ACC, PAC-12, and BIG alliance / conference realignment

[TexanMark]

The last thing I want is more southern schools. SMU does nothing for me and them paying their way in doesn't seem like a sustainable long-term strategy.

The B1G isn't walking through the door with an invitation for SU

UConn is fine to add with a Notre Dame deal at a huge discount.

Olympic Sports fully in, FB gets a 5 games a year scheduling agreement until they prove they are a legit FB program.

Temple is a train wreck in a bad area

UB is possible if the Bills ever leave (not happening IMHO)

UMass is a joke

Army and Navy aren't comfortable playing P4 Sports

 

[sam]

Who would you add that is available?

UConn makes sense. Gives us a regional rival and closes the door on the Big 12 moving into the northeast. I think they were on deck for invite if not for the Pac 12 dissolving but who knows? SMU is terrible at basketball and mediocre at best at football.

 

[CousCuse]

FB gets a 5 games a year scheduling agreement until they prove they are a legit FB program.

They are going to win a lot of games this year, IMO.

 

[TexanMark]

They are going to win a lot of games this year, IMO.

Winning games vs a bad schedule (8 layups) is possible but will the fans comeback? Maybe

 

[dasher]

UConn makes sense. Gives us a regional rival and closes the door on the Big 12 moving into the northeast. I think they were on deck for invite if not for the Pac 12 dissolving but who knows? SMU is terrible at basketball and mediocre at best at football.

UConn makes little sense right now. The football schools would revolt.

 

[CousCuse]

Winning games vs a bad schedule (8 layups) is possible but will the fans comeback? Maybe

Have to think the opening night game against NCST will sell out. That is a very interesting game.

 

[dasher]

They are going to win a lot of games this year, IMO.

You have said that in the past. What good teams can they beat? If they schedule a bunch of patsies, sure. But for schools in the P-4, they are the patsy.

 

[baggerbob]

FSU does not want bigger cuts based on performance. They feel this is totally unfair.

They want far more because they are FSU. They paid a consultant who told them they deserve far more than anyone else, and dammit, they are going to get it or they will hold expansion up and screw the rest of the conference out of $5-10 million a year per year per school.

Personally, I think FSU should either agree to expansion or get booted out of the conference.

They cheat more than anyone, they treat the rest of the conference like dirt and only care about themselves. They need to decide if they want to be in a conference. If they don’t, kick them out now.

They wouldn't find a good landing spot, the SEC has better teams, and the Big has no use for them.

 

[CousCuse]

You have said that in the past. What good teams can they beat? If they schedule a bunch of patsies, sure. But for schools in the P-4, they are the patsy.

Well, they have NCST, BC and Duke. That will be their measuring stick.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Reading comprehension isn't your strong point. Go through this thread. I never said they deserve special treatment. What I did say is that they've done their part for the ACC and pointed out their success. That is why they believe they deserve more. Clemson and FSU are the only things this league has when it comes to football until Miami gets their act together.

To the person who said 10 years is eons ago, no it isn't. For the elite programs, it might feel that way. For everyone else, they would ride that championship until they can't anymore. Most sports fans would trade a decade of being middling if it meant a championship. No one cares about good seasons if you don't win at the end.

So the League should prioritize FSU monetarily and give them a better chance than their conference teammates regardless of their performance failures? You do realize (or do you?) that FSU was 10-3 last year and all 3 losses in the regular season were against other ACC teams. Then they lost in the Cheez It Bowl to 6-6 Big 12 Oklahoma.

The past 8 seasons (2015 through 2022) their in conference ACC record is 32-32 (4-4 average) and then even adding their 8-0 conference records back in 2013 and 2014, the past 10 years, they still have just a 48-32 conference record (4.8wins -3.2 loss average). So you believe that their fellow league teams should help prop them up, reward them, for mediocrity and punish their fellow conference teams for their performances against them? You think they deserve more money from the ACC than the other ACC teams just to compete? Hmmm

 

[djorange1989]

Until I see otherwise I am convinced that FSU and a few other schools will continue to vote against any move that may strengthen the conference. Except if ND were forced into joining a conference, meaning the ACC, since that would be a big cash cow. These schools don’t want to improve the ACC. That makes it harder to bail. They want to keep causing trouble and blocking progress so that Phillips and the non-troublemaking university presidents finally get sick of them and are more willing to negotiate a more flexible exit.

 

[MikeSU02]

So the League should prioritize FSU monetarily and give them a better chance than their conference teammates regardless of their performance failures? You do realize (or do you?) that FSU was 10-3 last year and all 3 losses in the regular season were with other ACC teams. Then they lost in the Cheez It Bowl to 6-6 Big 12 Oklahoma.

The past 8 seasons 2015 through 2022) their in conference ACC record is 32-32 (4-4 average) and that even adding their 8-0 conference records back in 2013 and 2014, the past 10 years, they still have just a 48-32 conference record (4.8wins -3.2 loss average). So you believe that their fellow league teams should help prop them up, reward them, for mediocrity and punish their fellow conference teams for their performances against them? You think they deserve more money from the ACC than the other ACC teams just to compete? Hmmm

Agreeing.

Stanford can purchase FSU many times over if they really wanted to.

FSU is in no position of power right now.

None.

The fact they have *Drew Weatherford* speaking on their behalf is hilarious.

If FSU is so coveted, the B1G or SEC would accommodate them to help their transition out, financially.

But they aren’t.

This isn’t hard. This is the cool kid in high school thinking they are still cool afterwards.

 

[Orangefizz]

If FSU wants to pay $$$ to leave early, they are welcome to do so. We can always backfill with UCF once he Big 12 Grant of rights ends.

I personally think if we add Cal and Stanford the $85 million should not be given to all teams equally. I think about 3 million for each school should be given as a travel allowance, but the rest of the money should be used to incentivize the top 4 finishers in the conference. If Florida State is as awesome as they think they are, they should easily be able to cash in on this incentive.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

Also, SMU is Dallas's team, TCU is Ft Worth's.

Right now TCU is the much better program, with much higher support. There’s no real market difference between SMU and TCU, they’re both in DFW. The DFW area is literally full of alumni for all of the Texas schools. If anything, SMU is probably the least supported team in the DFW area, behind all of the Texas and Oklahoma major college teams.

 

[HtownOrange]

They have the largest current fanbase which might matter with streaming. Do all their alumni stay in Lubbock?

Houston has the potential to pass them. TCU and Baylor are smaller private schools and don’t add new markets.

Where are you getting your numbers?

UofH: 300,000 alumni

UH Alumni Association

UH Alumni Association

uh.edu

TTU: 240,000 alumni

About Texas Tech University

Facts and figures about Texas Tech University

www.ttu.edu

I don't pretend to be an expert, but Houston surpassed TTU a long time ago. Per US News and World Report, they both stink academically: UofH 184th and TTU 219th. Baylor is 77th, TCU is 89th, SMU is 72nd; all three are academic giants comparatively, which likely explains the wealth generation of their respective alumni in comparison to UofH and TTU. P.S. Louisville is 182nd.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities?_sort=rank&_sortDirection=asc

I'm no proponent of adding TCU, Baylor, and SMU but they each are more of an academic fit for the ACC and more valuable as they are both far wealthier than TTU alumni.

If you are looking a metro markets, the decision of SMU or UofH is obvious. TCU at third.

 

[CousCuse]

Right now TCU is the much better program, with much higher support. There’s no real market difference between SMU and TCU, they’re both in DFW. The DFW area is literally full of alumni for all of the Texas schools. If anything, SMU is probably the least supported team in the DFW area, behind all of the Texas and Oklahoma major college teams.

I got to believe the cities of Dallas and Fort Worth have rivalries for just about everything.

 

[Toga]

Historically, how have NCAA basketball tournament units ($) been distributed in the ACC?

 

[kcsu]

No, I'm pointing out to board members who say FSU is behaving like a petulant child that they've done their part for the conference. They went CFP in its first season coming off of that championship. Outside of Clemson, they are the only ones who have the right to behave that way.

No they dont.

 

[HtownOrange]

Conferences share revenue alike. FSU's demand is unrealistic and opens the door for any new conference FSU may join at some point in time to demand that they get a lesser share.

The demand is not a good idea, especially as the SEC and the B1G share revenue equally. Yes, the B1G makes some teams buy into the BTN and cut shares to pay for the buy-in, but each team gets a full share when the buy-in payment and received funds are added together.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Where are you getting your numbers?

UofH: 300,000 alumni

UH Alumni Association

UH Alumni Association

uh.edu

TTU: 240,000 alumni

About Texas Tech University

Facts and figures about Texas Tech University

www.ttu.edu

I don't pretend to be an expert, but Houston surpassed TTU a long time ago. Per US News and World Report, they both stink academically: UofH 184th and TTU 219th. Baylor is 77th, TCU is 89th, SMU is 72nd; all three are academic giants comparatively, which likely explains the wealth generation of their respective alumni in comparison to UofH and TTU. P.S. Louisville is 182nd.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities?_sort=rank&_sortDirection=asc

I'm no proponent of adding TCU, Baylor, and SMU but they each are more of an academic fit for the ACC and more valuable as they are both far wealthier than TTU alumni.

If you are looking a metro markets, the decision of SMU or UofH is obvious. TCU at third.

Houston is the larger school and has more potential fans. But as of right now they do not have a bigger engaged fanbase. In 5 years when any decision to be made is in play, we will see where Houston is. If they are only getting 35k per game while Tech is getting 57.5k per game, I would be worried that Houston won't capture much more of their potential. However if by then they are expanding their stadium, they are the obvious best choice.

Personally I would take Houston of the B12 Texas schools, but the fact that a school that large with decent recent success and a new stadium cannot get 25k per game is a bit worrisome. For comparison USF, who is bad, is able to outdraw them by a good amount. Houston should get a decent bump now that they are in the B12. But will it be road fans or new Cougar fans?

 

[WoadBlue]

Houston is the larger school and has more potential fans. But as of right now they do not have a bigger engaged fanbase. In 5 years when any decision to be made is in play, we will see where Houston is. If they are only getting 35k per game while Tech is getting 57.5k per game, I would be worried that Houston won't capture much more of their potential. However if by then they are expanding their stadium, they are the obvious best choice.

Personally I would take Houston of the B12 Texas schools, but the fact that a school that large with decent recent success and a new stadium cannot get 25k per game is a bit worrisome. For comparison USF, who is bad, is able to outdraw them by a good amount. Houston should get a decent bump now that they are in the B12. But will it be road fans or new Cougar fans?

Sharing your city with the NFL and NBA makes it very hard to have a consistently large fan base for either revenue sport. TTU has as larger proven and consistent fan base in both revenue sports than does Houston.

 

[WoadBlue]

Interesting question
TCU is Fort Worth
SMU is Dallas
TCU right now has the upperhand.
SMU could make strides but it'll be tough to even pull even.

SMU has always been the Rich Kids college while TCU has always been a middle class/ small rancher college. SMU has many more rich alums.

 

[WoadBlue]

So the League should prioritize FSU monetarily and give them a better chance than their conference teammates regardless of their performance failures? You do realize (or do you?) that FSU was 10-3 last year and all 3 losses in the regular season were with other ACC teams. Then they lost in the Cheez It Bowl to 6-6 Big 12 Oklahoma.

The past 8 seasons 2015 through 2022) their in conference ACC record is 32-32 (4-4 average) and that even adding their 8-0 conference records back in 2013 and 2014, the past 10 years, they still have just a 48-32 conference record (4.8wins -3.2 loss average). So you believe that their fellow league teams should help prop them up, reward them, for mediocrity and punish their fellow conference teams for their performances against them? You think they deserve more money from the ACC than the other ACC teams just to compete? Hmmm

TV pays for TV viewers. The SEC has many more than the ACC. If you make part of league payments be based on TV numbers, you are actually paying those members more who make certain that ACCCTV deals are worth as much as they are.

The ACC has only two ways to save itself as a truly Major conference long erm: 1) get ND, and drop dead weight ACC members with consistently low TV numbers; 2) pay members who deliver the best TV numbers per what they deliver to keep them from wanting to wreck the league to go else where that has more pay.

Neither picture is the prettiest to face. But that is reality when the league has too many smaller and private schools and too many 'basketball schools.'

 

[HRE Otto IV]

TV pays for TV viewers. The SEC has many more than the ACC. If you make part of league payments be based on TV numbers, you are actually paying those members more who make certain that ACCCTV deals are worth as much as they are.

The ACC has only two ways to save itself as a truly Major conference long erm: 1) get ND, and drop dead weight ACC members with consistently low TV numbers; 2) pay members who deliver the best TV numbers per what they deliver to keep them from wanting to wreck the league to go else where that has more pay.

Neither picture is the prettiest to face. But that is reality when the league has too many smaller and private schools and too many 'basketball schools.'

The ACC is done as a major conference. Stop pretending that is not the case. Even if ND joins the ACC will be well below the B18 and SEC.

The ACC will not kick out schools. Giving bigger TV draws more money will do nothing to save the conference.

 

[Cusefan69]

UConn makes sense. Gives us a regional rival and closes the door on the Big 12 moving into the northeast. I think they were on deck for invite if not for the Pac 12 dissolving but who knows? SMU is terrible at basketball and mediocre at best at football.

Oh Sam. Did you join here at the same time as Gandolf? You both sound like you are from UConn shire. The difference is SMU has backing. As in rich ass oil mofo backing. So they live on oil money for 5 years and it let's existing ACC get some more. UCONN would want a piece of the action.