Bryce and Manny...

[donniesyracuse]

Yeah history has shown these mega deals rarely work out in favor of the signing team.

Most of these deals don’t happen when a player is 26. The first A-Rod deal, while as you said, did not favor the signing team, it was a good contract.

 

[bpo57]

Most of these deals don’t happen when a player is 26. The first A-Rod deal, while as you said, did not favor the signing team, it was a good contract.

The problem with most of these deals is that the signing team gets crushed on the back end, the last 3-4 years. Def happens a majority of the time.

I'm not sure that ARod even at his original 10/252 was a great deal given his postseason futility and the shame he brought upon himself and his team. Then when he opted out and forced NY to dole out more $$$ that was just insult to injury.

 

[donniesyracuse]

I'm not sure that ARod even at his original 10/252 was a great deal given his postseason futility and the shame he brought upon himself and his team. Then when he opted out and forced NY to dole out more $$$ that was just insult to injury.

He was still an MVP caliber player at the end of the contract.

 

[bpo57]

He was still an MVP caliber player at the end of the contract.

He was but $25 mil for a guy that played 3B and won one title with several wicked flame-outs in the postseason? Not sure the NYY would do that one again. Certainly not re-upping him in response to the opt out. That was an epic disaster.

 

[donniesyracuse]

He was but $25 mil for a guy that played 3B and won one title with several wicked flame-outs in the postseason?

He had 56.1 WAR during those seven seasons. That has to be among the best seven year stretches in history. Even in the four seasons with the Yankees, as merely a third baseman, he had 29.1 WAR.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

The problem with most of these deals is that the signing team gets crushed on the back end, the last 3-4 years. Def happens a majority of the time.

I'm not sure that ARod even at his original 10/252 was a great deal given his postseason futility and the shame he brought upon himself and his team. Then when he opted out and forced NY to dole out more $$$ that was just insult to injury.

It's amazing the steroid guys who are disliked and who get a pass. ARod, Bonds, Clemens, etc. get killed. Petite, Papi, Sheffield, etc. get passes.

 

[OrangeDW]

Bryce really hasn’t done anything to show he’s worth that kind of money for that many years.

He’s had one season(2015) where his production would warrant that contract. He had one other season that would’ve been close if he didn’t get hurt.

Every other season - not even close.

The Phillies can have him at that price and years.

That said, I’d be thrilled if my Dodgers snatch him with a short contract for absurd money.

 

[bpo57]

He had 56.1 WAR during those seven seasons. That has to be among the best seven year stretches in history. Even in the four seasons with the Yankees, as merely a third baseman, he had 29.1 WAR.

That's great but the NYY may have been better off applying that $$$ elsewhere. Certainly didn't do much for Texas.

 

[bpo57]

It's amazing the steroid guys who are disliked and who get a pass. ARod, Bonds, Clemens, etc. get killed. Petite, Papi, Sheffield, etc. get passes.

Overwhelming evidence against the first trio plus Pettitte copped to it and didn't lie like the others. The case against papi is weak. The guy was tested relentlessly for the last five years of his career and was still banging out 35-40 dingers a year.

 

[bpo57]

Bryce really hasn’t done anything to show he’s worth that kind of money for that many years.

He’s had one season(2015) where his production would warrant that contract. He had one other season that would’ve been close if he didn’t get hurt.

Every other season - not even close.

The Phillies can have him at that price and years.

That said, I’d be thrilled if my Dodgers snatch him with a short contract for absurd money.

I wanted to see him with the NYY so they could set an all time record for Ks between him, Stanton, Judge and Sanchez. That would have been epic.

 

[OrangeDW]

I wanted to see him with the NYY so they could set an all time record for Ks between him, Stanton, Judge and Sanchez. That would have been epic.

A lot of these new baseball nerds don’t care about k’s as long as you can hit a home run.

It’s a worse game IMO.

Random reference, but I always loved Gary Sheffield as a player because he was an absolute stick who hardly ever struck out for such a power hitter.

 

[bpo57]

A lot of these new baseball nerds don’t care about k’s as long as you can hit a home run.

It’s a worse game IMO.

Random reference, but I always loved Gary Sheffield as a player because he was an absolute stick who hardly ever struck out for such a power hitter.

Perfect example last year the NYY hit 269 HRs while Boston had 208. Yet Boston scored 25 more runs.

 

[OrangeDW]

Perfect example last year the NYY hit 269 HRs while Boston had 208. Yet Boston scored 25 more runs.

I’ve seen SF and St. Louis win enough championships by grinding out big late game playoff at bats and someone like David Frees(thrilled my Dodgers grabbed him) fouling off like 8 pitches and then knocking in two runs with a big single in the 8th or something.

 

[Noexcuse]

I’ve seen SF and St. Louis win enough championships by grinding out big late game playoff at bats and someone like David Frees(thrilled my Dodgers grabbed him) fouling off like 8 pitches and then knocking in two runs with a big single in the 8th or something.

Mattingly, Brett and Boggs all masters at fouling off pitches until they got the one they wanted.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I really wanted to see the Padres get Harper too. It would be a great experiment to see if a team could allocate 2/3 of its total payroll to just 3 players and have a contending team. Personally I don't believe so. But it would cause shock waves through MLB if it worked. The Texas Rangers tried a variation of this when they signed A-Rod for the 2001 season for massive money and it totally bombed as they finished last 3 straight years and then gave up and dealt him in a salary dump.

Pretty sure A-Rod won MVP one of those last place finishing seasons.

Which is interesting, because had he not played well I guess they would have finished... worse than last?

 

[donniesyracuse]

Which is interesting, because had he not played well I guess they would have finished... worse than last?

They would have won fewer games. According to fangraphs, A-Rod was worth 9.2 more wins than the average replacement. If the Rangers had an above average shortstop like Alex Gonzalez (2.7 WAR), the Rangers would have been projected to win about six fewer games.That is an MVP season. The fact that the Rangers sucked is not A-Rod's fault.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

They would have won fewer games. According to fangraphs, A-Rod was worth 9.2 more wins than the average replacement. If the Rangers had an above average shortstop like Alex Gonzalez (2.7 WAR), the Rangers would have been projected to win about six fewer games.That is an MVP season. The fact that the Rangers sucked is not A-Rod's fault.

So you're saying they would have finished last.

The Rangers sucking wasn't A-Rod's fault, fair enough.

He didn't need to be awarded though.

 

[donniesyracuse]

So you're saying they would have finished last.

The Rangers sucking wasn't A-Rod's fault, fair enough.

He didn't need to be awarded though.

He was the most valuable player. He was worth more wins than any other player in the AL that season.

 

[bpo57]

Mattingly, Brett and Boggs all masters at fouling off pitches until they got the one they wanted.

Johnny Damon was good at that too.

 

[bpo57]

He was the most valuable player. He was worth more wins than any other player in the AL that season.

They could have finished last without him. It was an incredibly dumb contract and the owner (Hicks) was choking on that deal and couldn't wait to unload ARod. As for the NYY we all know it's all about winning titles. ARod came up really empty in some of those ALDS/ALCS series.

 

[donniesyracuse]

They could have finished last without him.

It does not mean he was not the most valuable player.

 

[bpo57]

It does not mean he was not the most valuable player.

But yet the owner couldn't wait to unload his contract. Go figure.

 

[donniesyracuse]

But yet the owner couldn't wait to unload his contract. Go figure.

A player deserving an award and general manager decisions are very different.

 

[bpo57]

A player deserving an award and general manager decisions are very different.

Never said he didn't deserve the award. Still a bad contract. The $$$ part of this equation seems to have eluded you.

 

[donniesyracuse]

Never said he didn't deserve the award.

Otto said that he didn't. You responded to my response to him.