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[FreakTalksAboutSU]

Seriously, I love the run heavy RPO/ Option offense. This isn't Dinos offense or what we've seen previously. Gilbert must have a heavy influence.

The motion, the misdirection, blocking schemes are fun to watch for this rushing attack. If play action and rollouts start hitting it could all work.

This is the offense I think works for this program. The thought that because we have a Dome means we have to throw the ball all over the place or run 90 plays is bogus imo.

Any time your QB is a true dual threat the defense has to account for him and that makes a huge difference for a talent deficient offense like ours. Imagine if they start incorporating the jet sweep more too. Not to mention we can't recruit enough skill players to run a pro-style offense. Our QBs aren't playing in the NFL and recent WR history has been sketchy.

So, in a long winded manner, I'll take any coach that wants to run this offense or a similar run based scheme.

We've literally never even tried to run this offense though.

 

[sufandu]

It’s pretty simple. Whatever it is he thinks he should do….do the opposite

The thing is, he's done that. He's decided one thing one week that didn't work and then went the other way the next and didn't work.

 

[tipphill]

Okay, okay, I'm as frustrated as anyone about Dino and his in-game coaching woes. He has always had them, and they really haven't gotten a ton better. But I want everyone to try and look at this in a different way.

As the esteemed SWC75 has discussed numerous times here, Virginia Tech basically gave Frank Beamer an ultimatum - change your coordinators or we'll change the head coach. He did, Bud Foster came in, and the rest is history.

I actually think Dino has done what he needs to do on the assistant coach front.

1) Tony White seems like a solid DC and he firmly believes in getting a lot of guys playing time. That helps with depth and with growth. A very solid hire.
2) Swag Daddy is a dude this team can't afford to lose. Top-notch recruiter and has done a FANTASTIC job at coaching up the safeties and nickels. He has been here right along with Dino, and they need to do everything they can to keep him in the fold.
3) Chip West is a long-time top recruiter in the Delmarva area and has done well in recruiting and coaching up the corners.
4) Sterlin Gilbert is an OC that wants to run the ball. It's also what Dino wants to do. Unfortunately, the Offensive Line has always been too thin, or not up to ACC standards. This year he has a scheme, a QB, an RB, AND an OL that makes this approach work. Defenses look nervous and confused out there. They have to pick their poison.
5) Mike Schmidt is the solution to Sterlin's OL issue. The dude is a top-notch OL coach. He has coached up the young guys and also has done a great job getting the vets to play with more aggression out there. This OL is a huge reason why Tucker and Shrader are running so well. I've been watching replays of each game, and man they are road graders.
---

The assistants are in place to coach up players. That's exactly what SU needs. This will never be a destination for fully formed top-level D1 athletes. They need to be made into those through coaching and S&C. I'm encouraged by how this coaching staff is handling all the young players and is helping them develop. It bodes well for the future.

Dino is a great leader of men, off the field, in the locker room, and with his morals and beliefs about how a program should be run. I believe his values match what SU wants in a head coach. He is also beloved by the ACC press corps. I'm friends with quite a few of them, and they all love Dino. Great guy, a fun storyteller, a nice dude who takes the time to talk to these reporters. He's a great ambassador for SU and SU football.

His one glaring weakness isn't his inability to change. He's been willing to fire people on his staff and look for upgrades where he needs them. He almost always holds onto his recruiting classes because he creates a family atmosphere and is a trustworthy guy.

His one weakness is his cluelessness in in-game decision-making. He has actually impeded this team's progress by making (or not making) some decisions during the game. For whatever reason, he seems flustered and nervous about the type of decisions he makes in-game. It's obvious he's self-conscious about it given his presser on Monday. No dude with confidence in those abilities would say they did nothing wrong in-game. Someone with confidence is willing to say "Yep I made a mistake there but won't next time." He doth protest too much.

He needs someone to take over those decisions or needs to be hearing just one voice in his ear about what to do with things that run the gamut from calling timeouts, to taking or not taking penalties, to clock management, etc... Big picture game plans have been fine this year (with the possible exception of Rutgers). It's the in-game calls that are questionable.

Wildhack needs to get someone in here who can help focus Dino in making the right calls, and more than anything having a consistent attitude about how to handle game situations. What I mean by this is he needs someone to help him be more consistent in his decision-making process because currently, it seems as if a lot of his decisions are "fly by the seat of your pants" and not something that is a part of what they believe the culture of the team is. Are you going to be a riverboat gambler or a conservative coach who plays it close to the vest? What are the strengths of your team and the weaknesses and are you constantly going to take advantage of those strengths and weaknesses throughout the game and not just willy-nilly when the feeling hits?

I'm not sure who that person is or what their designation is, but he needs a Czar of In-Game Decision Making in the worst way. Let Dino have the final say, but make the czar be the one voice in his ear who pays attention to all of the above so Dino can make the most well-informed and analytical decision that the situation requires. Do that and I think this program starts cooking with grease.

why not use the existing staff to make the calls?? if we need someone to coach the coach then we need a new coach or reduce his salary and get a st coach, and pay a consultant to "help" dino. he is a very stubborn person and it takes long time for him to get things. that said i agree with all the rest that you said about him. i like dino as well, but as i said he is in over his head.

 

[All4SU]

Sterlin Gilbert has brought in a stable of excellent QB's, as good as SU has ever had. Tony White is doing a solid job as DC, but those QB's, Gilbert has to be retained. Move him up if Sino doesn't work out, you need a southern coach in the ACC.

Other than Shrader and Devito I don’t think we really know what we have in the QB stable. Probably won’t know what Lamson or McPhail have until next season. Probably won’t know how far Morgan or Tex have developed until next season.

 

[kcsu]

Best gig in America. Six years into the job, make millions per year, and be unsuccessful! All the while retaining it. Brilliant!

Highest paid losing record over 6 years in college football

 

[Chip]

#nolongerthenewfast

Look at the bright side. No one fakes injuries against us anymore.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Look at the bright side. No one fakes injuries against us anymore.

Running game makes games faster though so that's a plus as well!

 

[CousCuse]

I hate to think Gilbert has to leave and then goes on to be as successful as Hacket and Lester. Which I think he will. Gilbert is 42, same age as Hafley.

I should add Sean Lewis to that list. He has taken Kent State, the absolute worst FBS program, and turned them into a MAC power and will be getting a P5 job soon.

 

[TheCusian]

Best gig in America. Six years into the job, make millions per year, and be unsuccessful! All the while retaining it. Brilliant!

Yeah, let’s put some thought into our posts.

Year 1: beat a ranked team! No one is expecting a winning season but that was fun

Year 2: beat the #2 team in the country, lose your starting QB to injury, no one thinks he should be fired

Year 3: first 10 win season in almost 30 years, maybe our HC will get poached? We should probably re-up him

Year 4: horrible, but maybe it will get better can’t fire him for a 4 win season after the first 3 years and right after a 10 win season

Year 5: Global pandemic has season in jeopardy, no camps, new OC/DC, all conference games and a ranked OOC … horrible play but no one is getting fired unless you want to set your chances of getting anyone good on fire

Year 6: In every game in the 4th Q, 3-3 start losing the last 2 on the last play. RB gets listed on some Heisman lists, QB change sparks running game, OL hire a home run. Near every metric improved. Real signs of a good team.

When was he supposed to get fired, exactly?

“He fixed a bunch of the things we were complaining about but we’re still losing by a tiny bit at the end and therefore we should ignore everything to blindly look at winning % and wave our hands at 50/50 calls in tight games” is the weakest of sauces

 

[EuclidBred]

Yeah, let’s put some thought into our posts.

Year 1: beat a ranked team! No one is expecting a winning season but that was fun

Year 2: beat the #2 team in the country, lose your starting QB to injury, no one thinks he should be fired

Year 3: first 10 win season in almost 30 years, maybe our HC will get poached? We should probably re-up him

Year 4: horrible, but maybe it will get better can’t fire him for a 4 win season after the first 3 years and right after a 10 win season

Year 5: Global pandemic has season in jeopardy, no camps, new OC/DC, all conference games and a ranked OOC … horrible play but no one is getting fired unless you want to set your chances of getting anyone good on fire

Year 6: In every game in the 4th Q, 3-3 start losing the last 2 on the last play. RB gets listed on some Heisman lists, QB change sparks running game, OL hire a home run. Near every metric improved. Real signs of a good team.

When was he supposed to get fired, exactly?

“He fixed a bunch of the things we were complaining about but we’re still losing by a tiny bit at the end and therefore we should ignore everything to blindly look at winning % and wave our hands at 50/50 calls in tight games” is the weakest of sauces

Key words….still losing.

 

[Dick_in_MI]

Clockwork mentioned that Dino's one glaring weakness is his inability to change.

No. His one glaring weakness is much more high-level. Not, change, not decision-making, none of that. His one glaring weakness is results on the field going into this year.

4 losing seasons in 5 years, with this year to be determined. 13-31 in ACC games, where we have also been a perennial doormat/bottom dweller under him, 14-36 against P5 competition, including 3-18 vs P5 from 2019 until now.

Those are very damning numbers. It takes far more than an engaging personality and a couple of nifty, viral post-game speeches to earn the $15-$20M that SU has paid him during his tenure.

From time to time, someone will throw out the strawman "we can't expect to be like Alabama", as though ANYBODY ever says or expects that. What is and should be expected at the P5 level is results.

Like Mark, I have been off the Dino bandwagon for several weeks now and should have been off at the end of last year. I am willing to wait until the end of the year to judge him going forward but his record to this point as it pertains to what is required of a coach at his level is poor. I know that somebody will say that winning shouldn't be the measuring stick and will point to other things but the fact is that this is the P5. If a coach wants to be judged mainly on "the other things", let him go coach for a lot less money in the Missouri Valley conference or DII. To whom much is given, much is expected.

 

[RandomGuy]

I hate to think Gilbert has to leave and then goes on to be as successful as Hacket and Lester. Which I think he will. Gilbert is 42, same age as Hafley.

I'm more of the mindset that Gilbert's offense is the one we saw last year. The one we needed to start moving away from in 19.

IiRC, Lynch was on the field, last year, and now he's up in the booth with Gilbert. I wouldn't be surprised if its the, once normal, OC by committee that Babers has often used. Lynch as the running game coordinator? Also some option style runs that we've never seen before. Schmidt influence? Beats me.

I'm just thankful we've moved away from the 2 runs up the middle/30 yard bomb offense. Coaches are sometimes too stubborn. Finally, some green and growing. In the end, Babers is responsible for that shift. Whether its Gilbert, Lynch, Schmidt helping drive that? It doesn't matter to me. Babers is responsible.. It doesn't happen without Schmidt and Tucker, imo. Those are the 2 pieces most responsible for our now functioning offense. The 2 pieces we need back, next year.

 

[Acesn8s]

Yeah, let’s put some thought into our posts.

Year 1: beat a ranked team! No one is expecting a winning season but that was fun

Year 2: beat the #2 team in the country, lose your starting QB to injury, no one thinks he should be fired

Year 3: first 10 win season in almost 30 years, maybe our HC will get poached? We should probably re-up him

Year 4: horrible, but maybe it will get better can’t fire him for a 4 win season after the first 3 years and right after a 10 win season

Year 5: Global pandemic has season in jeopardy, no camps, new OC/DC, all conference games and a ranked OOC … horrible play but no one is getting fired unless you want to set your chances of getting anyone good on fire

Year 6: In every game in the 4th Q, 3-3 start losing the last 2 on the last play. RB gets listed on some Heisman lists, QB change sparks running game, OL hire a home run. Near every metric improved. Real signs of a good team.

When was he supposed to get fired, exactly?

“He fixed a bunch of the things we were complaining about but we’re still losing by a tiny bit at the end and therefore we should ignore everything to blindly look at winning % and wave our hands at 50/50 calls in tight games” is the weakest of sauces

He is supposed to get fired when he isn’t winning more games then he loses regularly. There are lots of head coaches who would be dying to have you as their AD. Credit for a bunch of close losses.

 

[TheCusian]

He is supposed to get fired when he isn’t winning more games then he loses regularly. There are lots of head coaches who would be dying to have you as their AD. Credit for a bunch of close losses.

After what year? You’re mistaking my post for a stamp of approval. When would you have fired him?

 

[TheCusian]

Key words….still losing.

Didn’t answer the question, lol

 

[A Clockwork Orange]

why not use the existing staff to make the calls?? if we need someone to coach the coach then we need a new coach or reduce his salary and get a st coach, and pay a consultant to "help" dino. he is a very stubborn person and it takes long time for him to get things. that said i agree with all the rest that you said about him. i like dino as well, but as i said he is in over his head.

I don't disagree with you at all, but as others have mentioned Dino would have to delegate to one person. This really shouldn't be committee decisions, but one person classified as the coach who helps Dino with statistical analysis of in-game decisions.

 

[TheCusian]

Clockwork mentioned that Dino's one glaring weakness is his inability to change.

No. His one glaring weakness is much more high-level. Not, change, not decision-making, none of that. His one glaring weakness is results on the field going into this year.

4 losing seasons in 5 years, with this year to be determined. 13-31 in ACC games, where we have also been a perennial doormat/bottom dweller under him, 14-36 against P5 competition, including 3-18 vs P5 from 2019 until now.

Those are very damning numbers. It takes far more than an engaging personality and a couple of nifty, viral post-game speeches to earn the $15-$20M that SU has paid him during his tenure.

From time to time, someone will throw out the strawman "we can't expect to be like Alabama", as though ANYBODY ever says or expects that. What is and should be expected at the P5 level is results.

Like Mark, I have been off the Dino bandwagon for several weeks now and should have been off at the end of last year. I am willing to wait until the end of the year to judge him going forward but his record to this point as it pertains to what is required of a coach at his level is poor. I know that somebody will say that winning shouldn't be the measuring stick and will point to other things but the fact is that this is the P5. If a coach wants to be judged mainly on "the other things", let him go coach for a lot less money in the Missouri Valley conference or DII. To whom much is given, much is expected.

Using winning % is an abstraction that disallows context.

When should he have been fired?

 

[SU94]

Okay, okay, I'm as frustrated as anyone about Dino and his in-game coaching woes. He has always had them, and they really haven't gotten a ton better. But I want everyone to try and look at this in a different way.

As the esteemed SWC75 has discussed numerous times here, Virginia Tech basically gave Frank Beamer an ultimatum - change your coordinators or we'll change the head coach. He did, Bud Foster came in, and the rest is history.

I actually think Dino has done what he needs to do on the assistant coach front.

1) Tony White seems like a solid DC and he firmly believes in getting a lot of guys playing time. That helps with depth and with growth. A very solid hire.
2) Swag Daddy is a dude this team can't afford to lose. Top-notch recruiter and has done a FANTASTIC job at coaching up the safeties and nickels. He has been here right along with Dino, and they need to do everything they can to keep him in the fold.
3) Chip West is a long-time top recruiter in the Delmarva area and has done well in recruiting and coaching up the corners.
4) Sterlin Gilbert is an OC that wants to run the ball. It's also what Dino wants to do. Unfortunately, the Offensive Line has always been too thin, or not up to ACC standards. This year he has a scheme, a QB, an RB, AND an OL that makes this approach work. Defenses look nervous and confused out there. They have to pick their poison.
5) Mike Schmidt is the solution to Sterlin's OL issue. The dude is a top-notch OL coach. He has coached up the young guys and also has done a great job getting the vets to play with more aggression out there. This OL is a huge reason why Tucker and Shrader are running so well. I've been watching replays of each game, and man they are road graders.
---

The assistants are in place to coach up players. That's exactly what SU needs. This will never be a destination for fully formed top-level D1 athletes. They need to be made into those through coaching and S&C. I'm encouraged by how this coaching staff is handling all the young players and is helping them develop. It bodes well for the future.

Dino is a great leader of men, off the field, in the locker room, and with his morals and beliefs about how a program should be run. I believe his values match what SU wants in a head coach. He is also beloved by the ACC press corps. I'm friends with quite a few of them, and they all love Dino. Great guy, a fun storyteller, a nice dude who takes the time to talk to these reporters. He's a great ambassador for SU and SU football.

His one glaring weakness isn't his inability to change. He's been willing to fire people on his staff and look for upgrades where he needs them. He almost always holds onto his recruiting classes because he creates a family atmosphere and is a trustworthy guy.

His one weakness is his cluelessness in in-game decision-making. He has actually impeded this team's progress by making (or not making) some decisions during the game. For whatever reason, he seems flustered and nervous about the type of decisions he makes in-game. It's obvious he's self-conscious about it given his presser on Monday. No dude with confidence in those abilities would say they did nothing wrong in-game. Someone with confidence is willing to say "Yep I made a mistake there but won't next time." He doth protest too much.

He needs someone to take over those decisions or needs to be hearing just one voice in his ear about what to do with things that run the gamut from calling timeouts, to taking or not taking penalties, to clock management, etc... Big picture game plans have been fine this year (with the possible exception of Rutgers). It's the in-game calls that are questionable.

Wildhack needs to get someone in here who can help focus Dino in making the right calls, and more than anything having a consistent attitude about how to handle game situations. What I mean by this is he needs someone to help him be more consistent in his decision-making process because currently, it seems as if a lot of his decisions are "fly by the seat of your pants" and not something that is a part of what they believe the culture of the team is. Are you going to be a riverboat gambler or a conservative coach who plays it close to the vest? What are the strengths of your team and the weaknesses and are you constantly going to take advantage of those strengths and weaknesses throughout the game and not just willy-nilly when the feeling hits?

I'm not sure who that person is or what their designation is, but he needs a Czar of In-Game Decision Making in the worst way. Let Dino have the final say, but make the czar be the one voice in his ear who pays attention to all of the above so Dino can make the most well-informed and analytical decision that the situation requires. Do that and I think this program starts cooking with grease.

This is well said. Name one coach not named Saban that really checks EVERY box? Serious question.

They all have strengths ... and weaknesses. Babers checks many boxes and there are a few unchecked, too. His time management is often lacking. His proclivity to go for it on 4th down seems to have disappeared. I'd offer that his passing offense is too linear, but for one week against Wake, that was not the case. So that might be improving. He's not the best recruiter, but he's fine there.

I wish everyone calling for Babers' job would realize that his replacement will also have his flaws. I really don't think Babers is going anywhere. He's going to be our HC next year, almost assuredly (>90%). Let's see what he can do with an average-to-plus O-Line and a plus quarterback, because when he has had both of those, he's done quite well.

Last thought: I did not like last year: 1-10. But that season, which is the primary root of most of his ills with the Fire Babers crowd, does not go off the rails if COVID never existed. You know the story, but context matters and I think too many here are not acknowledging the circumstances at play en route to 1-10. Babers certainly has some work to do and some of that entails looking in the mirror, but let's allow him to continue to keep building.

 

[David332]

Yeah, let’s put some thought into our posts.

Year 1: beat a ranked team! No one is expecting a winning season but that was fun

Year 2: beat the #2 team in the country, lose your starting QB to injury, no one thinks he should be fired

Year 3: first 10 win season in almost 30 years, maybe our HC will get poached? We should probably re-up him

Year 4: horrible, but maybe it will get better can’t fire him for a 4 win season after the first 3 years and right after a 10 win season

Year 5: Global pandemic has season in jeopardy, no camps, new OC/DC, all conference games and a ranked OOC … horrible play but no one is getting fired unless you want to set your chances of getting anyone good on fire

Year 6: In every game in the 4th Q, 3-3 start losing the last 2 on the last play. RB gets listed on some Heisman lists, QB change sparks running game, OL hire a home run. Near every metric improved. Real signs of a good team.

When was he supposed to get fired, exactly?

“He fixed a bunch of the things we were complaining about but we’re still losing by a tiny bit at the end and therefore we should ignore everything to blindly look at winning % and wave our hands at 50/50 calls in tight games” is the weakest of sauces

I’ve had my moments this season when I’ve wanted Dino fired but seeing it broken down like this, you definitely make a solid argument. He still has to get better with clock management though.

 

[CousCuse]

I'm more of the mindset that Gilbert's offense is the one we saw last year. The one we needed to start moving away from in 19.

IiRC, Lynch was on the field, last year, and now he's up in the booth with Gilbert. I wouldn't be surprised if its the, once normal, OC by committee that Babers has often used. Lynch as the running game coordinator? Also some option style runs that we've never seen before. Schmidt influence? Beats me.

I'm just thankful we've moved away from the 2 runs up the middle/30 yard bomb offense. Coaches are sometimes too stubborn. Finally, some green and growing. In the end, Babers is responsible for that shift. Whether its Gilbert, Lynch, Schmidt helping drive that? It doesn't matter to me. Babers is responsible.. It doesn't happen without Schmidt and Tucker, imo. Those are the 2 pieces most responsible for our now functioning offense. The 2 pieces we need back, next year.

Last year he had Devito, this year he got to get his own guy, Shrade. You can't think he could get his offense in place in 1 year with all the dysfunction of last year? Gildert grew up in west Texas and played college ball in west Texas and coached 3 high school teams in Texas. I can imagine he knows many of the people who run football in Texas and probably knows Mike Leach and that is how he got Shrader. Babers got Gilbert, yes, but he's the one not making the best decisions and costing the team games.

 

[chugg21]

I hate to think Gilbert has to leave and then goes on to be as successful as Hacket and Lester. Which I think he will. Gilbert is 42, same age as Hafley.

Where the hell is he going? Back to McNeese State? Gilbert has already flamed out badly in 2 prior major OC jobs. Comparing him to guys that were still on the rise is fairly pointless.

 

[Bayside44]

I think anytime you lose games on the last play of the game, your decisions weigh more and are looked at more critically. It’s no surprise that the rash of “he’s bad at in-game decisions” came after the last two games.

Yeah, it's really the coordinators that should say if the D can hold up another play, if the O should go for it, etc. This isn't going to be Alabama with 30 consultants.

 

[Bayside44]

True, and that's a good point but it also comes back to his decisions using timeouts and clock management which have been horrific, even you have to admit that. The choice to go for 2 or not is up in the air and one you can argue effectively either way but some of the other stuff is not. The bigger concern I think people have is that Babers publicly saying he agrees with all his decisions and wouldn't change a thing is a real bad sign and doesn't lead to much confidence in him getting right moving forward more times then not.

All sports are like that - any time some pitcher gives up a big hit they move on. The guys that don't and dwell on it tend to get ruined. Life in the windshield.

 

[chugg21]

I'm more of the mindset that Gilbert's offense is the one we saw last year. The one we needed to start moving away from in 19.

IiRC, Lynch was on the field, last year, and now he's up in the booth with Gilbert. I wouldn't be surprised if its the, once normal, OC by committee that Babers has often used. Lynch as the running game coordinator? Also some option style runs that we've never seen before. Schmidt influence? Beats me.

I'm just thankful we've moved away from the 2 runs up the middle/30 yard bomb offense. Coaches are sometimes too stubborn. Finally, some green and growing. In the end, Babers is responsible for that shift. Whether its Gilbert, Lynch, Schmidt helping drive that? It doesn't matter to me. Babers is responsible.. It doesn't happen without Schmidt and Tucker, imo. Those are the 2 pieces most responsible for our now functioning offense. The 2 pieces we need back, next year.

USF fans started a Fire Sterlin Gilbert drive back when I lived in Tampa for the same reasons.

 

[CousCuse]

Where the hell is he going? Back to McNeese State? Gilbert has already flamed out badly in 2 prior major OC jobs. Comparing him to guys that were still on the rise is fairly pointless.

His head coach flamed out at those jobs. I think he took the McNeese HC job to get on the track of being a head coach. He was 7-5 there in one year and if he gets a big year in year 2, he would get a G5 job, then P5 if he put together a solid team at say North Texas. I'm just saying if the Dino experiment doesn't work out, keep the OC, which if SU had done with one of the 3 previous OC's, I think we would all be happier right now.