Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion | Page 89 | Syracusefan.com

Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

shandeezy7 said:
Do you mean 481? I didn't realize they were building a separate pedestrian bridge there. So it's adjacent to the Kinne Road bridge?
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Yeah, 481. I was wondering what they were doing over there.

I saw the concept art for the trail on Erie Blvd - it looked great. It would be nice to be able to bike to downtown without risking my life.
 
KellySyracuse said:
agree with that! Have you heard anything about the Roth Steel yard? Is that finally cleaned up?
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To the best of my knowledge OCIDA has cleaned it up and is marketing the site for -- get this -- light industrial use. A sale, not even a ground lease.

All that public money, they finally get control of a lakefront property and get it remediated, and they'll hand it away again for that kind of use.

They're keeping an easement for where the lake trail will cross the property, though...it's going to jog south-southeast over the CSX line, across the Roth property, and essentially follow the sidewalk on Hiawatha from there to the Creekwalk. (So it's not going to be a lake trail in the popularly-understood sense.)

Again, the county. Woof.
 
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shandeezy7 said:
Since it's a NYS project and knowing Cuomo, it will most likely get done. Now, whether or not it gets done right is another question.
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According to a designer involved with the project, construction was supposed to run from 2019 to 2021. (It was clear that Cuomo wanted to force this through as close to his reelection as possible.) But they haven't begun work in the city.

They are sprinting to complete some sections elsewhere, though. On the Kingston-Rhinecliff Bridge over the Hudson (formerly a two-lane bridge with wide shoulders and no pedestrian access) they've shifted all traffic to the north side, built Jersey barriers on the south, and are starting to build pedestrian and bike approach infrastructure on the south side of 199. This offers some hint as to whether this will be "done right."

On the other hand, two years ago they did an incredible job reconfiguring the interchange at the approach to the next bridge north (Rip Van Winkle) where 23 meets 9G. They installed decorative lighting, a roundabout to replace the high-speed slip and through lanes, and a parking/interpretive signage area. There are pedestrians on the protected bridge walkway all the time, in any weather.

How they're going to connect those areas is anybody's guess. The designer told me it's going to follow the 9G right-of-way. 9G is a 55-mph state highway with no shoulders and no room to expand.
 
Fly Rodder said:
Yeah, 481. I was wondering what they were doing over there.

I saw the concept art for the trail on Erie Blvd - it looked great. It would be nice to be able to bike to downtown without risking my life.
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It'd be nice if that wide median could also accommodate a dedicated bus lane.

But yeah in general the city and state's plans for Erie will be a huge improvement. A lot of underutilized real estate in that corridor, all within a quick walk or bike ride of a ton of homes and jobs.
 
OttoMets said:
To the best of my knowledge OCIDA has cleaned it up and is marketing the site for -- get this -- light industrial use. A sale, not even a ground lease.

All that public money, they finally get control of a lakefront property and get it remediated, and they'll hand it away again for that kind of use.

They're keeping an easement for where the lake trail will cross the property, though...it's going to job south-southeast over the CSX line, across the Roth property, and essentially follow the sidewalk on Hiawatha from there to the Creekwalk. (So it's not going to be a lake trail in the popularly-understood sense.)

Again, the county. Woof.
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It's zoned industrial and I'm not sure they're interested in changing that. I haven't seen the site data, but I would imagine that any BCP remediation was to hog out the gross contamination, underground tanks or buried drums and as much dry soil as possible. It's right next to the lake, so I assume that groundwater is fairly shallow - most cleanups don't dig saturated soil. Any remaining contamination would be prevented from migrating through an underground barrier wall or treated in situ through geochem or bio. In order to qualify for unrestricted use or commercial use, the concentrations of contaminants would have to be greatly reduced. Industrial use criteria gives them much higher concentrations that are easier to get under. The NYSDEC has some funky rules regarding remediation complete (e.g., they don't have to grant completion if there is even one sample location that comes back hot no matter how close to the standard it is. Some states allow for a site-wide average).

Remediating sites is difficult for a lot of reasons. It's usually best to just keep to same use.
 
OttoMets said:
To the best of my knowledge OCIDA has cleaned it up and is marketing the site for -- get this -- light industrial use. A sale, not even a ground lease.

All that public money, they finally get control of a lakefront property and get it remediated, and they'll hand it away again for that kind of use.

They're keeping an easement for where the lake trail will cross the property, though...it's going to jog south-southeast over the CSX line, across the Roth property, and essentially follow the sidewalk on Hiawatha from there to the Creekwalk. (So it's not going to be a lake trail in the popularly-understood sense.)

Again, the county. Woof.
Expand...

I guess that's not totally surprising. It's a pretty industrial area, sandwiched in by the water treatment plant on one side and other industrial businesses on the other side. I don't think that you'd see a park or a hotel/apartment building there.
 
Fly Rodder said:
It's zoned industrial and I'm not sure they're interested in changing that. I haven't seen the site data, but I would imagine that any BCP remediation was to hog out the gross contamination, underground tanks or buried drums and as much dry soil as possible. It's right next to the lake, so I assume that groundwater is fairly shallow - most cleanups don't dig saturated soil. Any remaining contamination would be prevented from migrating through an underground barrier wall or treated in situ through geochem or bio. In order to qualify for unrestricted use or commercial use, the concentrations of contaminants would have to be greatly reduced. Industrial use criteria gives them much higher concentrations that are easier to get under. The NYSDEC has some funky rules regarding remediation complete (e.g., they don't have to grant completion if there is even one sample location that comes back hot no matter how close to the standard it is. Some states allow for a site-wide average).

Remediating sites is difficult for a lot of reasons. It's usually best to just keep to same use.
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I know under the proposed rezoning there was consideration to changing this block to mixed-use, it might've even been in the early drafts. But after some back and forth with stakeholders and the consulting firm, Planning decided that the city has too little industrial land and some should be preserved. (They did this around the baseball stadium as well, unfortunately or fortunately depending on your point of view.)

I appreciate the technical explanation, though, and it's reasonable from a cost standpoint. When public money got involved, though, I had higher hopes. If they want the lake to be an asset, promoting compatible development (or no development) around it is a must. Starting with a scrapyard, transferring title and spending millions of dollars, only to end up with a warehouse is a very strange string of events. Could've just skipped the middle step. (Or arranged a 40-year ground lease with an industrial developer and preserved the public's interest in the site.)
 
shandeezy7 said:
I guess that's not totally surprising. It's a pretty industrial area, sandwiched in by the water treatment plant on one side and other industrial businesses on the other side. I don't think that you'd see a park or a hotel/apartment building there.
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I vaguely remember a golf course envisioned for that site as part of the original Carousel Mall development proposal - the one that was going to build the Convention Center on N. Salina Street and the 40 story hotel.
 
interesting final group of candidates this year and how cool is it that Syracuse even has this program to offer? Serious question, was this something that Nancy Cantor started? Who's idea was the tech garden?

cnycentral.com

Five finalists chosen to compete for $1M investment in Syracuse

Five teams have made it to the fourth round of competition and are now in the final stages of competing for a million dollars in Syracuse. Genius NY, a business accelerator program at The Tech Garden on Harrison Street, has held this competition for four years now where groups from all over the...
cnycentral.com cnycentral.com
 
here is the about page, was hoping to find something about the original founders but it only mentions CenterState CEO. Was this a Stephanie Miner initiative?

www.thetechgarden.com

About - The Tech Garden

The Tech Garden stimulates high-tech entrepreneurship, fosters the development of emerging growth companies, and supports technology commercialization throughout the Central New York region.
www.thetechgarden.com

We provide the environment and resources for your startup.

THE MISSION
The Tech Garden helps create technology-leveraging start-ups, fosters the development of entrepreneurs, and supports the innovation ecosystem throughout the Central New York region. Entrepreneurs are wrapped into our Events, Programs, and Resources, offered business planning assistance, mentoring, specialized advice, targeted referrals, networking opportunities and inspiring space from which to grow their businesses.

The Tech Garden is a program of CenterState CEO. CenterState CEO is an independent and forward-thinking economic development strategist, business leadership organization and chamber of commerce; dedicated to the success of its members and the prosperity of the region. Its vision is for a vibrant and globally connected region recognized as a place where business thrives and people prosper.

HOW IT ALL STARTED
Originally conceived as a way to turn two empty MONY Plaza buildings (one, a collapsed parking garage) into a business incubator for manufacturing and services businesses, The Tech Garden overcame a number of political and financial hurdles to open its doors as a technology-oriented business incubator in late 2004. Learn more about the history of The Tech Garden here.

DID YOU KNOW THE TECH GARDEN
  1. Has been the center of the Central New York innovation ecosystem for over a decade.
  2. Has awarded over $15 million in funding to startups.
  3. Hosts over 150 connection-building events every year.
 
shandeezy7 said:
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My two cents: this (maybe in conjunction with a recession) is where we'll see just how robust the urban apartment market is in Syracuse. That development is, I think, the single largest residential project to come online this century in the submarket. It will be very interesting to see how long it takes to absorb 200+ units. And I have a hunch I'm not the only one waiting on that.

Nice photo by Eric.
 
OttoMets said:
My two cents: this (maybe in conjunction with a recession) is where we'll see just how robust the urban apartment market is in Syracuse. That development is, I think, the single largest residential project to come online this century in the submarket. It will be very interesting to see how long it takes to absorb 200+ units. And I have a hunch I'm not the only one waiting on that.

Nice photo by Eric.
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I assume meaning non-student housing residential projects, right? It will definitely be interesting to follow. I think the worst-case scenario is that you start to see downtown rents stable off or creep down a bit. Some of the rents are really steep, especially for Syracuse. There are comparable downtown apartments in Buffalo that don't command the rents of downtown Syracuse. My one-bedroom apartment in downtown Buffalo is $1,150/mo plus utilities. A comparable apartment in downtown Syracuse is probably pulling in $1,500/mo plus utilities.
 
shandeezy7 said:
I assume meaning non-student housing residential projects, right? It will definitely be interesting to follow. I think the worst-case scenario is that you start to see downtown rents stable off or creep down a bit. Some of the rents are really steep, especially for Syracuse. There are comparable downtown apartments in Buffalo that don't command the rents of downtown Syracuse. My one-bedroom apartment in downtown Buffalo is $1,150/mo plus utilities. A comparable apartment in downtown Syracuse is probably pulling in $1,500/mo plus utilities.
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It costs $1,500 to live in downtown Syracuse? Huh. Perhaps real estate in Canada is not as out of control as I once thought.
 

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