Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

[shandeezy7]

Whether you like or hate the mall or Congel or whoever, I think it's safe to say they've done their market research and felt it was worth spending millions to try to save 81. Everyone on here proclaims to be an expert in this stuff.

They are defaulting on loan payments with full access to 81 through the city currently. Methinks maybe they have other problems that need solving that are affecting their bottom line far more than this.

 

[Atlcuse44]

People are so soft these days. When I was younger and lived up there, I ran the gauntlet down Hiawatha past the sewage treatment plant with its aromatic emissions to get to Carousel/Hooters.

 

[longtimefan]

They are defaulting on loan payments with full access to 81 through the city currently. Methinks maybe they have other problems that need solving that are affecting their bottom line far more than this.

Sorta like the Wizard of Oz. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain." Classic misdirection.

 

[Cusefan0307]

One thing that is certain is the suburbs should have zero say what happens to 81. Those same people would have a fit if the city had any say in their planning or development.

 

[shandeezy7]

I know this isn't the OT board, but this takedown of Katko and his I-81 flip-flopping is worth posting. Click on it for the whole thread.

 

[CuseOnly]

Will there be one in both directions? They're not worried about people that already don't mind dealing with Syracuse traffic, like the people on this board that go to SU games frequently or live 5 miles away. They're worried about the people that live 30+ miles away that didn't mind going as long as it was convenient. If it becomes inconvenient for them, they may choose to go elsewhere. That's business they don't want to lose.

Where else are they gonna go exactly when those traffic lights or 8 miles at 70mph are too inconvenient...Great Northern is gone, same with Shoppingtown and Penn Can...

Sangertown? Erie Blvd? Where?

I'll wait.

 

[KellySyracuse]

I know this isn't the OT board, but this takedown of Katko and his I-81 flip-flopping is worth posting. Click on it for the whole thread.

it looks like the tweet has been deleted, can you post who wrote it?

Edit: nevermind, I got it.

 

[Newhouser]

The Congels won't give up. This actually worries me a bit. We all know that at the end of the day in the American political system, money always wins.

Destiny USA takes I-81 battle to Washington, hires lobbyist linked to Trump

so after this gets them nowhere - do they file some sort of legal action when the official decision is made?

 

[shandeezy7]

so after this gets them nowhere - do they file some sort of legal action when the official decision is made?

I figured whichever option was chosen, there would be lawsuits galore from the opposition. Maybe this project will actually get done before the viaduct collapses and kills a bunch of people.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I figured whichever option was chosen, there would be lawsuits galore from the opposition. Maybe this project will actually get done before the viaduct collapses and kills a bunch of people.

The one reason I think Congel has a small fighting chance: Trump can't stand Cuomo. If the lobbyists paint this as a way to spite Andy, it wouldn't shock me if the feds only support funding for the tunnel.

If Congel was able to overturn it, the liberals would then file legal appeals. Cries of social injustice and racism.
Nothing is going to happen for years, no matter which side you are on.

 

[Newhouser]

The one reason I think Congel has a small fighting chance: Trump can't stand Cuomo. If the lobbyists paint this as a way to spite Andy, it wouldn't shock me if the feds only support funding for the tunnel.

If Congel was able to overturn it, the liberals would then file legal appeals. Cries of social injustice and racism.
Nothing is going to happen for years, no matter which side you are on.

is Destiny still a viable entity when the project is finished?

 

[jr4750]

is Destiny still a viable entity when the project is finished?

Perhaps, if they adapt, but it's certainly not a slam dunk. Here's an example.

Malls are filling their empty spaces with doctor's offices

As malls search for innovative ways to draw in shoppers and fill empty storefronts, they are turning to unexpected partners: health clinics.

www.cnn.com

 

[MaxwellCuse]

The one reason I think Congel has a small fighting chance: Trump can't stand Cuomo. If the lobbyists paint this as a way to spite Andy, it wouldn't shock me if the feds only support funding for the tunnel.

If Congel was able to overturn it, the liberals would then file legal appeals.

It doesn't matter much to me which option actually gets done, but I am amused by your characterizing the people who want the most expensive option (the tunnel) as "conservatives" and the people who favor the least expensive option (the grid) as "liberals."

 

[FrancoPizza]

Perhaps, if they adapt, but it's certainly not a slam dunk. Here's an example.

Malls are filling their empty spaces with doctor's offices

As malls search for innovative ways to draw in shoppers and fill empty storefronts, they are turning to unexpected partners: health clinics.

www.cnn.com

I think they are trying to adapt, but they'll need to diversify beyond entertainment and dining. The health care link you provided is a good read.

 

[OttoMets]

Perhaps, if they adapt, but it's certainly not a slam dunk. Here's an example.

Malls are filling their empty spaces with doctor's offices

As malls search for innovative ways to draw in shoppers and fill empty storefronts, they are turning to unexpected partners: health clinics.

www.cnn.com

I'm seeing a lot of this. The Atrium in Chestnut Hill did something similar after years of struggling to compete against the Bloomingdale's shopping center across the street. Smaller neighborhood shopping plazas around Upstate have gone this route after losing an anchor tenant. And of course The Galleries in Syracuse shifted its tenant mix from mostly retail to mostly office over the last couple decades.

 

[Newhouser]

I think they are trying to adapt, but they'll need to diversify beyond entertainment and dining. The health care link you provided is a good read.

Adapting and adjusting would require some massive egos to say "well we were wrong on retail"....not my experience that the group that operates the mall is big on looking in the mirror.

 

[xc84]

It doesn't matter much to me which option actually gets done, but I am amused by your characterizing the people who want the most expensive option (the tunnel) as "conservatives" and the people who favor the least expensive option (the grid) as "liberals."

Liberals embrace change and conservatives,by nature, like the status quo.

 

[reedny]

I'm seeing a lot of this. The Atrium in Chestnut Hill did something similar after years of struggling to compete against the Bloomingdale's shopping center across the street. Smaller neighborhood shopping plazas around Upstate have gone this route after losing an anchor tenant. And of course The Galleries in Syracuse shifted its tenant mix from mostly retail to mostly office over the last couple decades.

I know it's radical, but in tough times mall owners could always deloy the nuclear option: make rent reasonable.

 

[LAOrange]

I know it's radical, but in tough times mall owners - who have been feeding at the trough for years - always have the nuclear option: they can actually make the rent reasonable.

Owners seem more interested in property value than cash flow. It's silly to see a space empty for two years because the rent matches a projected selling price five years away.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

Liberals embrace change and conservatives,by nature, like the status quo.

In which case conservatives should favor the rebuild and enlarge the viaduct option. It is less costly than the tunnel but maintains I-81 running between the CBD and University Hill. But I haven't heard much support from anyone for that idea (at least from my distant perch).

 

[xc84]

In which case conservatives should favor the rebuild and enlarge the viaduct option. It is less costly than the tunnel but maintains I-81 running between the CBD and University Hill. But I haven't heard much support from anyone for that idea (at least from my distant perch).

I have heard many say just rebuild it where it is. However, you point out how hypocritical "conservatives" are by favoring the most costly option.

 

[gmoney44]

One thing that is certain is the suburbs should have zero say what happens to 81. Those same people would have a fit if the city had any say in their planning or development.

Syracuse is dead if it wasn’t for the people in the suburbs so perhaps they should have some skin in the game.

 

[shandeezy7]

Syracuse is dead if it wasn’t for the people in the suburbs so perhaps they should have some skin in the game.

Complete non-sense. The suburbs don't exist if not for the city. The only reason the city ended up in the position that it did was because of garbage decisions like building an interstate right through the heart of downtown, destroying neighborhoods and providing the path for white flight to the suburbs.

 

[Trueblue25]

Syracuse is dead if it wasn’t for the people in the suburbs so perhaps they should have some skin in the game.

Tipp hill, eastwood, armory, franklin, strathmore and the university disagree sir

 

[Cheriehoop]

Complete non-sense. The suburbs don't exist if not for the city. The only reason the city ended up in the position that it did was because of garbage decisions like building an interstate right through the heart of downtown, destroying neighborhoods and providing the path for white flight to the suburbs.

You forget who made that initial decision - the city did. Rte 81 was completed to the city limits by 1957, it was also completed north from Watertown to Brewerton. The city held out to complete it by the early ‘60’s so they could tear down the parts of the city that they thought brought the most benefit to it’s development. The county didn’t even have a county executive back then, it was a board made up of individual supervisors representing their individual town. The city, just like now wanted the final say in determining route 81 - the suburbs didn’t destroy the city - the city itself did by trying to use an interstate transportation route for gentrification, development , business concern reasons - which sounds much like the same reasons and quest for the city alone to be the only factor for rerouting and deciding the future of Rte 81 again.