Did other programs fans criticize their Legendary Coaches?

[grepal]

Calhoun got some heat for some drinking issues but pretty much was given a pass by most.
Thompson got some criticism for supposedly abandoning a couple of former players who got into serious legal troubles. Never heard a negative work about Louie C. I remember some Nova people being tired of Rollie's act but not many. Guys like Digger, The Wizard, Smith and Coach K seemingly walk on water. Of course, Bob Knight got the most heat of any coach I can remember who held legend status. My HS coach was good friends with Knight and absolutely loved the guy.

 

[tptcuse]

Crazy. In my head he seemed as old as JB does now.

JB looks excellent for 77. I hope I’m doing as well at that age.

 

[Alsacs]

There is a thread on a Patriots board that I visit titled "Has Belichick lost it?".

I'm not going out on too much of a limb to suggest that Bill Belichick has accomplished more than Jim Boeheim. And yet that thread -- started 2 1/2 years removed from his SIXTH championship -- exists.

So yeah, JB is not alone as a legendary coach in being criticized by fans.

I think most reasonable people understand that Syracuse basketball is what it is because of Jim. There's no reason why our hoops program isn't the equivalent of Seton Hall, or Providence, or Boston College, other than the fact that JB built it so much better.

But I also think that most reasonable people admit that we haven't been the Syracuse of yore for several years running now. And it doesn't seem like a major turnaround to top 10-20 status is looming.

And let's be real, who still coaches at 77? It's incredibly unusual for a transition to not have occurred by now, and that is entirely of Jim's doing. He could have rode off gloriously into the sunset after the Final 4 in 2016, never to be critiqued again. He didn't.

Felger&Mazz lead a daily mission against Belichick poisoning minds of dumb Patriots fans.

Read the Globe today Gasper says Bill is losing it by hiring Judge to work on offense.

Boeheim doesn’t get criticism from his local media. This board having a legitimate frustration is nothing.

 

[Col. Bleep]

March 14, 1980. The Louis and Bouie show comes to an end with a loss to Iowa in the Sweet 16. and without a trip to the Final Four. Nonetheless, 35-year-old Jim Boeheim has become the first D-1 coach to win 100 games in his first four years.

I'm listening to the post game show and the first caller simply says "FIRE BOW-HEEM!" and hangs up.

They've been out there all along...

There are haters for everyone..

This tournament ouster to Iowa also makes Dasher's point above.
When the Orange returned to Syracuse after this loss the coach wasn't with the team.
He'd apparently gone on a recruiting stop.
(And left poor Hal Cohen to speak to the media).
Pretty unlikely such a thing would happen today.

 

[721Comstock]

Those cigarettes will age ya.

Marek nods his head, knowingly.

 

[Scooch]

Dean Smith retired at age 66, coming off a final four. With an absolutely loaded team coming back.

That’s the way to do it.

Jim had his successor lined up, and had a golden opportunity to end on a high note. He couldn't walk away. I never figured he was that type, but boy was I wrong to an unfathomable degree.

 

[Scooch]

Calhoun got some heat for some drinking issues but pretty much was given a pass by most.
Thompson got some criticism for supposedly abandoning a couple of former players who got into serious legal troubles. Never heard a negative work about Louie C. I remember some Nova people being tired of Rollie's act but not many. Guys like Digger, The Wizard, Smith and Coach K seemingly walk on water. Of course, Bob Knight got the most heat of any coach I can remember who held legend status. My HS coach was good friends with Knight and absolutely loved the guy.

Keep in mind that there's always a big difference in perception from inside a fanbase vs. outside. Everyone I've ever encountered, who aren't SU fans, always assume that we all think JB walks on water. I've literally only seen national media pick up on the anti-JB angle this season, when on this board its been percolating for years.

So yeah, from the outside I get that it seemed like everyone loved Louie. I'm sure that inside there was griping about how he couldn't win the big one with all that NYC talent on his doorstep.

 

[Scooch]

Felger&Mazz lead a daily mission against Belichick poisoning minds of dumb Patriots fans.

Read the Globe today Gasper says Bill is losing it by hiring Judge to work on offense.

Boeheim doesn’t get criticism from his local media. This board having a legitimate frustration is nothing.

JB has received the ultimate kid gloves treatment from the local CNY media ever since the first probation, which is 30 years ago. It cracks me up how cantankerous he is, since I've seen coaches in Boston and NYC get roughly 1,000 times the heat he takes. And handle it with far more grace, to be quite honest.

 

[NineOneSeven]

He’s a great coach, he hasnt lost a step, getting certain people to see it is another thing totally.

Why post something like this? It’s simply incorrect.

 

[chugg21]

We haven’t played a conference game at the Dome as a ranked team since March 4, 2014.

The 8 year anniversary is coming up next week.

We haven’t won a conference game as a ranked team at home since February 15, 2014.

My brain can barely process that those dates are actually real.

 

[NineOneSeven]

My brain can barely process that those dates are actually real.

When we get back to that level, it’s going to feel damn good.

 

[djcon57]

Why post something like this? It’s simply incorrect.

because he thinks it’s true.

 

[NineOneSeven]

because he thinks it’s true.

I suppose that's reasonable enough, and accurate. At least the justification.

 

[DoctorBombay]

Yes there are some that have never had anything good to say and I've tuned them out for quite awhile. But now it's a lot of people who are usually pretty fair with their thoughts who are voicing frustration.

Bingo.
I’ve always defended JB, and always felt the criticism thrown his way, mostly from our own fans, was largely unwarranted. No one was happier than i was when we won in ‘03, because i could now say to any one suggesting that JB can’t coach- “Yeah, you’re clueless. SCOREBOARD”!
But here i am over the last 3 years especially, voicing the same concerns, baffled, gobsmacked even…at some of the happenings in the program.
Last season was a major turning point for me in that for the first time, my faith in JB was thoroughly shaken. I still shudder thinking about some of the goings on…and their repercussions.
Fan or no fan, hater or no hater- it is unequivocally clear that he’s lost some oomph on his fastball. It’s a measure of his greatness that he had those postseason runs to mask the decline. But this year, he’s been exposed, and for the first time in my over 45+ years of SU basketball fandom, I’m ready for a change. It’s inevitable, and it’s time. JMHO

 

[chugg21]

I suppose that's reasonable enough, and accurate. At least the justification.

I can't figure out if it's an age thing or what. Like are there people on the board in their 30s or younger who have that opinion or is it 60+ that have had 40 years of nothing but enjoyment and are good with JB staying on forever.

It's my guess there is a direct correlation between age and willingness to sit back and let this keep going on.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

JB looks excellent for 77. I hope I’m doing as well at that age.

But for the love of all things holy, I hope I’m not still working!

 

[OttoinGrotto]

When we get back to that level, it’s going to feel damn good.

Yeah, but I'll also still think we can be better.

 

[dollarbill44]

He may be making lemonade out of lemons thus year, (and yes, he recruited the lemons)

This tastes more like lemon juice.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This tastes more like lemon juice.

It's tart lemonade.

Some people are really into it.

 

[kingtidge]

By the way. It is possible, to both love JB, for the program that he has created, and also think it's time for him to move on.

Of course... but those people over there think you are Judas.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Not sure if this was mentioned but a lot of fans couldn’t wait for Gary Williams to retire towards the end.

 

[HOFCeluck]

There are more convincing reasons why we lose recruiting battles rather than 'coach has lost it.'. We once were The Beast of the East. Now we are the least of the SE. All zone all the time does not work for recruiting when you are not ranked. We lost gravitas and our facilities are no longer superior. Most important of all, without rivals we have lost National exposure. The ACC is a tough nut for a NE team to crack.

Why do you think we’re the “least of the SE?”

How did we lose gravitas? Did we leave it in a booth at Tullys on the Boulevard?

 

[Zelda Zonk]

The mixed feelings among SU fans about JB are kind of amazing when you think about all he’s accomplished.

The guy couldn’t be anymore a “Cuse” guy than Jimmy is. From Lyons, NY less than an hour from campus, was a player at SU, has coached SU for nearly 50 years, 6th All Time in coaching wins (4th if you count the 101 wins taken away AND all at SU), 2nd All Time in Division 1 wins, won a National Championship, runner up two other times, 35 NCAA Tournament appearances, has brought some fantastically exciting players to SU like Coleman, Douglas, Melo, Rautins (and many, many others).

Does SU even have a noteworthy program without all that JB has done on the Hill? Without the excitement that JB was creating in the Louie & Bouie era do we get the most unique arena in college sports?

JB isn’t perfect, no one is. But JB is SU basketball and we should never forget that we probably don’t have anything close to the program we all love without JB.

EDIT: And brought us possibly the best First Lady of College Basketball, not to mention Buddy and Jimmy.

If you don't think critically, you aren't thinking.

It's in the grand tradition of democracy to be critical of a President. That's often a constructive, effective exercise. But, a basketball coach is supposed to be exempt? Because we all owe him so much?

Even if you are the type of person who thinks it's disloyal to be critical of someone who has 'dedicated' himself to our program, you're still ignoring the truth that you don't actually know that JB has been the best coach we could have had. Somehow, one NC in 50 years doesn't strike me as the kind of thing that should inspire blind loyalty. You also have to be ignoring that we are not getting HoF, legendary performance or commitment from him at this stage. And no one is above the program. It doesn't belong to him.

And, yeah, to answer your question—i think Yes, we do have a noteworthy program without JB. Because we had The Dome. JB is a beneficiary of that. I don't think JAB has a NC and a 50 year career at one school if he had become HC at Seton Hall.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

If you don't think critically, you aren't thinking.

It's in the grand tradition of democracy to be critical of a President. That's often a constructive, effective exercise. But, a basketball coach is supposed to be exempt? Because we all owe him so much?

Even if you are the type of person who thinks it's disloyal to be critical of someone who has 'dedicated' himself to our program, you're still ignoring the truth that you don't actually know that JB has been the best coach we could have had. Somehow, one NC in 50 years doesn't strike me as the kind of thing that should inspire blind loyalty. You also have to be ignoring that we are not getting HoF, legendary performance or commitment from him at this stage. And no one is above the program. It doesn't belong to him.

And, yeah, to answer your question—i think Yes, we do have a noteworthy program without JB. Because we had The Dome. JB is a beneficiary of that. I don't think JAB has a NC and a 50 year career at one school if he had become HC at Seton Hall.

How about Brey at ND. He's been there 22 years and has one Elite 8 and two Sweet 16's. Would Cuse fans be happy with that.

 

[Alsacs]

How about Brey at ND. He's been there 22 years and has one Elite 8 and two Sweet 16's. Would Cuse fans be happy with that.

Do we get ND’s football success over that time? If yes, then sure
ND fans don’t care about hoops.
SU fans care about hoops.