Very smart in my opinion.

So let me get this straight:

Dungey is the future.

We've given up on Long.

We've given up on Wilson.

Even though Dungey is the future, Culpepper is the better future.

We need less potential years of Dungey starting in order to get more years of Culpepper starting.

Also, Shafer has no guarantee he's back next season, so the future is now.

The future is mop up duty hand offs.

...

 

[RF2044]

Does playing Dungey this season help them win now and ensure year 4? I have a hard time buying the answer is yes if playing him means mop up duty handoffs.

Nassib's redshirt freshman season makes sense as the model to me. Heck, I wanted to see more of him back then. That kind of playing time got him ready to start, I have no doubt. If that's what Dungey gets under his belt, I'm on board. If Hunt goes down and its like Long last season, where they feel Dungey is the best option to win, that's a completely different set of circumstances and obviously you play him.

Agreed, across the board. If Hunt really falters--yeah, force feed the kid minutes to infuse him with as much of an immersion as possible, and cut bait to build for the future.

But blow a year of eligibility for a few token snaps? Hope they don't do that. Regardless, here's hoping that Hunt is up to the challenge this season.

 

[texascpa]

Complete bunk if he is just getting a few mop up / handoff snaps.

BFD, he gets some film handing off the ball behind our third string OL.

AGAIN, I don't dispute that it might accelerate his deveopmental curve to some small degree, but is it worth pissing away an entire year of eligibility over? Nope.

It's not just handing it off. It's getting real-game experience getting calls from the sideline, managing the huddle, insuring the formation is correct for the play with a timer on you, reading the defense before the snap, going live against 11 guys who want to pound you into the dirt. It's more than the passing, it's building confidence from real game experience.

 

[orangeinohio]

Hopefully Hunt plays so well that Dungey becomes our 4th quarter closer.

Mariano Dungey

 

[RF2044]

It's not just handing it off. It's getting real-game experience getting calls from the sideline, managing the huddle, insuring the formation is correct for the play with a timer on you, reading the defense before the snap, going live against 11 guys who want to pound you into the dirt. It's more than the passing, it's building confidence from real game experience.

He can get much of the same experience in practice, running with the 1's [if he is really the backup QB] and being heavily involved in game prep every week as the #2.

And by the end of the first quarter of his first game next year, he'll have the same level of experience that he'd have without burning an entire year of eligibility.

I also think that many of you are SIGNIFICANTLY underestimating the benefit of using that first year to mature physically as a function of being immersed in a collegiate strength and conditioning program, using that extra year to master the offense, to say nothing of having the college game slow down after a year of practice.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

It's not just handing it off. It's getting real-game experience getting calls from the sideline, managing the huddle, insuring the formation is correct for the play with a timer on you, reading the defense before the snap, going live against 11 guys who want to pound you into the dirt. It's more than the passing, it's building confidence from real game experience.

They did none of this when they were starting QBs in highschool?

 

[texascpa]

They did none of this when they were starting QBs in highschool?

HS != College. His HS != Syracuse.

Honestly, either way, I'm fine with, I just think we focus too much on passing and not enough on all of the other responsibilities a QB has.

 

[orangehomer]

Complete bunk if he is just getting a few mop up / handoff snaps.

BFD, he gets some film handing off the ball behind our third string OL.

AGAIN, I don't dispute that it might accelerate his deveopmental curve to some small degree, but is it worth pissing away an entire year of eligibility over? Nope.

if he is the second best QB on the roster than he should play. I don't care about a presumed fifth year that is 4 years away. if we cant recruit another qb in that period than none of this matters anyway.

 

[RF2044]

if he is the second best QB on the roster than he should play. I don't care about a presumed fifth year that is 4 years away. if we cant recruit another qb in that period than none of this matters anyway.

If he is the second best QB on the roster than he SHOULDN'T play. Our goal is to get to 6 wins and qualify for bowl eligibility, not to get next year's potential starting QB a few token snaps.

And given all of the pessimistic prognostications about how the season is going to unfold, please point me toward all of the games where we're going to be able to run out our 2nd string QB to get all of these developmental snaps.

Honestly...

 

[Jake]

They did none of this when they were starting QBs in highschool?

If you can't decipher the difference between HS and college, there's no sense continuing this conversation.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Disagree completely. Do people not remember Drew Allen? What? You know the guy that looked like Dan Marino in practice and Dan Maffei in live action?

I'm sure this staff is well aware of that disaster. Get your guy and verify he's the guy with game action and go forward.

We'll know that Dungey as a true freshman is 5th year senior Drew Allen thanks to mop up handoffs?

WHERE THE HELL IS THE LOGIC IN ANYTHING ANYBODY NOT NAMED RF OR OIG IS SAYING IN THIS THREAD?

 

[ImperialOrange]

I love it. The coaching staff, and us fans, don't have time to worry about a potential 5th year at the moment. They need to do what gives them the best chance to win now and frankly the fan base needs that from them. We need any player that can help us now to do so. If they do so, we'll have deeper recruiting classes following them up to play for the winning program they helped build.

Realistically Dungey could potentially see time in our first 3 games. The only real point of contention would be if he looks better than Hunt. Tricky locker room but aside from that would be a great problem to have. We have an idea of Hunts ceiling so ideally he plays to the best of his ability and doesn't allow a true frosh to take his spot. If he doesn't and Dungey looks the part then time to go all in.

 

[anglerman]

How'd that work out for Johnny Morant? We need to be more strategic with our long term assets.

If Hunt gets hurt, that's a different story.

Why the foolish comments about morant? many many players have played as true freshman. What does Moarnt have to do with this situation?

 

[OrangeXtreme]

If he is the second best QB on the roster than he SHOULDN'T play. Our goal is to get to 6 wins and qualify for bowl eligibility, not to get next year's potential starting QB a few token snaps.

Honestly...

And if Hunt gets injured again...

are you OK with playing out the string with Wilson & Long and forgetting about bowl eligibility?

Or is Shafer still coaching for his job, and injuries won't buy him another pass?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

If you can't decipher the difference between HS and college, there's no sense continuing this conversation.

If you can't decipher the difference between potentially having Nassib's record breaking senior season and our only good offense in a decade from the scant possibility of slightly increasing Dungey's readiness for 2016 thanks to mop up duty handoffs, I can't help you.

 

[Chip]

Use him if you need him. If it's late in the season, bowl is out and he hasn't seen the field then I would save the redshirt. He's still getting practice reps. We've had QBs here who were successful as starting redshirt freshmen.

Of course, they were a little higher ranked as recruits but still. Sounds like the job is basically his next year. Don't see who would get in the way. Then you redshirt Culpepper and create some space between them.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

HS != College. His HS != Syracuse.

Honestly, either way, I'm fine with, I just think we focus too much on passing and not enough on all of the other responsibilities a QB has.

Well, that's fair. I think we don't focus on our QBs passing enough. :bat:

 

[RF2044]

Why the foolish comments about morant? many many sprayers have played as true freshman. What does Moarnt have to do with this situation?

Why the foolish comment about my comment being foolish?

What was foolish was pissing away a highly rated player's year of eligibility for only a handful of snaps that came in the first few games of the season. Remember how great his fourth year was, when Morant posted all conference numbers? Just imagine how much better that fifth year would have been than the first year our coaches flushed down the toilet.

And then project what blowing a year of Dungey's eligibility over a few token snaps would mean vis a vis a player who could be prospective four year starter not having that extra year.

THAT'S what Morant has to do with this situation.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I love it. The coaching staff, and us fans, don't have time to worry about a potential 5th year at the moment. They need to do what gives them the best chance to win now and frankly the fan base needs that from them. We need any player that can help us now to do so. If they do so, we'll have deeper recruiting classes following them up to play for the winning program they helped build.

How does having Dungey come in for mop up duty handoffs help us win now?

 

[CUSU]

The only thing that I can say, is there is nothing like in game experience. It's different commanding a huddle in a game than in practice. It's different reading a defense where you don't your what you're going up against. Its different when thousands of people are watching.

I agree on not wasting his shirt so he can take a knee, but if he is going to run through some plays and be out for a few series it is most definitely worth it. It's about a sense of comfortableness, especially at QB, that leads to success. Some of that is natural, but some of it is also learned. If that gives Dungey any sort of jump in 2016, that is why you do it.