ACC Brand - Refs - Protecting the Brand

[Capt. Tuttle]

The message to the players should always be "don't put yourself in a position for a ref to make a call" in any road game against a higher ranked team. The Fuentes call unfortunately was exactly that, as was the personal foul after that.

The PI was bad but Clemson would've been playing a different style of defense if they were up 3 instead of 6 on that last drive.

Well, except didn't Clemson put him in position, with an illegal block in the back, shoving him into QB2.

 

[Cuseregular]

I have come to the conclusion that the ACC Refs are protecting Clemson so they can qualify for the playoffs. Clemson brings a lot to the conference and the conference wants Clemson in the playoffs. I had to turn off the game on Saturday after the non call on Shader on the out of bounds Play. There was no way the refs were going to allow SU to win and I wasn't going to watch it. This call came after a movement call on SU where the only motion was the Center moving his head to look between his legs so he could hike the ball. One of the worst calls I have ever seen. I am a retired auditor and in my business we called it "Cooking the Books".

Roger spot on. I too right during the drive with the two calls on us (one bs on 99) that led to their TD, well I grabbed the dog left the house and drove around in the countryside around the lake for over an hour until I figured the game was over.

Having seen this too often (and experienced it as well as noted above), I knew the (likely) outcome and just was not gonna subject myself to it. At least not for a game of this magnitude and all it’s national implications. When I got back from the drive I asked the wife did we lose 31-21 or 27-21?

Just drive ya nuts, that’s why I started the grievance thread! Lol. On to ND

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Eh. Both things can be true. The fallacy is that refs "played a small role"... they extended the two drives that led to scores when Clemson was desperate. It's a joke.

Absolutely.

I do think they would have found a way to score a couple TDs even without those calls.

Who knows though that drive after the 3rd and 25 might have ended on points for us. Their QB play wasn't good we just needed ours to make a couple more plays and we win. DJU was horrible and Klubenik got every break imaginable and was up against a team that had gone into a shell and stopped trying to score he didn't have to answer any touchdowns or points from us when he came onto the field.

I love Schrader's toughness but you can't tell me that all of our big games this year UVA, Purdue, NC State, and Clemson our QB couldn't have completed more throws or done more. Better QB play and we could have won all of those games by 30+. Saturday was basically the same thing as watching a star guard in hoops play hero ball and jack up contested shots for an entire half refusing to pass to a teammate how often he called his own number.

 

[Scooch]

Nope. He was escorting the player out of bounds and got knocked into. If he lets him tip toe down the line he steals yards. It's bogus.

I said this the other day, but one can't say that Fuentes was "shoved" and that caused the hit OOB, and then claim the end zone PI wasn't PI. Either putting your hands on someone's back matters, or it doesn't.

 

[RF2044]

Absolutely.

I do think they would have found a way to score a couple TDs even without those calls.

Who knows though that drive after the 3rd and 25 might have ended on points for us. Their QB play wasn't good we just needed ours to make a couple more plays and we win. DJU was horrible and Klubenik got every break imaginable and was up against a team that had gone into a shell and stopped trying to score he didn't have to answer any touchdowns or points from us when he came onto the field.

I love Schrader's toughness but you can't tell me that all of our big games this year UVA, Purdue, NC State, and Clemson our QB couldn't have completed more throws or done more. Better QB play and we could have won all of those games by 30+. Saturday was basically the same thing as watching a star guard in hoops play hero ball and jack up contested shots for an entire half refusing to pass to a teammate how often he called his own number.

Wasn't Shrader ranked something like 4th nationally for his performance on Saturday?

I too wish he could have done a little more. But he was also facing one of the top defenses [stated with no trace of hyperbole] in college football.

 

[Cuseregular]

Wasn't Shrader ranked something like 4th nationally for his performance on Saturday?

yep, the dude wants Tom brady back there. Well make that younger Tom brady...

 

[Orangezoo]

Absolutely.

I do think they would have found a way to score a couple TDs even without those calls.

Who knows though that drive after the 3rd and 25 might have ended on points for us. Their QB play wasn't good we just needed ours to make a couple more plays and we win. DJU was horrible and Klubenik got every break imaginable and was up against a team that had gone into a shell and stopped trying to score he didn't have to answer any touchdowns or points from us when he came onto the field.

I love Schrader's toughness but you can't tell me that all of our big games this year UVA, Purdue, NC State, and Clemson our QB couldn't have completed more throws or done more. Better QB play and we could have won all of those games by 30+. Saturday was basically the same thing as watching a star guard in hoops play hero ball and jack up contested shots for an entire half refusing to pass to a teammate how often he called his own number.

Iyiyi

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Wasn't Shrader ranked something like 4th nationally for his performance on Saturday?

I too wish he could have done a little more. But he was also facing one of the top defenses [stated with no trace of hyperbole] in college football.

He should have gone away from calling his own number and running so much he had a great game early and got a us a nice lead.

Our D gave up almost nothing they scored on their first TD drive and then nothing until the 3rd quarter.

 

[Orangezoo]

This whole discussion speaks to why the economics/politics of college football hinder the sport. The fact that there is incentive for fair play to be impacted for jockeying of power between conferences is so frustrating.

 

[djcon57]

Let’s say they don’t call the PI

5 plays, 0 yards
4 plays, 24 yards
3 plays, 7 yards
3 plays, -4 yards
4 plays, 15 yards
3 plays, 3 yards

folks really want to hammer were def gonna win if they don’t call the PI?

(The PI was a terrible call, fwiw)

 

[RMH44]

He should have gone away from calling his own number and running so much he had a great game early and got a us a nice lead.

Our D gave up almost nothing they scored on their first TD drive and then nothing until the 3rd quarter.

Your passive/aggressive ripping of GS is tiresome.

 

[Orangezoo]

Let’s say they don’t call the PI

5 plays, 0 yards
4 plays, 24 yards
3 plays, 7 yards
3 plays, -4 yards
4 plays, 15 yards
3 plays, 3 yards

folks really want to hammer were def gonna win if they don’t call the PI?

(The PI was a terrible call, fwiw)

Well it was third and 11 and forced the final drive to be a TD vs a field goal.

The no call on Shrader was a field position loss at minimum.

The call on Fuentes where pushed was worth 6. From a defensive standpoint its more than plausible. Not absolute but very plausible.

 

[djcon57]

This whole discussion speaks to why the economics/politics of college football hinder the sport. The fact that there is incentive for fair play to be impacted for jockeying of power between conferences is so frustrating.

I get what you are saying as far as College Football. This discussion goes on on every sport, though. Small market teams complain about calls. Just 3-4 years ago Saints fans SUED THE NFL over a missed PI call because the NFL "wanted the Rams to win". I do believe there is some truth in the the general bias, I personally don't believe these refs are like WWF evil refs missing pins and cheating. It's more fixed in that they want close games, especially NFL Prime time games

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Your passive/aggressive ripping of GS is tiresome.

I did not mean to rip him I am frustrated with the loss he played a great game early. We had a big edge at QB Saturday their QBs weren't good. We should have won that game. I'll delete my post he's having a very good season.

 

[djcon57]

Well it was third and 11 and forced the final drive to be a TD vs a field goal.

The no call on Shrader was a field position loss at minimum.

The call on Fuentes where pushed was worth 6. From a defensive standpoint its more than plausible. Not absolute but very plausible.

Agreed on the impact of Fuentes call, which I've said, is called 95% of the time.
...and the GS no call was to me, the biggest impact in the game, in that, it was the worst missed call and we didnt get to run clock or poss score.

I'm strictly talking of the PI. I don't believe it ultimately changed the outcome of the game. If we need only 3, they change their defensive scheme. They were dropping back a ton due to the time crunch

 

[Orangezoo]

Agreed on the impact of Fuentes call, which I've said, is called 95% of the time.
...and the GS no call was to me, the biggest impact in the game, in that, it was the worst missed call and we didnt get to run clock or poss score.

I'm strictly talking of the PI. I don't believe it ultimately changed the outcome of the game. If we need only 3, they change their defensive scheme. They were dropping back a ton due to the time crunch

Yeah. I hate the review delays but I think it's time personal foul calls around late hits are reviewed. If the officials can't objectively or consistently referee a game with massive implications then something has to change.

There are just way too many scenarios where a home favorite with conference money/prestige on the line is impacted in favor of said favorite.. then of course all the qualifiers come out excusing it but truth is it happens a lot.

 

[djcon57]

Yeah. I hate the review delays but I think it's time personal foul calls around late hits are reviewed. If the officials can't objectively or consistently referee a game with massive implications then something has to change.

I would rather they examine the yards and/or auto 1st down attached. 15 yards and auto 1st on what would be a 4th and 20 is illogical.

Maybe give them 10 yards and count the down or something like that.

 

[Orangezoo]

I would rather they examine the yards and/or auto 1st down attached. 15 yards and auto 1st on what would be a 4th and 20 is illogical.

Maybe give them 10 yards and count the down or something like that.

I still think both make sense but the auto first downs are stupid I concur.

 

[Orangeman]

Well it was third and 11 and forced the final drive to be a TD vs a field goal.

The no call on Shrader was a field position loss at minimum.

The call on Fuentes where pushed was worth 6. From a defensive standpoint its more than plausible. Not absolute but very plausible.

Don't think that's right. They got the closing FG on this drive.

 

[Orangezoo]

Don't think that's right. They got the closing FG on this drive.

Yes which turned it into a 6 pt game vs 3 if they punted.

 

[Orangeman]

Yes which turned it into a 6 pt game vs 3 if they punted.

Misread your post correct.

 

[Orangezoo]

Misread your post correct.

All good

 

[Willy75]

Let’s see if SU discloses the ACC’s response to Dino submitting the two out of bounds calls for explanation. If they claim “judgement calls” that’s evidence to me something is fishy.

 

[RobVTX]

If we didn't play scared the entire second half and gave the ball to our all american RB we win the game.

The refs played a small role but we did this to ourselves. Sick of the excuses.

You should be the coach!

 

[RobVTX]

You should be the coach!

You and Phat Orange both must have been hacked.