Cooney expectations

[Antiprodigy]

How well Cooney plays defense, will determine how much he plays. seems like comments from practice prior to last season, was that his defense was lacking. As an SU fan, i desperately hope that the light bulb has turned on and he is capable of playing at least solid defense. Otherwise, the team will struggle because BT and MCW will be forced into more minutes than they will be capable of productively playing.

 

[SoBristol]

Some of the arguments don't ring true with me: BT is a senior, therefore . . .; or Cooney is only a red-shirt, therefore . . .

Andy Rautins did not get better merely by becoming a senior. He got better because he added muscle to his frame, played PG for the Canadian national team in international competition, and rounded out his skills (passing and defensive anticipation). As a soph, Fab improved his fitness and lost 20 lbs. Dion came back with a new attitude.

How much will Cooney (or BT or MCW) change (physically) and improve (skills) from now through November? Which skills? Do they have room to improve, or are they maxed out (as BT might be, physically)?

Cooney needs to be stronger, add to his dribble moves, find the open man, set up the bigs. He can already shoot. If you know how much he will improve (I don't), you can guess his minutes.

 

[OrangeZone]

Trevor will need developmental time; he will need to get as many minutes as his skills plus JB's need for him to develop. In one year we've gone from guard heavy to guard light; not due to a lack of talent but limited bodies.​

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[RMH44]

Trevor will need developmental time; he will need to get as many minutes as his skills plus JB's need for him to develop. In one year we've gone from guard heavy to guard light; not due to a lack of talent but limited bodies.​

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This thread is crazy...TC will see significant pt and may well end-up as one of our more dependable players by season's end. He is far more athletic and skilled than most here think.

TC totally bought into his RS status and worked his butt off on the court and in the weight room. A very reliable source told me that, at times, he dominated practices last season. TC is the least of our worries next year.

 

[albanycuse]

This thread is crazy...TC will see significant pt and may well end-up as one of our more dependable players by season's end. He is far more athletic and skilled than most here think.

TC totally bought into his RS status and worked his butt off on the court and in the weight room. A very reliable source told me that, at times, he dominated practices last season. TC is the least of our worries next year.

Ya im with you, i heard he put on solid muscle as well.

 

[br801]

Ya im with you, i heard he put on solid muscle as well.

Correct. My sources tell me he now makes Dwight Howard look like Don Knotts.

 

[albanycuse]

Correct. My sources tell me he now makes Dwight Howard look like Don Knotts.

Happy fathers day weekend!

 

[br801]

Happy fathers day weekend!

Thanks, same to you and all the other dads out there.

 

[RMH44]

Correct. My sources tell me he now makes Dwight Howard look like Don Knotts.

Don Knotts was actually pretty buff when he starred in "The Incredible Mr. Limpet".

 

[br801]

Don Knotts was actually pretty buff when he starred in "The Incredible Mr. Limpet".

Knotts was brilliant in that film, but I thought his finest work came in "The Shakiest Gun in the West" and as Ralph Furley in "Three's Company."

 

[moqui]

highlight packages are just that - all the bad stuff is filtered out.

Never having seen the kid actually play, most of our opinions are just wild-assed guesses. But, in an email conversation with Rob Harrington last year (well, I guess closer to a year and a half ago now), he told me that Cooney had a great stroke but also had very questionable shot selection (which is probably why GMac loves him so much ) and didn't really have high level athleticism. The latter shouldn't hurt him so much in the Syracuse system, at least on the defensive end, but he is going to have to work hard coming off of screens and on curls to get looks. I would expect steady improvement over the course of his career - i.e., more of an Andy Rautins trajectory than a GMac-like immediate contributor.

FWIW, as I have mentioned on this forum before, in the same email conversation, Harrington predicted that Rak was going to be an absolute stud for SU by his 2nd or 3rd year.

 

[albanycuse]

highlight packages are just that - all the bad stuff is filtered out.

Never having seen the kid actually play, most of our opinions are just wild-assed guesses. But, in an email conversation with Rob Harrington last year (well, I guess closer to a year and a half ago now), he told me that Cooney had a great stroke but also had very questionably shot selection (which is probably why GMac loves him so much) and didn't really have high level athleticism. The latter shouldn't hurt him so much in the Syracuse system, at least on the defensive end, but he is going to have to work hard coming off of screens and on curls to get looks. I would expect steady improvement over the course of his career - i.e., more of an Andy Rautins trajectory than a GMac-like immediate contributor.

FWIW, as I have mentioned on this forum before, in the same email conversation, Harrington predicted that Rak was going to be an absolute stud for SU by his 2nd or 3rd year.

Agree that highlight packages are filtered obviuosly but i dont know any player that would put bad plays in there. Gotta disagree with you on peoples wild ass guesses here because some people here are a lot better at assessing players than others. Theres skill involved, people watch the same game but see totally different things.

 

[moqui]

Agree that highlight packages are filtered obviuosly but i dont know any player that would put bad plays in there. Gotta disagree with you on peoples wild ass guesses here because some people here are a lot better at assessing players than others. Theres skill involved, people watch the same game but see totally different things.

you count on the fingers of one hand the number of posters who have actually watched a full game of incoming players, let alone several games.

all the rest of us are making WAGs . . . except of course for those who are just making stuff up.

 

[albanycuse]

you count on the fingers of one hand the number of posters who have actually watched a full game of incoming players, let alone several games.

all the rest of us are making WAGs . . . except of course for those who are just making stuff up.

I dont know anyone that makes stuff up i dont see any point but i see what you mean moe qwee? Is that how you say it? Whats moqui anyway there buddy?

 

[moqui]

the Moqui are a group of cliff dwelling natives in the US southwest. I took the name from moqui balls, natural iron balls that gather in weird rivers in the desert. The local tribes believe that the moqui balls contain the spirits of their departed loved ones.

 

[albanycuse]

the Moqui are a group of cliff dwelling natives in the US southwest. I took the name from moqui balls, natural iron balls that gather in weird rivers in the desert. The local tribes believe that the moqui balls contain the spirits of their departed loved ones.

So you have an infatuation with balls, nice : )

 

[reedny]

Hey, it's a "Round ball" forum... (don't forget to tip your waitress).

But seriously, folks, for some added perspective on TC, it's interesting to follow up SoB's post and compare him to Rautins, who started out as a spindly (insert racial cliche') kid and ended up a deadly shooter with a brief tenure in the NBA. When Andy came in, he was listed at 6'6" (generously) and 175. His freshman year he shot .326 from 3. By his senior year 5 years later (with a RS year in 07-08), he was supposedly shorter (lol) but 30 pounds heavier, at 6'5 205, with a .407% 3pt percentage (.374 for his career). He turned out to be a very heady player with NBA shooting range, who also played pretty decent defense (averaging 2 steals p/g in 32.5 mpg/36.4 BE)). http://www.suathletics.com/sports/2005/11/15/mbbstats05-06.aspx

TC looks somewhat like Andy did in 05/06 -- at 6'4", 185. He's probably a little ahead of Andy physically at the same stage. TC took his rs early, Andy I think in his 3d year (rehabbing a knee he blew out trying to guard Rondo). Since he's healthy, TC arrives with the advantage of a rs year to get to know the system, play against Waiters, Scoop and BT in practice every day and bulk up in a college weight program. We have yet to see what kind of defender he is, if he has any explosion to the rim or speed in transition, how he plays the pick and roll and uses screens generally, whether he's confined to spot-up shooting (Andy's bread and butter) or can drive by BE level defenders and create offense off the bounce, and if he has the vision to be able to set up his teammates when he draws defensive attention.

As I said earlier, he'll have (by my rough estimate) 18-20 minutes of PT available to show his stuff. Since he'll be sharing the guard rotation with only 2 other players, he'll get as many of those minutes as JB thinks he's worth.

 

[orangefan13]

Triche, MCW can blow up this year and be first/second/third team all big east. As could CJ, Southerland, Rak maybe even DC2.

Cooney probably wouldn't get a spot like that even if he earned it just cause hes a sophmore without a AA next to his name. Only a top 60 player not a top 30 which means nothing as all cuse fans know. But, make no mistake he to has a shot to say I belong atleast on a third team BE this year if he becomes a true go to scorer.

Thats a pretty good position to be sitting in though. Most big east teams have 1 maybe 2, and on a rare occasion 3 that could make a all big east team. And they know who they arem rather then guessing who out of their lineup. We honestly have 5(at the least) to 6 I would say. And a big part of that is Triche and Southerland are seniors, CJ is more skilled then both as a Freshmen and Sophmore, and Rak, DC2 and MCW are All Americans. Thats sitting pretty.
SUball

 

[OrangeZone]

This thread is crazy...TC will see significant pt and may well end-up as one of our more dependable players by season's end. He is far more athletic and skilled than most here think.

TC totally bought into his RS status and worked his butt off on the court and in the weight room. A very reliable source told me that, at times, he dominated practices last season. TC is the least of our worries next year.

Reading is fundamental; my post was no slam on Trevor;he will get plenty of minutes and when a player first get numerous minutes in his career there is a learning cuve; even for the best.

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

Triche has had probably 4 or 5 memorable performances over his 107 starts. I believe Cooney/MCW could end up our best backcourt combo by years end.

Triche has proven that he is extremely average in every facet of the game. Its no shoe-in that he turns into a stud this year.

 

[RMH44]

Reading is fundamental; my post was no slam on Trevor;he will get plenty of minutes and when a player first get numerous minutes in his career there is a learning cuve; even for the best.

Yes it is...and I clearly stated that the "thread" was crazy...not your post.

 

[moqui]

Triche has proven that he is extremely average in every facet of the game.

he has been the all-around best defensive guard for 2 years running

btw, isn't "extremely average" an oxymoron?

 

[OrangeZone]

Yes it is...and I clearly stated that the "thread" was crazy...not your post.

My apology.

 

[Oakland]

Triche has had probably 4 or 5 memorable performances over his 107 starts. I believe Cooney/MCW could end up our best backcourt combo by years end.

Triche has proven that he is extremely average in every facet of the game. Its no shoe-in that he turns into a stud this year.

Average what? College player? Div I guard? BEC guard? Starting BEC guard? Starting SU guard? Average all-frosh BEC guard? Average BEC all-frosh rookie, SU starter in the BEC for 3 yrs guard? Average what?

 

[albanycuse]

he has been the all-around best defensive guard for 2 years running

btw, isn't "extremely average" an oxymoron?

Gotta disagree dion kicked his defense up a notch last season unmatched by anyone, although triche is no slouch, hes solid as well, but best overall i think not moqui balls.