cooney 3 pt stats (outlier city)

[Fly Rodder]

"I don't want a one-dimensional offense, I want a diversified offense that can beat teams in a lot of different ways"

Agreed and especially the point about Duke is key. Those guys were burying threes against Mercer, but they couldn't hit enough to win because Mercer was killing them on inside/outside passes and cuts and their big slow guys who could catch the ball.

 

[RF2044]

What you want is a shooter who is consistently around 33-34% from 3 pt area with a hot games +10 points and few cold games -10 points. The problem with Cooney is he has way too many poor shooting games where he can't make anything. That problem is compounded in importance for SU because he is the only real 3 pt threat on the floor. If we had 1 or 2 other decent 3 pt threats, his off games wouldn't be fatal.

Agreed. In 2010 or 2o12 [for example]--our two peak years for having capable scoring off the bench--if one of our players was having an off-game, JB had the luxury of subbing them out for another capable scorer. Players have ups and downs in various games--no player is consistently good every game, even star players. But being able to sub in a Dion Waiters for Triche or Scoop goes a long way toward rectifying not being locked into a player who is performing poorly any given night.

Not only did we lack that luxury this season, but the bench was woefully inexperienced. Next year, it isn't difficult to envision current frosh like the Three Sons and Gbinije being contributors who help improve the shooting, but also who give JB options. Options that we lacked this year [for a variety of reasons, some of which are on JB].

 

[Cusefan0307]

Agreed. In 2010 or 2o12 [for example]--our two peak years for having capable scoring off the bench--if one of our players was having an off-game, JB had the luxury of subbing them out for another capable scorer. Players have ups and downs in various games--no player is consistently good every game, even star players. But being able to sub in a Dion Waiters for Triche or Scoop goes a long way toward rectifying not being locked into a player who is performing poorly any given night.

Not only did we lack that luxury this season, but the bench was woefully inexperienced. Next year, it isn't difficult to envision current frosh like the Three Sons and Gbinije being contributors who help improve the shooting, but also who give JB options. Options that we lacked this year [for a variety of reasons, some of which are on JB].

Just a hunch, and I agree we didn't have options, but I don't think at the beginning of last season JB thought there was any realm of possibility MCW would be in the NBA this year. If that were the case, we would of had the normal three guard rotation we usually have. I believe that is why we are with one point guard now, and why we could possibly be in the same predicament next year.

 

[Millhouse]

Wow, we were last in the ACC as a team. Explain why.

The shooting guards couldn't score

Assists require people to make shots

 

[rrlbees]

The shooting guards couldn't score Assists require people to make shots

That's a part but not all of it. You always defer to your standard singular answer. Very myopic.

 

[rrlbees]

The shooting guards couldn't score Assists require people to make shots

Here's some data. First, we weren't last in the ACC in assists. I read the wrong column. We were 11th, still bad. But if Cooney had made 1 more 3 a game, he would have shot 52% for the year. Excellent. Let's assume every single additional 3 was a pass from someone for an assist. Those additional assists with Cooney shooting 52% would have moved us from 11th to 10th. Yippee.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Here's some data. First, we weren't last in the ACC in assists. I read the wrong column. We were 11th, still bad. But if Cooney had made 1 more 3 a game, he would have shot 52% for the year. Excellent. Let's assume every single additional 3 was a pass from someone for an assist. Those additional assists with Cooney shooting 52% would have moved us from 11th to 10th. Yippee.

Can't debate with people who don't listen.

 

[CorduroyG]

bees why isnt anyone allowed to criticize cooney?

 

[ORRange]

The 2G must be able to break down a defender and get to the rim. I don't know if Trevor can, but I do know he won't. He is the most one dimensional 2G since Matt Roe (though Matt was a force from the 3pt land). Trevor needs to improve his driving ability over the summer because his inability to score points from the foul line is a huge liability to the team. IMO, this is a much bigger question mark than his 3pt% or lack of.

 

[CorduroyG]

cooney was unbelievable in the non conference. pretty bad for most of the conference schedule with the exception of a couple games. and pretty much god awful the last month. JB is a very loyal coach, he stuck with cooney all year, but who did he have in the game at the end with the season on the line? it wasnt cooney, and that speaks volumes about just how bad hes been playing.

 

[rrlbees]

bees why isnt anyone allowed to criticize cooney?

I'm using facts. Is there an issue with that? My responses are to those who think our problem was singular vs plural with many causes and effects. You have anything useful to add?

 

[iommi]

Cooney shot out of his mind in one game (ND). Other than that, he did not shoot well in the ACC portion of the schedule.

 

[Alsacs]

I'm using facts. Is there an issue with that? My responses are to those who think our problem was singular vs plural with many causes and effects. You have anything useful to add?

I will take that as directed at me.y opinion is not personal as I respect any kid who puts on the Syracuse jersey but if JB is only going to play 7 guys and one of them plays awful for close to 1/3 of the season including the most important portion I am going to be honest. The biggest problem with our offense was the SG position.
As it relates to the last game I said before the 2nd half started I would have started Gbinije from the start of the half. I went back and analyzed it we were -11 points with Cooney on the floor and +8 with Gbinije against Dayton.
I have been saying Cooney improve over the next 2 years but JB playing him 30+ mpg was not the right then when he was struggling I would have played him 25 to 30 depending on his shot and giving Silent G 15 to 25 mpg depending on Ennis needing a blow.

Cooney was not the only reason we struggled on offense but I would say he was the top reason. You can blame JB for giving the keys to just 2 guards and not having an experienced backup but you would tell me I am wrong again likely.

 

[rrlbees]

I will take that as directed at me.y opinion is not personal as I respect any kid who puts on the Syracuse jersey but if JB is only going to play 7 guys and one of them plays awful for close to 1/3 of the season including the most important portion I am going to be honest. The biggest problem with our offense was the SG position. As it relates to the last game I said before the 2nd half started I would have started Gbinije from the start of the half. I went back and analyzed it we were -11 points with Cooney on the floor and +8 with Gbinije against Dayton. I have been saying Cooney improve over the next 2 years but JB playing him 30+ mpg was not the right then when he was struggling I would have played him 25 to 30 depending on his shot and giving Silent G 15 to 25 mpg depending on Ennis needing a blow. Cooney was not the only reason we struggled on offense but I would say he was the top reason. You can blame JB for giving the keys to just 2 guards and not having an experienced backup but you would tell me I am wrong again likely.

It wasn't directed at anyone.

 

[SWC75]

Two cars collide at an intersection. What happened? I don't know. I'm not placing blame, but it's not the fault of the guy driving the Chevy. Why doesn't anyone talk about the guy driving the Ford?

It's on the players (failure to execute) or the coach (failure to plan), but they're not mutually exclusive. There's a reason this team couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. In trying to figure out where things went wrong, hopefully they can correct the issues and improve. Using Cooney's assist total is decent evidence that the offense was pretty one-dimensional and therefore predictable. CJ took the most shots since Carmelo because there was no one else who could make plays. That was his role. If JAB wanted him to pass more, I'm sure he would have. This is the offense that they practiced. It was pretty awful to watch. Could it have been better if a different offense was run where there was more ball movement and kickouts? I don't know. Maybe. But posters can't criticize the plan or the players. So I guess it's just a pointless exercise anyway.

Some highlights of our season:

 

[reedny]

Fair went from being perhaps the most consistent and efficient SU player ever, to the opposite.

Because he's more effective as a complimentary player, as opposed to the go-to scorer. He killed teams when he was option 2 or 3, but as the 'man' and the focus of the other team's defensive game-plan, he struggled at times. Still one of my favorite kids to play all 4 YEARS for SU, and will be a great ambassador for the program.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Because he's more effective as a complimentary player, as opposed to the go-to scorer. He killed teams when he was option 2 or 3, but as the 'man' and the focus of the other team's defensive game-plan, he struggled at times. Still one of my favorite kids to play all 4 YEARS for SU, and will be a great ambassador for the program.

Absolutely.

 

[SWC75]

I still think our offense is too "vertical"- three pointers or drives to hoop. There should be more emphasis on getting open for any kind of shot, which creates more movement of both offensive and defensive players and opens up more opportunities for drives and kick-outs. And players need to be more willing to pass the ball when their drives are stopped. Hit the open man.

 

[Ghost]

You discount the fact it is easier to score the closer to the basket you get. A real good center will shoot 60%, a real good 3 point shooter will shoot 40%. Plus for all shooters, volume comes into play especially when the volume gets closer to the basket.

Hey, someone just called Rak a real good Center!!

Unheard of!

 

[SUFan44]

Here's some data. First, we weren't last in the ACC in assists. I read the wrong column. We were 11th, still bad. But if Cooney had made 1 more 3 a game, he would have shot 52% for the year. Excellent. Let's assume every single additional 3 was a pass from someone for an assist. Those additional assists with Cooney shooting 52% would have moved us from 11th to 10th. Yippee.

Here's some data. Cooney shot 10-for-51 (19.6%) from three-point range in his final 8 games of the season against BCS-caliber competition (I'll say Dayton is BCS caliber for argument's sake, take out Western Michigan who clearly was not). 30.7% FG overall over that stretch.

You talk about him coming off curls, and that not many other shooters do that as often - that certainly wasn't a problem for him earlier on in the year, was it? Did the offense change that much? Also, he missed just as many off curls/fades as he did wide open 3's in transition or following offensive rebounds. Go back and take a look at the tape.

You are trying to make it not all about Cooney - I get it. It wasn't just him. CJ Fair was probably a bigger reason we were not effective offensively this year. But he isn't completely absolved from his abysmal performance down the stretch of the season. It's not just about the other guys, either.

 

[Ghost]

How many of those passes do you think Rak finished on?

Hey, you said shooting over 60% was a really good center! So, probably a ton!

 

[Trueblue25]

Cooney's woeful.

I was absolutely berated at the beginning to the season for saying that G may be more valuable to the team starting. G is not a great player yet, but he gives us more than Cooney.

Cooney's defense is subpar, despite his high steals average. He's not a good passer. He hardly creates opportunities for other players. He can't create his own opportunities and he's not the FT shooter many of you are convinced he is. I'd be disappointed if a SG took just 60 fts in an entire season and didn't shoot above 80%.

Cooney will start next year but don't be surprised when he loses minutes to Buss and Gbinije.

BJ Johnson will be too big for the 2 next year, at least thats my prediction. His father could probably correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Cooney shot out of his mind in one game (ND). Other than that, he did not shoot well in the ACC portion of the schedule.

That's incorrect. I did an analysis of this today. His last 9 games were bad. 14-63. We were 3-6 and he was 6-37 in our 6 losses. He had some 3-7s, 3-8s, and 2-6s in the ACC which are considered good for a three point shooter.

 

[iommi]

That's incorrect. I did an analysis of this today. His last 9 games were bad. 14-63. We were 3-6 and he was 6-37 in our 6 losses. He had some 3-7s, 3-8s, and 2-6s in the ACC which are considered good for a three point shooter.

2-6 is good? Sorry, 33.3% is not good.

 

[Cusefan0307]

2-6 is good? Sorry, 33.3% is not good.

So 50 percent 2 point shooting isn't good! Because that's what 33 percent three point shooting equals (1 pt per shot). If we go by that standard Gerry McNamara wasn't a good shooter. He barely was over that. He shot 35 percent for his career.