Athletic Story on Hillsman

[llandz]

I’m glad you posted this llandz. I’ve had similar thoughts on the roster and transfers.

The only players I was alarmed to see transfer were Engstler, Djaldi-Tabdi, Cardoso and Hueijbens. Emily and Q’s relationship has always seemed strained so not surprising, but devastating from a b-ball perspective. D-T brought experienced versatility as a 4/5 and was a big loss with all the other roster size leaving as well. Camilla’s size and potential is obvious, so no brainer. Hueijbens again just because it means no depth at center.

As for Strautmane, Finklea, Lewis and Tiana — I never expected them back anyway since they had fulfilled degree requirements. Just because everyone was gifted a “do over” year I was actually hoping none would take it. I think one of the problems has been this group was never going to max out much better than they did. Partly from Q’s inability to either scheme for the talent or get the right talent for the scheme. Take your pick sports fans.

As for the young guns who got suspended, unfortunately they just did not seem to me to ultimately be SU caliber players (except Fisher). Whatever the circumstances regarding the suspensions was, it gave Q an opportunity to cut bait with a portion of the roster after a year (more with Washington) of evaluation. I was in favor of this development.

So IMHO, the departure of 8 of the transfers (or non-returning players) was beneficial.

I guess the concern for me is why did the 4 at the top of my rant leave? Problems with Q’s conduct, his coaching deficiencies, NYS / SU Covid issues, or just For a fresh start?

Djaldi-Tabdi graduated. So technically a grad transfer. I think the foreign players like to try something new while they are here, and they get to stay in the country by continuing their education. But she graduated in 3 years so could have stayed at SU another. I am concerned by the others who left and weren't graduates. I am concerned with the players who got into trouble. That comes somewhat from the coaching top down. Interesting that Priscilla Williams was the one really good player who did not defect with the others. Especially after how her season ended with the terrible concussion. I am concerned overall, but also know that not all is true to this article. So we shall see how it plays out.

 

[SUbear]

To address the transfers somewhat.

There were 5 who probably were not welcomed back as they violated team and university rules (speculation on my part only and with some knowledge I have). You know 4 were suspended right before the NCAA tournament.

5 of them were graduate transfers who stayed with our program for 3-4 years and all earned their degrees and most also earned a masters degree. They are pursuing other educational opportunities by going grad transfer. Why stay at SU for another degree when they had more options by looking elsewhere. This has gone on for years. If Kiara was drafted, for ex, she would not be going to any college. She is getting a very specific 2nd masters at Clemson. If life under Q was so horrible why not leave beforehand? They all stayed in the program for the duration of their main education. They also could have been gone by just graduating and being done with playing.

So that leaves only 2-3 who are truly leaving the program for other reasons. COVID was very hard for many of them, especially with New York State being stricter and some of their friends at other schools had more freedom and parents who were able to see some games at the end of the season.

So stop with the transfer numbers. That is NOT really the issue when you break it down. COVID and new transfer rules and what I point out above makes this an exception for this season.

This is not saying there are not potential issues with Q or with the program, but please don't keep looking at the transfer numbers from this season as a big part of the equation.

He was responsible for all aspects of the program so I disagree that the transfer are not an indicator, especially when you lose your best recruit in years.

 

[llandz]

He was responsible for all aspects of the program so I disagree that the transfer are not an indicator, especially when you lose your best recruit in years.

Did you even read my post? I never said that transfers are not in issue in general. I said in this case the numbers are being overblown. I just explained that not all is as it seems in who the transfers were. Read. 4 were kicked out most likely, and possibly 5.Another 5 Graduated. They were not coming back in a non COVID year. Their eligibility would have been over. They used the opportunity to further their education. Most likely had to be done at another school since they already obtained 2 degrees at SU. Went to a school with a degree that SU does not offer.

 

[SUbear]

Did you even read my post? I never said that transfers are not in issue in general. I said in this case the numbers are being overblown. I just explained that not all is as it seems in who the transfers were. Read. 4 were kicked out most likely, and possibly 5.Another 5 Graduated. They were not coming back in a non COVID year. Their eligibility would have been over. They used the opportunity to further their education. Most likely had to be done at another school since they already obtained 2 degrees at SU. Went to a school with a degree that SU does not offer.

I read it and understand what you said, I just do not agree with your conclusion. Sorry.

Explain Engsler and Cordoso even if you write off the others. Those two alone leaving is a major red flag.

 

[baggerbob]

I read it and understand what you said, I just do not agree with your conclusion. Sorry.

Explain Engsler and Cordoso even if you write off the others. Those two alone leaving is a major red flag.

Cardosa is fairly easy to understand, She is probably the best young player in Brazil. After a great first year her National Team probably suggested she go to a better school for training bigs. She chose South Carolina and Dawn Staley, that was a no brainer.

 

[SUbear]

Cardosa is fairly easy to understand, She is probably the best young player in Brazil. After a great first year her National Team probably suggested she go to a better school for training bigs. She chose South Carolina and Dawn Staley, that was a no brainer.

So you are saying our coaching is not that good, not exactly an endorsement for Q, and pretty close to what I said in my first post in this string.

 

[baggerbob]

So you are saying our coaching is not that good, not exactly an endorsement for Q.

Let's see A'Ja Wilson is probably one of the 2 or 3 best players in the World. Dawn assisted Geno for 2 Olympics, and is now our Olympic coach. Seems to me the Brazil Olympic Committee might think 3 years with Dawn would be better then staying at Syracuse. Also heard that Camilla qualified late because english not being her 1st lanquage.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Women’s basketball alums send letter to Syracuse voicing concerns about Quentin Hillsman allegations

The women were alarmed about the number of Orange transfers; The Athletic story heightened their concern.

www.syracuse.com

 

[Ozone!]

Our Women’s Basketball alums have a huge stake in the programs future; bravo, ladies, for speaking up!

 

[dollarbill44]

So you are saying our coaching is not that good, not exactly an endorsement for Q, and pretty close to what I said in my first post in this string.

That assessment sounds a little like Ricky Bobby: "if you ain't first, you're last. "
Without even judging Q, I would offer there's a lot of coaches between the best and "not that good". Dawn Staley is one of the best coaches in college basketball, men or women.

 

[SUbear]

Let's see A'Ja Wilson is probably one of the 2 or 3 best players in the World. Dawn assisted Geno for 2 Olympics, and is now our Olympic coach. Seems to me the Brazil Olympic Committee might think 3 years with Dawn would be better then staying at Syracuse. Also heard that Camilla qualified late because english not being her 1st lanquage.

Then where on a scale of 1 thru 5 would you place Stacey versus Q, I think overall Q is at best a 3.

 

[SUbear]

That assessment sounds a little like Ricky Bobby: "if you ain't first, you're last. "
Without even judging Q, I would offer there's a lot of coaches between the best and "not that good". Dawn Staley is one of the best coaches in college basketball, men or women.

Same question where on a scale of 1 thru 5 would you place Q from his overall performance? I said at best a 3.
If you look at my first post in this string you will see that I said if he is not found to have committed any fireable indiscretions he should be reevaluated at the least, well evaluate him. I say he is not terrible but far from great. The question then becomes are his positives good enough to live with his negatives.

 

[baggerbob]

Then where on a scale of 1 thru 5 would you place Stacey versus Q, I think overall Q is at best a 3.

Compared to top coaches at best a 2, he can recruit, but his in game coaching is terrible. You don't go through an entire season with 2 players shooting less than 30% from 3, and not tell them to stop, and either drive, or get closer to the basket.
He seldom makes good adjustments even if something isn't working.

 

[721Comstock]

Compared to top coaches at best a 2, he can recruit, but his in game coaching is terrible. You don't go through an entire season with 2 players shooting less than 30% from 3, and not tell them to stop, and either drive, or get closer to the basket.
He seldom makes good adjustments even if something isn't working.

If Q is a 2, then Rick Barnes is a -1.

Barnes couldn’t make the Sweet Sixteen with KD and THREE other future NBA players on the same team.

Q got Cuse to the Natty Champ game a few years ago. No shame in losing to UConn.

Last season was a CF, for many, many reasons.
And having 2 volume shooters who had worse discretion than JGIIII was - not ideal.

But - getting matched up w UConn in the NCAA’s yet again, and losing to them, isn’t some sign that he sucks.

 

[baggerbob]

If Q is a 2, then Rick Barnes is a -1.

Barnes couldn’t make the Sweet Sixteen with KD and THREE other future NBA players on the same team.

Q got Cuse to the Natty Champ game a few years ago. No shame in losing to UConn.

Last season was a CF, for many, many reasons.
And having 2 volume shooters who had worse discretion than JGIIII was - not ideal.

But - getting matched up w UConn in the NCAA’s yet again, and losing to them, isn’t some sign that he sucks.

The year before at 16-15 with everyone, but Tiana was a total disaster. Then with the addition of 2 talented freshman, and Tiana, they still were bad. There needed to be a complete housecleaning.

 

[baggerbob]

The year before at 16-15 with everyone, but Tiana was a total disaster. Then with the addition of 2 talented freshman, and Tiana, they still were bad. There needed to be a complete housecleaning.

By the way, I agree about Barnes, but he should be a 0, can't coach at all.

 

[721Comstock]

By the way, I agree about Barnes, but he should be a 0, can't coach at all.

That’s why I gave him a minus 1.

He literally detracts from the talent assembled on the floor by virtue of being the coach.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

No matter what the investigation finds, SU has to move on, and move on quickly. Pay him his contract. What parent will send their daughters to play for Q after these allegations? Unfortunately, once an allegation is out, the truth (whatever that may be) doesn’t matter. For some evidence of this, one of the complaints against Q is that he hired someone against whom a sexual harassment claim had once been made. Not proven, made.

 

[721Comstock]

No matter what the investigation finds, SU has to move on, and move on quickly. Pay him his contract. What parent will send their daughters to play for Q after these allegations? Unfortunately, once an allegation is out, the truth (whatever that may be) doesn’t matter. For some evidence of this, one of the complaints against Q is that he hired someone against whom a s e xual harassment claim had once been made. Not proven, made.

No matter what the investigation finds….

Find him guilty, & fire him.

the American way

Yes, losing Engstler and Cardoso hurts.

But, IF good players were allowed a free transfer in the past, then JB also would have lost a TON of great players;
Paul Harris, Dion, MCW come to mind immediately.

burn the witch!!

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

No matter what the investigation finds….

Find him guilty, & fire him.

the American way

Yes, losing Engstler and Cardoso hurts.

But, IF good players were allowed a free transfer in the past, then JB also would have lost a TON of great players;
Paul Harris, Dion, MCW come to mind immediately.

burn the witch!!

The issue for recruiting is image. Even if it’s false, the fact that so many kids would conspire to burn a coach still says something is wrong.

For the school, the stain won’t come off if he is still the coach. Few people believe those idiots claims about Bernie Fine. How well would SU recruit if he was on the bench?

 

[two3zone]

The issue for recruiting is image. Even if it’s false, the fact that so many kids would conspire to burn a coach still says something is wrong.

For the school, the stain won’t come off if he is still the coach. Few people believe those idiots claims about Bernie Fine. How well would SU recruit if he was on the bench?

That phone call can’t be dismissed.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

That phone call can’t be dismissed.

When I had my practice in Oswego county I represented a cousin of the kid. According to her, no one in the family believed him about the story of abuse.

 

[two3zone]

When I had my practice in Oswego county I represented a cousin of the kid. According to her, no one in the family believed him about the story of abuse.

I get it, the guys were idiots and I don’t think that is disputed. But the Laurie Fine phone call had a lot of stuff in it that can’t be ignored.

 

[SUbear]

Compared to top coaches at best a 2, he can recruit, but his in game coaching is terrible. You don't go through an entire season with 2 players shooting less than 30% from 3, and not tell them to stop, and either drive, or get closer to the basket.
He seldom makes good adjustments even if something isn't working.

My three was giving him the benefit but I have no argument with your 2.