Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

[IthacaMatt]

not good but inevitable. the writing has been on the wall for a while.

Don't forget, most of these small business owners haven't been able to employ the tax-dodges of the Super-Rich, like Amazon has. They have an unfair playing field.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Yeah it's definitely not a good thing, and as someone that HATES online shopping, especially for clothing, I find the trend of retail to be demoralizing. But it certainly seems to be inevitable at this point. Hopefully when these big malls bite the dust, they can be redeveloped more quickly than some of these other malls that you mentioned. Don't want to see that property sit vacant and decrepit for two decades.

You're absolutely right, but most governments have no idea what or how to do what needs to be done. We have some people on this board who are knowledgeable about such things, but most people in government are way above their head when it comes to more sophisticated business dealings.

 

[IthacaMatt]

not good but inevitable. the writing has been on the wall for a while.

Pyramid has actually been at the forefront of changing the experience of going to a mall. They are the ones who introduced all the entertainment stuff (beyond movies, of course); they were the first shopping mall chain to lure high-end restaurants; they were the first to create "neighborhoods" of related businesses to help with cross-promotion.

Public uses will keep people at the mall for a couple hours while their kids take dance class or karate class or participate in a rehearsal for a play. Central libraries and other public services could also be located in some places like Destiny (i.e., those that haven't already fallen into disrepair).

If the City is smart, and wants to be aggressive, there is probably a way to bring about a default by Pyramid and offer an opportunity to renegotiate their PILOT and Sales Tax deal, and maybe move some public uses into empty spaces in the Mall.

The Mall should also announce IMMEDIATELY that they are hiring 20 (or pick your number) more armed guards to ensure the safety of shoppers at Destiny.

 

[DMDMD]

We haven't seen that in the Syracuse area with malls closing. And Destiny is huge... too big for a single medical facility.

Certainly not the only thing that would be there. Would be an anchor tenant. Malls like them because they theoretically bring a bunch of weekday- daytime foot traffic. Or wheelchair traffic, as the case may be.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Well, it's sad, and some may say Pyramid has had it coming for a long time. But this is not good news for any community. How many more Shoppingtowns, and Fayetteville Malls, and PennCan Malls have to close to realize this? Sure, there are big national tenants in all these malls (or, at least there used to be ...), but most of those smaller stores lining the hallways are local business owners or franchisees, just trying to make a living. Then consider the several thousand people working at retail at these stores. They will all be unemployed in a few years. Not a good thing.

It’s the Amazon’s and online businesses winning big time especially regarding retail.

 

[SWC75]

I drove past that corner this afternoon, it has to include the Clam Bar. There are two houses on the South Bay corner, the Basil Leaf & it's parking lot, Monroe Auto and the Clam Bar. They want presence on Route 11 so it wouldn't be the muffler place. Money talks, I wouldn't blame the owners if they sold but that would be a tragedy.

I dined at the Basil leaf Tuesday night. No one I talked to thought they'd be leaving that location. Of course, the maître de and waiters won't be making the decision.

 

[KellySyracuse]

I dined at the Basil leaf Tuesday night. No one I talked to thought they'd be leaving that location. Of course, the maître de and waiters won't be making the decision.

Will be interesting to see what the outcome is. Chick-Fil-A has already presented it to the Onondaga County Planning Board on March 2nd. Site drawings submitted, etc. The building, drive-thru ordering canopy and auxiliary structures are all on the Town of Clay parcels. I will be shocked if they don't get the zoning approved. Entrance/exit on Taft and South Bay.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Will be interesting to see what the outcome is. Chick-Fil-A has already presented it to the Onondaga County Planning Board on March 2nd. Site drawings submitted, etc. The building, drive-thru ordering canopy and auxiliary structures are all on the Town of Clay parcels. I will be shocked if they don't get the zoning approved. Entrance/exit on Taft and South Bay.

Does this mean the end of the clam bar?

 

[KellySyracuse]

Does this mean the end of the clam bar?

no, the four parcels are Basil Leaf, their parking lot and two houses that are on the corner of South Bay - this map shows it

 

[shandeezy7]

I don't understand why there is a need for another Chick-fil-A literally 2.5 miles down the exact same road? Why not something on the west side/western suburbs or east side/eastern suburbs? Seems like cannibalizing profits having three locations within like a 5 mile radius and nothing anywhere else.

 

[KellySyracuse]

actually looks like only one house there but I swear there were two, doesn't matter I suppose

 

[Cheriehoop]

I don't understand why there is a need for another Chick-fil-A literally 2.5 miles down the exact same road? Why not something on the west side/western suburbs or east side/eastern suburbs? Seems like cannibalizing profits having three locations within like a 5 mile radius and nothing anywhere else.

I’ve heard that the Dewitt and Fayetteville/Manlius areas are tough to deal with. The city, Camillus areas even Mattydale would seem to be easier and also profitable target areas. I don’t know if they prefer to build in suburban areas rather than cities though.

 

[KellySyracuse]

I don't understand why there is a need for another Chick-fil-A literally 2.5 miles down the exact same road? Why not something on the west side/western suburbs or east side/eastern suburbs? Seems like cannibalizing profits having three locations within like a 5 mile radius and nothing anywhere else.

I'm sure they did a traffic assessment there but I agree with you. If they're going to build out here I'd rather see them take a lot that is vacant such as Ponderosa, Club 37 and the parcels surrounding it. I do know that they reside in Salina and Clay so maybe that is the problem there.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I’ve heard that the Dewitt and Fayetteville/Manlius areas are tough to deal with. The city, Camillus areas even Mattydale would seem to be easier and also profitable target areas. I don’t know if they prefer to build in suburban areas rather than cities though.

Nothing ever comes to the Fairmount / Camillus area! We don't even have a Bruegger's Bagels, for goodness sake!

 

[IthacaMatt]

I’ve heard that the Dewitt and Fayetteville/Manlius areas are tough to deal with. The city, Camillus areas even Mattydale would seem to be easier and also profitable target areas. I don’t know if they prefer to build in suburban areas rather than cities though.

The Dewitt town board is crazy. I've heard stories about them asking applicants to change the color of signage, when they are a franchise of a national brand who, of course, has trademarks and requires that those certain colors, fonts, etc., be used on all their merchandise.

The Dewitt board acts like they are the landlords, not a zoning board. They don't seem to have any business sense whatsoever to make demands like that.

 

[shandeezy7]

I’ve heard that the Dewitt and Fayetteville/Manlius areas are tough to deal with. The city, Camillus areas even Mattydale would seem to be easier and also profitable target areas. I don’t know if they prefer to build in suburban areas rather than cities though.

Yeah Dewitt is awful for sure. It's why the old Country Club lot at the corner of Erie and Bridge is vacant. There was originally supposed to be a Rite Aid going there and then that was a rumored spot for Chick-fil-A but the planning board won't allow them to have entrances/exits on Erie Blvd, forcing them to go down Bridge St and access the parcel from Celi Dr. Manlius basically does not allow new build drive thrus, and that's too far out there anyway.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Nothing ever comes to the Fairmount / Camillus area! We don't even have a Bruegger's Bagels, for goodness sake!

Township 5 has plenty that most areas don’t have though in Camillus.

 

[shandeezy7]

See historic Syracuse building where new upscale apartments rent below market prices

Former Smith Restaurant Supply building contains 38 apartments that are more affordable than most downtown.

www.syracuse.com

 

[KellySyracuse]

I'm not a fan of all white - cabinets, walls and counters, otherwise nice apartments with reasonable rent.

 

[IthacaMatt]

See historic Syracuse building where new upscale apartments rent below market prices

Former Smith Restaurant Supply building contains 38 apartments that are more affordable than most downtown.

www.syracuse.com

Did you look at the photos? Wow, that's some poor work. The white-painted interior bricks look like they are uneven and practically going to fall out. They should have left them raw brick. Floors don't look very nice, either.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I'm not a fan of all white - cabinets, walls and counters, otherwise nice apartments with reasonable rent.

Agree, but all white is cheaper. Once you add color your costs go up dramatically. Found that out when we were building our house in 2020.;

 

[KellySyracuse]

Did you look at the photos? Wow, that's some poor work. The white-painted interior bricks look like they are uneven and practically going to fall out. They should have left them raw brick. Floors don't look very nice, either.

The hardwood floors look nice, the concrete floors probably don't photograph very well

 

[shandeezy7]

Did you look at the photos? Wow, that's some poor work. The white-painted interior bricks look like they are uneven and practically going to fall out. They should have left them raw brick. Floors don't look very nice, either.

I did look at the photos and some of the photos look off because of the wide angle lens that was used. The concrete floors don't look great in the photos, but I've been in apartments with floors like that in Franklin Square and they look just fine in person, especially when accented by an area rug.

 

[shandeezy7]

This company did a really nice job converting the former St. Anthony of Padua school and convent on the south side into affordable senior housing. Would expect the same here.

Senior housing planned for historic convent and former Maria Regina College site in Syracuse

Rochester company says it plans to transform the site's multiple buildings into affordable apartments for seniors.

www.syracuse.com

 

[KellySyracuse]

This company did a really nice job converting the former St. Anthony of Padua school and convent on the south side into affordable senior housing. Would expect the same here.

Senior housing planned for historic convent and former Maria Regina College site in Syracuse

Rochester company says it plans to transform the site's multiple buildings into affordable apartments for seniors.

www.syracuse.com

The NIMBY's around there want nothing to do with this project. Once they heard it was income based lower than the median the revolt began. I expect the meeting tonight will be a doozy. I'm not sure what they expect is going to go there if not apartments and senior apartments in that price range are much needed.