Death, taxes and another Duke #1 recruiting class | Page 3 | Syracusefan.com

Death, taxes and another Duke #1 recruiting class

OrangeDW said:
Yeah, somethings fishy about that as far as Kentucky/Calipari.

Duke changed its whole strategy. They don’t recruit mostly rich, preppy kids anymore.
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Think Cal tells the kids what they want to hear. NBA. Coach K started recruitied one and domes because it worked for Cal.
 
Big difference between signing Rasheed Sulaimon/Austin Rivers/Plumlees/Quinn Cook in 2011/12 to signing Parker/Tatum/Winslow/Okafor/Barrett/Zion recently.

Duke got sick of the attention UK and Cal were getting and went full Pete Bell IMO.
 
OrangeDW said:
I feel like they’ve drafted well. Problem is the two best guys they drafted in the last 5 years aren’t on the team anymore.

I still like Ingram’s chances to be a star. He was really playing great when he got hurt.
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That Ingram thrombosis thing is possibly career ending. Lonzo is a bust.
 
Cusefan0307 said:
Big difference between signing Rasheed Sulaimon/Austin Rivers/Plumlees/Quinn Cook in 2011/12 to signing Parker/Tatum/Winslow/Okafor/Barrett/Zion recently.

Duke got sick of the attention UK and Cal were getting and went full Pete Bell IMO.
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Austin Rivers was #3 in his class. Sulaimion #12. Kyrie Irving #3 the year before that. Kyle Singler #4 a couple years before that.

They may have had a couple not great classes, but they have always gotten top talent and McDonald’s AA’s.
 
kirbivore said:
That Ingram thrombosis thing is possibly career ending. Lonzo is a bust.
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Lonzo is a bust but Ingram can play..

I will be interested though to see who gets a max between Ingram and Jaylen Brown.

No doubt Tatum, Mitchell and even Kuzma are better from the same draft than Ball though.
 
AlpharettaCuse said:
Austin Rivers was #3 in his class. Sulaimion #12. Kyrie Irving #3 the year before that. Kyle Singler #4 a couple years before that.

They may have had a couple great classes, but they have always gotten top talent and McDonald’s AA’s.
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Singler was 2007. Irving 2010. Rivers was 2011. They were not the same as now, nor were they anything close to being the best players in their class. Cal wasn’t even established at UK yet. They weren’t getting multiple top 10 guys every year like UK was when Cal got there and pulled in his classes from 2009 to 2014. There’s definitely smoke there.
 
According to 2 -4-7. This is as far back as their rankings go:
2003 - Kentucky - 23, Duke - 66 (Cuse - 9, btw)
2004 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 11
2005 - Kentucky - 22, Duke - 2
2006 - Kentucky - 10, Duke - 5
2007 - Kentucky - 9, Duke - 11 (Cuse- 3, btw)
2008 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 14
2009 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 20
2010 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 16 (Cuse - 4, btw)
2011 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 2
2012 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 41
2013 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 9 (Cuse -8)
2014 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2015 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 2 (Cuse - 8)
2016 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2017 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2018 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2019 - Kentucky - 3, Duke - 1
 
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Cusefan0307 said:
Singler was 2007. Irving 2010. Rivers was 2011. They were not the same as now, nor were they anything close to being the best players in their class. Cal wasn’t even established at UK yet. They weren’t getting multiple top 10 guys every year like UK was when Cal got there and pulled in his classes from 2009 to 2014. There’s definitely smoke there.
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I know they are all different classes. They always get Top 5-10 kids like Singler, Kyrie, and Austin Rivers. What changed? K embraced the one and done philosophy.
 
OrangeDW said:
Embraced the 1 and done’s philosophy by...paying the price?
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No, not necessarily. By doing what Cal did. Preaching NBA opportunity. Duke has a bunch of players in the NBA.
 
OrangeDW said:
According to 2 -4-7. This is as far back as their rankings go:
2003 - Kentucky - 23, Duke - 66 (Cuse - 9, btw)
2004 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 11
2005 - Kentucky - 22, Duke - 2
2006 - Kentucky - 10, Duke - 5
2007 - Kentucky - 9, Duke - 11 (Cuse- 3, btw)
2008 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 14
2009 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 20
2010 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 16 (Cuse - 4, btw)
2011 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 2
2012 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 41
2013 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 9 (Cuse -8)
2014 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2015 - Kentucky - 1, Duke - 2 (Cuse - 8)
2016 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2017 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2018 - Kentucky - 2, Duke - 1
2019 - Kentucky - 3, Duke - 1
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I wonder what Jeff Capel did for K?
 
OrangeDW said:
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I mean, let me know when you have something concrete to go on. Until then I’ll point to Duke’s history, coach, stadium, fans, media coverage, and history of fantastic recruiting over the last 40 years.

Over the last three decades:

• Duke has landed four McDonald’s All-Americans three times — 1999 (Carlos Boozer, Jason Williams, Mike Dunleavy, Casey Sanders), 2002 (Sean Dockery, J.J. Redick, Shavlik Randolph, Michael Thompson) and 2014 (Jahlil Okafor, Tyus Jones, Justise Winslow, Grayson Allen).

• Duke has had three McDonald’s All-Americans seven times — 1994 (Trajan Langdon, Ricky Price, Steve Wojciechowski), 1997 (Elton Brand, Shane Battier, Chris Burgess), 2005 (Greg Paulus, Josh McRoberts, Eric Boateng), 2006 (Jon Scheyer, Lance Thomas, Gerald Henderson), 2007 (Kyle Singler, Taylor King, Nolan Smith), 2011 (Austin Rivers, Quinn Cook, Marshall Plumlee), 2015 (Luke Kennard, Brandon Ingram, Chase Jeter).

• Duke has had two McDonald’s All-Americans nine times — 1983 (Amaker, Nessley), 1985 (Ferry, Snyder), 1986 (Phil Henderson, Alaa Abdelnaby), 1988 (Christian Laettner, Crawford Palmer), 1989 (Bobby Hurley, Billy McCaffrey), 2009 (Mason Plumlee, Ryan Kelly), 2012 (Rasheed Sulaimon, Amile Jefferson), 2013 (Jabari Parker, Matt Jones), 2016 (Jackson, Tatum).
 
A couple other factors that have not really been discussed.

1. Perhaps kids just like the super-team aspect. People saw it with Lebron & Co in Miami, and later with GSW, Houston, OKC, etc... Now there's a trickle-down effect. The AAU impact and the relationships it builds likely facilitates these super-teams. Also, the fake high schools that are really glorified basketball factories plays a huge role. Oak Hill has been around forever along with a couple others, but now it seems that the concentration of top kids going to powerhouse schools is out of control; La Lumiere, IMG, Bishop Gorman, etc... etc...

2. Classes for Duke & Kentucky are simply larger, on average, than traditional recruiting classes. They are actually larger everywhere due to all the transfer activity that increases every year seemingly. There is simply so much attrition that recruiting classes of 5-6 people are standard. In the "old days" the typical class would be 3 people (13/4). Iirc, the NCAA at one time actually had limits as to how many scholarships a school could hand out over a designated period of time.
 
AlpharettaCuse said:
I mean, let me know when you have something concrete to go on. Until then I’ll point to Duke’s history, coach, stadium, fans, media coverage, and history of fantastic recruiting over the last 40 years.

Over the last three decades:

• Duke has landed four McDonald’s All-Americans three times — 1999 (Carlos Boozer, Jason Williams, Mike Dunleavy, Casey Sanders), 2002 (Sean Dockery, J.J. Redick, Shavlik Randolph, Michael Thompson) and 2014 (Jahlil Okafor, Tyus Jones, Justise Winslow, Grayson Allen).

• Duke has had three McDonald’s All-Americans seven times — 1994 (Trajan Langdon, Ricky Price, Steve Wojciechowski), 1997 (Elton Brand, Shane Battier, Chris Burgess), 2005 (Greg Paulus, Josh McRoberts, Eric Boateng), 2006 (Jon Scheyer, Lance Thomas, Gerald Henderson), 2007 (Kyle Singler, Taylor King, Nolan Smith), 2011 (Austin Rivers, Quinn Cook, Marshall Plumlee), 2015 (Luke Kennard, Brandon Ingram, Chase Jeter).

• Duke has had two McDonald’s All-Americans nine times — 1983 (Amaker, Nessley), 1985 (Ferry, Snyder), 1986 (Phil Henderson, Alaa Abdelnaby), 1988 (Christian Laettner, Crawford Palmer), 1989 (Bobby Hurley, Billy McCaffrey), 2009 (Mason Plumlee, Ryan Kelly), 2012 (Rasheed Sulaimon, Amile Jefferson), 2013 (Jabari Parker, Matt Jones), 2016 (Jackson, Tatum).
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Rather than pointing out the random great players they’ve had, I’ll go on the year to year history that I posted above. I think that tells a pretty striking story.

From 2003-2013, they had just 3 top 10 classes. 3 in 11 years. Since then they’ve been number 1 in 5 out of 6 years. Odd.
 
OrangeDW said:
Rather than pointing out the random great players they’ve had, I’ll go on the year to year history that I posted above. I think that tells a pretty striking story.

From 2003-2013, they had just 3 top 10 classes. 3 in 11 years. Since then they’ve been number 1 in 5 out of 6 years. Odd.
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I pointed out the many great classes they had before the last 6 years which included 2, 3 and 4 McDonald’s AA’s dating back to 1983.

It’s not odd at all. K has changed his recruiting philosophy to focus on one and done players. That means more kids leaving for the NBA after one season. Which means they are being replaced by more 1 and dones. Who leave for the NBA. Only to be replaced by more 1 and dones. Who leave for the NBA. That’s the reason Duke and UK are always 1 and 2 every year.
 
AlpharettaCuse said:
I pointed out the many great classes they had before the last 6 years which included 3 and 4 McDonald’s AA’s dating back to 1985.

It’s not odd at all. K has changed his recruiting philosophy to focus on one and done players. That means more kids leaving for the NBA after one season. Which means they are being replaced by more 1 and dones. Who leave for the NBA. Only to be replaced by more 1 and dones. That’s the reason Duke and UK are always 1 and 2 every year.
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How come nobody else can do that?
 
OrangeDW said:
Rather than pointing out the random great players they’ve had, I’ll go on the year to year history that I posted above. I think that tells a pretty striking story.

From 2003-2013, they had just 3 top 10 classes. 3 in 11 years. Since then they’ve been number 1 in 5 out of 6 years. Odd.
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A Jeff Capel associate was/is the bag man IMO. He was hired in 2011 at Duke after leaving Oklahoma. He left Oklahoma because he was fired because Oklahoma was paying one of their players. An assistant coach knew about it and Capel himself weaseled his way out of it all and didn’t get any punishment.

Part of the reason he left Oklahoma was he got fired for that. Then he goes to Duke. Duke up to that point, the only one-and-done guy they had was Kyrie Irving. After that, Capel joins the staff and they start rattling off all these one-and-done guys.

I don’t blame kids at all for taking bags. These schools make millions off them. If the NCAA won’t go after you as they won’t with Duke IMO you do it.
 
Alsacs said:
A Jeff Capel associate was/is the bag man IMO. He was hired in 2011 at Duke after leaving Oklahoma. He left Oklahoma because he was fired because Oklahoma was paying one of their players. An assistant coach knew about it and Capel himself weaseled his way out of it all and didn’t get any punishment.

Part of the reason he left Oklahoma was he got fired for that. Then he goes to Duke. Duke up to that point, the only one-and-done guy they had was Kyrie Irving. After that, Capel joins the staff and they start rattling off all these one-and-done guys.

I don’t blame kids at all for taking bags. These schools make millions off them. If the NCAA won’t go after you as they won’t with Duke IMO you do it.
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Capel has been gone a couple years. Who’s the new bag man? Lol
 
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