Amba Etta-Day2 | Page 5 | Syracusefan.com

Amba Etta-Day2

NFL teams don't have time to teach a guy that is a poor route runner how to get better at it. Remember when Chad "Ochocinco" joined the Patriots? Bad route runner. Wasn't where Brady wanted him. They didn't put up with his BS and got rid.

If I'm ET, I'm only working on route running and precision this summer. It's massively important to build the trust with your QB.

That's fine. As LeMoyneCuse said - that shows a need for a minor league. The stated goals of college and what the NFL needs are in conflict. I'm not sure thats 100% on colleges to solve.
 
I wonder how much talent goes to waste because NFL teams don't want to take the time to develop it?

(Side note, Ochocinco, Shockey, etc. is a list of guys who didn't want to be developed. If I'm an NFL team, I'm rating "grit, work ethic, teachability" over "can run routes")
 
I wonder how much talent goes to waste because NFL teams don't want to take the time to develop it?

(Side note, Ochocinco, Shockey, etc. is a list of guys who didn't want to be developed. If I'm an NFL team, I'm rating "grit, work ethic, teachability" over "can run routes")
And this is why the Patriots win football games. Because they look for guys that do the fundamental things really well, even if they aren't a freak athlete.

Brandin Cooks was a target not only because of his numbers but because he's a gym rat and a guy who studies his craft all the time.

I do think Amba is a hard worker, and will continue to develop his weaknesses to be an NFL receiver. Being an undrafted FA was better than him being a 6/7th rounder because now he could choose the best possible situation and will have a great chance to make the Jaguars, especially over a scumbag like Dede Westbrook.
 
And this is why the Patriots win football games. Because they look for guys that do the fundamental things really well, even if they aren't a freak athlete.

Brandin Cooks was a target not only because of his numbers but because he's a gym rat and a guy who studies his craft all the time.

I do think Amba is a hard worker, and will continue to develop his weaknesses to be an NFL receiver. Being an undrafted FA was better than him being a 6/7th rounder because now he could choose the best possible situation and will have a great chance to make the Jaguars, especially over a scumbag like Dede Westbrook.

I think we're largely agreeing here. I think the Pats looks for guys who will work and are willing to be coached. Spurs do that too.

I don't have a problem valuing that over talent - it's assuming that because they don't run crisp routes that they must not be hard workers. Amba by all accounts is grit guy. That's why I think the "system" guy label is a horrible thing to do to a kid. How hard did they work to do what their coaches asked them to do? - Is a better evaluation than "How well can they do what we do on day 1 of camp?"
 
They ding the system for "poor route running"... which begs the question: How do they catch so many balls?
That's fine. As LeMoyneCuse said - that shows a need for a minor league. The stated goals of college and what the NFL needs are in conflict. I'm not sure thats 100% on colleges to solve.
That's fine. As LeMoyneCuse said - that shows a need for a minor league. The stated goals of college and what the NFL needs are in conflict. I'm not sure thats 100% on colleges to solve.



NFL Route Tree



Here is a view of the basic route tree with the numbering system.

upload_2017-5-1_17-51-3.jpg


Matt Bowen/Bleacher Report



Breaking Down the Route Tree

In the NFL, every route (outside of the three-step passing game) breaks at a depth of 12 to 15 yards.



Flat (1): A three-step, outside breaking route usually run from inside of the numbers (slot receiver, tight end, running back) with the receiver taking a quick, vertical release and then breaking to the flat. Think of basic combinations where the flat is used: flat-slant, flat-7, flat-stick, etc.

Slant (2): The slant can be run from a three-step drop or a one-step drop (sight adjust to off-coverage/blitz hot read). An inside breaking concept where the receiver will use a quick, vertical stem before breaking at a 45-degree angle to gain leverage versus a defender inside of the numbers. The slant will show up with players such as Calvin Johnson, Jimmy Graham, Brandon Marshall, Larry Fitzgerald, etc., because of their size/length to create leverage on the break.

upload_2017-5-1_17-51-3.jpg


John Cordes

Comeback (3): One of the toughest throws for an NFL quarterback to make, the comeback breaks at a depth of 12 to 15 yards with the receiver breaking downhill at a 45-degree angle to the sideline. In order for the comeback to be productive, the receiver must create enough separation within the stem by selling the fade before breaking downhill.

Curl (4): The curl route is the opposite of the comeback, with the wide receiver pushing up the field between a depth of 12 and 15 yards and breaking downhill at a 45-degree angle inside (or to the quarterback). Due to the size we see at the wide receiver position in today’s game, the curl route shows up consistently on Sundays and is often paired with a flat route (curl-flat combo).

Out (5): The out route (or deep out) again breaks between 12 and 15 yards, but the key is the initial split (or stem) of the receiver. This route requires room for the receiver to break and secure the catch while staying in bounds. Because of that, the receiver will either align at the bottom of the numbers or stem to the bottom of the numbers from a plus split to create enough room to complete the catch.

Dig (6): The dig (or square-in) is a deep, inside breaking cut with the receiver (or tight end) pressing up the field, sinking his hips and breaking back to the middle of the field between a depth of 12 and 15 yards. The key for the receiver is creating separation at the top of the stem by pinning the defensive back to the outside. A top concept in the intermediate passing game versus both zone and man coverage that caters to top-tier route-runners such as A.J. Green.

upload_2017-5-1_17-51-3.jpg


Mike Ehrmann/Getty Images

Corner (7): The corner route (or old school “flag route”) is a deep, outside breaking cut run up the field at a 45-degree angle toward the sideline. Receivers aligned outside of the numbers will have to take a hard, inside release to run the 7 (create room), and we often see it out of a slot alignment. Paired with the flat route (flat-7), the corner route is one of the top Cover 2 beaters in the NFL and also shows up versus Cover 1 in the red zone to work away from the safety help in the middle of the field.

Post (8): The post is a deep, inside breaking route where the receiver stems up the field at a 45-degree angle to the goal posts. The post can also be run with a “dino” stem (stem to corner, break back to the post) to create more separation by widening the defensive back. One of the top routes in the vertical passing game that is run versus single-high (Cover 1, Cover 3), quarters (Cover 4) and two-deep (Cover 2, Cover 6).

Fade (9): The fade route can be identified with multiple terminology (go, fly, clear-out, etc.). Using a vertical stem, the receiver will work to beat a defender’s cushion in off-man, or win with an outside release in press-man, to stack on top of the defensive back down the field. The “back-shoulder fade” (ball thrown behind the receiver or to the back shoulder versus man coverage) is becoming a top route for today’s NFL offenses, but the straight “go” route is still a weapon when you have speed outside of the numbers, like DeSean Jackson.

The above is not rocket science. Any good receiver can learn these routes. They are merely versions of college routes. Some do it better than others. If you are as talented a receiver as Amba is, the repetition of running these routes will become second nature. Of course due to the height and speed of the receiver, some can run certain routes better than others and certain receivers can get open in any situation and they are the most valuable of all receivers.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
NFL Route Tree



Here is a view of the basic route tree with the numbering system.

View attachment 95683

Matt Bowen/Bleacher Report



Breaking Down the Route Tree

In the NFL, every route (outside of the three-step passing game) breaks at a depth of 12 to 15 yards. Here's a quick breakdown of the routes you need to know in your film study.



Flat (1): A three-step, outside breaking route usually run from inside of the numbers (slot receiver, tight end, running back) with the receiver taking a quick, vertical release and then breaking to the flat. Think of basic combinations where the flat is used: flat-slant, flat-7, flat-stick, etc.

Slant (2): The slant can be run from a three-step drop or a one-step drop (sight adjust to off-coverage/blitz hot read). An inside breaking concept where the receiver will use a quick, vertical stem before breaking at a 45-degree angle to gain leverage versus a defender inside of the numbers. The slant will show up with players such as Calvin Johnson, Jimmy Graham, Brandon Marshall, Larry Fitzgerald, etc., because of their size/length to create leverage on the break.

View attachment 95684

John Cordes

Comeback (3): One of the toughest throws for an NFL quarterback to make, the comeback breaks at a depth of 12 to 15 yards with the receiver breaking downhill at a 45-degree angle to the sideline. In order for the comeback to be productive, the receiver must create enough separation within the stem by selling the fade before breaking downhill.

Curl (4): The curl route is the opposite of the comeback, with the wide receiver pushing up the field between a depth of 12 and 15 yards and breaking downhill at a 45-degree angle inside (or to the quarterback). Due to the size we see at the wide receiver position in today’s game, the curl route shows up consistently on Sundays and is often paired with a flat route (curl-flat combo).

Out (5): The out route (or deep out) again breaks between 12 and 15 yards, but the key is the initial split (or stem) of the receiver. This route requires room for the receiver to break and secure the catch while staying in bounds. Because of that, the receiver will either align at the bottom of the numbers or stem to the bottom of the numbers from a plus split to create enough room to complete the catch.

Dig (6): The dig (or square-in) is a deep, inside breaking cut with the receiver (or tight end) pressing up the field, sinking his hips and breaking back to the middle of the field between a depth of 12 and 15 yards. The key for the receiver is creating separation at the top of the stem by pinning the defensive back to the outside. A top concept in the intermediate passing game versus both zone and man coverage that caters to top-tier route-runners such as A.J. Green.

View attachment 95685

Mike Ehrmann/Getty Images

Corner (7): The corner route (or old school “flag route”) is a deep, outside breaking cut run up the field at a 45-degree angle toward the sideline. Receivers aligned outside of the numbers will have to take a hard, inside release to run the 7 (create room), and we often see it out of a slot alignment. Paired with the flat route (flat-7), the corner route is one of the top Cover 2 beaters in the NFL and also shows up versus Cover 1 in the red zone to work away from the safety help in the middle of the field.

Post (8): The post is a deep, inside breaking route where the receiver stems up the field at a 45-degree angle to the goal posts. The post can also be run with a “dino” stem (stem to corner, break back to the post) to create more separation by widening the defensive back. One of the top routes in the vertical passing game that is run versus single-high (Cover 1, Cover 3), quarters (Cover 4) and two-deep (Cover 2, Cover 6).

Fade (9): The fade route can be identified with multiple terminology (go, fly, clear-out, etc.). Using a vertical stem, the receiver will work to beat a defender’s cushion in off-man, or win with an outside release in press-man, to stack on top of the defensive back down the field. The “back-shoulder fade” (ball thrown behind the receiver or to the back shoulder versus man coverage) is becoming a top route for today’s NFL offenses, but the straight “go” route is still a weapon when you have speed outside of the numbers, like DeSean Jackson.

The above is not rocket science. Any good receiver can learn these routes. They are merely versions of college routes. Some do it better than others. If you are as talented a receiver as Amba is, the repetition of running these routes will become second nature. Of course due to the height and speed of the receiver, some can run certain routes better than others and certain receivers can get open in any situation and they are the most valuable of all receivers.

Much respect to the work you put in here, but I'm well aware of the route tree.

I'm more interested in why Baylor/Bowling Green/Syracuse guys get dinged for poor route running while breaking records. I think it's a bias.

- maybe they run so many plays that they run sloppier routes
- I don't think the guys on the outside run the full tree in this offense
- I think they are taught to cut routes short based on the secondary more and in ways that are anti-orthodox

Thoughts?
 
Much respect to the work you put in here, but I'm well aware of the route tree.

I'm more interested in why Baylor/Bowling Green/Syracuse guys get dinged for poor route running while breaking records. I think it's a bias.

- maybe they run so many plays that they run sloppier routes
- I don't think the guys on the outside run the full tree in this offense
- I think they are taught to cut routes short based on the secondary more and in ways that are anti-orthodox

Thoughts?

I thank you for your comments.

I agree. The NFL is very strict and biased in their observation of elite talent coming into THEIR SYSTEM. The college system is far from the pro system and they, (NFL), will take time to develop someone they've drafted and veteran players at times will show them how a route is supposed to be run - if not a coach will. After all the draft pick, unless he is hurt or does not show the promise he had when drafted in camp, is now hopefully a part of the team and the teams future.
I also do not like the word SYSTEM. Sure it's different in college due to the fact the HC has goals of his own about how his team is going to be successful and win games versus various opponents defensives schemes. Routes will be run accordingly.

So you better be ready, be an elite athlete have a good Senior Bowl and Combine numbers. They count a great deal toward where and if you are going to be drafted. However some of the best players go undrafted because of bias and no it's not fair but neither is life.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
167,481
Messages
4,706,279
Members
5,908
Latest member
Cuseman17

Online statistics

Members online
33
Guests online
1,714
Total visitors
1,747


Top Bottom