Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion | Page 139 | Syracusefan.com

Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

The NIMBY's around there want nothing to do with this project. Once they heard it was income based lower than the median the revolt began. I expect the meeting tonight will be a doozy. I'm not sure what they expect is going to go there if not apartments and senior apartments in that price range are much needed.

That makes zero sense. It's not exactly located in a high end neighborhood and what would their problem be regarding senior housing anyway? Are 65 year old low income seniors attracting a lot of crime to the area. Idiotic.
 
The NIMBY's around there want nothing to do with this project. Once they heard it was income based lower than the median the revolt began. I expect the meeting tonight will be a doozy. I'm not sure what they expect is going to go there if not apartments and senior apartments in that price range are much needed.
That makes zero sense. It's not exactly located in a high end neighborhood and what would their problem be regarding senior housing anyway? Are 65 year old low income seniors attracting a lot of crime to the area. Idiotic.

Eh...

On paper, low-income senior housing is a great thing. In the neighborhoods unfortunately it doesn't always work out as planned. Shouldn't say more.
 
Eh...

On paper, low-income senior housing is a great thing. In the neighborhoods unfortunately it doesn't always work out as planned. Shouldn't say more.

What is the alternative for the site if not senior housing? Market-rate apartments are the only acceptable option for people? Would there be enough demand for market-rate apartments in that location for a developer to justify the cost of redevelopment? It's sat vacant for long enough that I think I know the answer to that.
 
What is the alternative for the site if not senior housing? Market-rate apartments are the only acceptable option for people? Would there be enough demand for market-rate apartments in that location for a developer to justify the cost of redevelopment? It's sat vacant for long enough that I think I know the answer to that.

Correct, that wouldn't fly. And I think we're going to see a course correction Upstate...sky-high construction costs + increasing interest rates = market rate housing that barely penciled out in recent years no longer does.
 
Correct, that wouldn't fly. And I think we're going to see a course correction Upstate...sky-high construction costs + increasing interest rates = market rate housing that barely penciled out in recent years no longer does.

Which is unfortunate for any of those large, older buildings in need of redevelopment.
 
I’ve heard that the Dewitt and Fayetteville/Manlius areas are tough to deal with.
They are somewhat. But Town of DeWitt and Manlius both are easier to get auto-centric developments approved. If they wanted a chik-filet in next to MacDonald's in Town Center it wouldn't be an issue. Panera is going there now and supposedly Chipotle is taking over the Panera. Drive throughs are a huge pain in the ass to deal with in a small village settings.
Yeah Dewitt is awful for sure. It's why the old Country Club lot at the corner of Erie and Bridge is vacant. There was originally supposed to be a Rite Aid going there and then that was a rumored spot for Chick-fil-A but the planning board won't allow them to have entrances/exits on Erie Blvd, forcing them to go down Bridge St and access the parcel from Celi Dr. Manlius basically does not allow new build drive thrus, and that's too far out there anyway.
Erie Blvd is a state highway and State DOT governs the entrances/exits. Considering I've seen traffic backed up onto Erie Blvd from the Starbucks as well as the Delta Sonic, it's apparent that they could probably do a better job.
The Dewitt town board is crazy. I've heard stories about them asking applicants to change the color of signage, when they are a franchise of a national brand who, of course, has trademarks and requires that those certain colors, fonts, etc., be used on all their merchandise.

The Dewitt board acts like they are the landlords, not a zoning board. They don't seem to have any business sense whatsoever to make demands like that.
DeWitt lets a lot of things through. But overall, a village/town has absolute control over how things should look - especially in modern times. National brands don't live in the village and their one-size fits all approach tends to leave distinct stand-alone buildings that are difficult to repurpose so they tend to sit vacant much longer. Brands come and go. Something that may look perfectly fine on a lot in commercial district next to highway in Missouri doesn't fit in the center of a town.
 
Correct, that wouldn't fly. And I think we're going to see a course correction Upstate...sky-high construction costs + increasing interest rates = market rate housing that barely penciled out in recent years no longer does.
I suspect you were at the Onondaga Planning symposium last week, the housing market discussion was pretty interesting. It seems central NY is in a bit of a crossroads since the housing stock is old and very expensive to modernize for efficiency and amenities, but the property values generally aren't sufficient to warrant the investment. Chicken or egg issue especially when some employers claim that they can't get people to move here because the housing market is limited to old drafty fixer-uppers or brand new 3,000 SF McMansions a half-hour out.
 
That makes zero sense. It's not exactly located in a high end neighborhood and what would their problem be regarding senior housing anyway? Are 65 year old low income seniors attracting a lot of crime to the area. Idiotic.
Not everyone in that neighborhood is against it. There is a thread about it on Nextdoor, I used to live around there so I asked why senior apts were a bad thing. Here was one response:

Senior low-income...90% of Washington Square area housing is already taxpayer funded ... subsidized/housing vouchers/welfare... depends on if you want the area to become the low-income center of the City of Syracuse.

Someone else that is for the project posted a couple of links to the developers previous work

Our Communities | www.homeleasing.net
Muldoon Gardens | www.homeleasing.net
 
They are somewhat. But Town of DeWitt and Manlius both are easier to get auto-centric developments approved. If they wanted a chik-filet in next to MacDonald's in Town Center it wouldn't be an issue. Panera is going there now and supposedly Chipotle is taking over the Panera. Drive throughs are a huge pain in the ass to deal with in a small village settings.

Erie Blvd is a state highway and State DOT governs the entrances/exits. Considering I've seen traffic backed up onto Erie Blvd from the Starbucks as well as the Delta Sonic, it's apparent that they could probably do a better job.

DeWitt lets a lot of things through. But overall, a village/town has absolute control over how things should look - especially in modern times. National brands don't live in the village and their one-size fits all approach tends to leave distinct stand-alone buildings that are difficult to repurpose so they tend to sit vacant much longer. Brands come and go. Something that may look perfectly fine on a lot in commercial district next to highway in Missouri doesn't fit in the center of a town.

I don't disagree with much of that, but they are also over-controlling in a number aspects. My brother had to battle it out with them just to be able to widen his driveway by 18 inches. Le Moyne has also had numerous issues with them, especially related to athletics projects. They'd say you have to change this and we would, only to have them come back and say 'that's not enough' now you have to do this as well. Just real minor in the weeds stuff that delayed projects or completely altered them.
 
Not everyone in that neighborhood is against it. There is a thread about it on Nextdoor, I used to live around there so I asked why senior apts were a bad thing. Here was one response:

Senior low-income...90% of Washington Square area housing is already taxpayer funded ... subsidized/housing vouchers/welfare... depends on if you want the area to become the low-income center of the City of Syracuse.

Someone else that is for the project posted a couple of links to the developers previous work

Our Communities | www.homeleasing.net
Muldoon Gardens | www.homeleasing.net

Yeah I think they do great work. The before and after on St. Anthony of Padua on Colvin St. is impressive. A major improvement in a low-income neighborhood. Seems as though this project could have a similar impact.

St.+Anthony%27s+school+building

1_3.JPG
 
@shandeezy7 I don't disagree with much of that, but they are also over-controlling in a number aspects. My brother had to battle it out with them just to be able to widen his driveway by 18 inches. Le Moyne has also had numerous issues with them, especially related to athletics projects. They'd say you have to change this and we would, only to have them come back and say 'that's not enough' now you have to do this as well. Just real minor in the weeds stuff that delayed projects or completely altered them.
The biggest issue with most planning boards and projects is setting a precedent leading to a death by a thousand cuts. Single project based planning is 18 inches here or 24 inches for the next applicant, leading to a neighbor wanting to put in a 6-car parking lot on the property line, etc.

Based on I what I've seen, I think a lot of the code can be too prescriptive and could be more flexible, but a lot of applicants think that any decision is limited to their property and can't be abused by the next applicant.
 
That makes zero sense. It's not exactly located in a high end neighborhood and what would their problem be regarding senior housing anyway? Are 65 year old low income seniors attracting a lot of crime to the area. Idiotic.
I could be mis-remembering, but I seem to remember a decade ago young Congel pitched it as a mid-high level apartment complex which would support the neighborhood and jumpstart local business. If this is a new direction I can see why some people would react negatively.

But the property has been vacant for years and starting to attract vandalism. We need senior housing and its better than it sitting empty.

And I'm glad Mark Congel is out of the project, because *** the congels.
 
I suspect you were at the Onondaga Planning symposium last week, the housing market discussion was pretty interesting. It seems central NY is in a bit of a crossroads since the housing stock is old and very expensive to modernize for efficiency and amenities, but the property values generally aren't sufficient to warrant the investment. Chicken or egg issue especially when some employers claim that they can't get people to move here because the housing market is limited to old drafty fixer-uppers or brand new 3,000 SF McMansions a half-hour out.

I missed it!

But yeah, you nailed it. It's a tough situation to be in financially for developers, and I've hear the very same thing about employee recruitment and retention.
 
It's coming ...

City of Syracuse Interstate 81 City Project Director
Serve as City of Syracuse primary contact with New York State Department of Transportation (NYSDOT) and Federal Highway Administration (FHWA) Interstate 81 Viaduct project teams and subcontractors through project planning and construction phases
- Coordinate with all relevant city departments, city agencies and Common Council regarding project planning and construction to ensure interests of city government and residents are addressed by NYSDOT​
- Analyze Interstate 81 viaduct project plans, including but not limited to Final Environmental Impact Statement and Record of Decision, to understand, anticipate and prepare for impact on city government and residents​
- Prepare official correspondence on behalf of City of Syracuse to relevant local, state and federal agencies and elected leaders regarding project planning and construction​
- Represent City of Syracuse with community stakeholders (residents, neighborhood groups, businesses, non-profits, planning organizations, large institutions, etc.); attend community meetings​
Etc.
 
Not sure if that LinkedIn link will work for people or not, so here is the post:

Ryan Benz
Ryan Benz• 2ndEntrepreneur, Restaurateur, Developer, Investor3d • Edited •
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-be...ofile:ACoAAAIN-MABdzNzO899_SfAObLheN4nOpCAg3I
After over two years in contract, it is a surreal day to say that we have finally closed and are under construction on the redevelopment of the former Penfield Manufacturing Building! The end result will include 128 mixed-income units, including 50 units supported by Catholic Charities of Onondaga County and we believe, will create enormous growth and prosperity on the north side leading to millions in future development. Thanks to my partners at Housing Visions Unlimited, Inc , Rockabill Consulting & Rockabill Development , New York State Homes & Community Renewal , New York State Parks, Recreation & Historic Preservation , Hueber Breuer Construction , Acropolis Realty Group, Carmina Wood Morris, DPC, C&S Companies , Bousquet Holstein PLLC , Bond, Schoeneck & King PLLC and so many more for your work bringing this project to fruition!

The Central New York of tomorrow will be bright, optimistic and inclusive. Join the fun and let’s keep growing this city!

#construction #housing #community #building #penfield #syracuse #growth
No alternative text description for this image

No alternative text description for this image
 
Not sure if that LinkedIn link will work for people or not, so here is the post:

Ryan Benz
Ryan Benz• 2ndEntrepreneur, Restaurateur, Developer, Investor3d • Edited •
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-benz-b68663b?miniProfileUrn=urn:li:fs_miniProfile:ACoAAAIN-MABdzNzO899_SfAObLheN4nOpCAg3I
After over two years in contract, it is a surreal day to say that we have finally closed and are under construction on the redevelopment of the former Penfield Manufacturing Building! The end result will include 128 mixed-income units, including 50 units supported by Catholic Charities of Onondaga County and we believe, will create enormous growth and prosperity on the north side leading to millions in future development. Thanks to my partners at Housing Visions Unlimited, Inc , Rockabill Consulting & Rockabill Development , New York State Homes & Community Renewal , New York State Parks, Recreation & Historic Preservation , Hueber Breuer Construction , Acropolis Realty Group, Carmina Wood Morris, DPC, C&S Companies , Bousquet Holstein PLLC , Bond, Schoeneck & King PLLC and so many more for your work bringing this project to fruition!

The Central New York of tomorrow will be bright, optimistic and inclusive. Join the fun and let’s keep growing this city!

#construction #housing #community #building #penfield #syracuse #growth
No alternative text description for this image

No alternative text description for this image
Nice! Now we just need to get someone moving on 400 Erie Blvd West.
 
Nice! Now we just need to get someone moving on 400 Erie Blvd West.

Yeah every time I drive by there, that building looks more ready to collapse onto West St. Wasn't there a redevelopment plan for that property at one point? I seem to remember there being one until one of the buildings collapsed some time ago.
 
Not sure if that LinkedIn link will work for people or not, so here is the post:

Ryan Benz
Ryan Benz• 2ndEntrepreneur, Restaurateur, Developer, Investor3d • Edited •
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-benz-b68663b?miniProfileUrn=urn:li:fs_miniProfile:ACoAAAIN-MABdzNzO899_SfAObLheN4nOpCAg3I
After over two years in contract, it is a surreal day to say that we have finally closed and are under construction on the redevelopment of the former Penfield Manufacturing Building! The end result will include 128 mixed-income units, including 50 units supported by Catholic Charities of Onondaga County and we believe, will create enormous growth and prosperity on the north side leading to millions in future development. Thanks to my partners at Housing Visions Unlimited, Inc , Rockabill Consulting & Rockabill Development , New York State Homes & Community Renewal , New York State Parks, Recreation & Historic Preservation , Hueber Breuer Construction , Acropolis Realty Group, Carmina Wood Morris, DPC, C&S Companies , Bousquet Holstein PLLC , Bond, Schoeneck & King PLLC and so many more for your work bringing this project to fruition!

The Central New York of tomorrow will be bright, optimistic and inclusive. Join the fun and let’s keep growing this city!

#construction #housing #community #building #penfield #syracuse #growth
No alternative text description for this image

No alternative text description for this image
Excited to see the Penfield project moving forward. There is so much potential with the finished product to drastically change that section of Wolf St. I have always thought and have posted here, remove the adult clubs and tie the ballpark into the Inner Harbor via Wolf and Salina with a walking/bike path. So much potential there
 
Excited to see the Penfield project moving forward. There is so much potential with the finished product to drastically change that section of Wolf St. I have always thought and have posted here, remove the adult clubs and tie the ballpark into the Inner Harbor via Wolf and Salina with a walking/bike path. So much potential there

Would be great to see, for sure. Thinking back on it, I would have loved the stadium being located downtown, but the Inner Harbor would have been the next best thing. Maybe the timing just wasn't right for that to have been a viable option. Imagine the harbor filled with boats of people attending games. Sigh.
 

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