Duke just got Thornton to re-class to 15

[jordoo]

So tee (or Dean if you're online) ... what's the story with our frontline recruiting lately? Seems that a few years ago, we were killing it. After Arinze we picked up steam with Fab (who was a good recruit at the time - 7 footer), Rak in 2011, Coleman and Grant in 2012, McCullough in 2013 (Obokoh in between).

This year's class has a decent low post guy, Diagne, and a stretch 4 (Lyden) with some size. But no one over 6-8/6-9 who can anchor the zone and clean the glass against the frontlines we face in conference.

For those with short memories, the ACC is raining 6'11-plus bigs everywhere but central NY. -St has twin towers in Turpin and Ojo; Oakafor just carried Dook to a NC (7' Plumlee is back); UNC returns Meeks, Johnson and Jones (all beasts); there's 7' Tobey at Virginia flanked by Gill (thank god Atkins graduates); Jekiri at Miami who's coming back for another year; Uchebo at Pitt; Onuako and Mahmoud at Lousiville... (6-10; 7'). We need bigs to compete in this group!!

Our front line became a concern as soon as the post-Bryant era began. We have two guys with (any) experience -- a project with potential (long way off) and a guy coming off not one, but 2 years of injuries. Last year, we got our as*es kicked on the glass against the top half of the league. TB was the shot that went half-way down and then spiraled out --- with mysteriously no contact by the coaching staff in the last 8 weeks before his decision. Once the season rolls out, I'd be shocked if DC2 can play anymore than 25-30 mpg ... which leaves 10-15 for Obokoh (and no Chris McCullough to slide over).

Calling Thomas' mom was nice. But it would have been smarter to have TB on campus or on the telephone .. to explain the obvious: that Duke just won a ship with 8-9 scholarship players; that IU went through the same thing; that we're appealing Swankey's public spanking; and that we are NOT IN CHAOS!

No doubt the COI report was rough. I feel for the staff.. especially since the sanctions were way over the top. But there have to be recruits out there with size that want to play for a top-10 caliber program in front of 30k!

You mention a whole bunch of bigs that aren't very great players desite their size.
Perhaps you didn't get the memo but Bryant simply did not want to be anywhere near home no matter what we did to recruit him.
Had Coleman and McCulough been healthy the last two years we'd have had as much size as almost anyone else in the ACC.
Yes Coleman's health is a concern let's hope the knees hold up. Diange will back him up IMO and Chino will be the deep backup center.

 

[Conrad13]

We're going to have to recruit at a very high level to compete with Duke.

Can almost say the same with Louisville.

If only Louisville won the Fab Melo recruiting battle...

 

[reedny]

You mention a whole bunch of bigs that aren't very great players desite their size.
Perhaps you didn't get the memo but Bryant simply did not want to be anywhere near home no matter what we did to recruit him.
Had Coleman and McCulough been healthy the last two years we'd have had as much size as almost anyone else in the ACC.
Yes Coleman's health is a concern let's hope the knees hold up. Diange will back him up IMO and Chino will be the deep backup center.

Well I got the memo from TB -- the one that said no one called him to explain what was going on in the last 2 months -- while all the "chaos" was occurring. Is that the "memo" you're referring to? I don't mean to sound flippant .. but I don't think it's fair to dismiss TB's statement (or mine). True, he might have opted for an out-of-town team no matter what .. but if that's the case (as you seem to think was destined) then he would have just said that (and so would his mom).

And as far as the "not very great players" .. our backups are Chino and a freshman. And the top-tier ACC teams we played last year -- with Rak in the middle and a 6-10 PF for 11 games -- dominated us on the glass for the most part.

I'm not throwing stones just to be critical. The point is ... we have work to do. We need to get back to where we were and shake off the NCAA report. Other teams, even lower-echelon ACC teams, are finding ways to bring in size. Seems to me we should be able to do the same thing.

 

[Jasoncuse]

How is this even a thing? A kid can simply decide to do a little extra work and skip an entire year of HS? Or was his original graduating class supposed to be 2015 and he fell behind? Either way, this is sketchy and if it were Kentucky, I'd call BS.

 

[SBU72]

I don't know Jordo... We want to compete with the best of the best of the ACC. Will our veterans be up to the task next year? We are 2-5 against UNC, UVA and Duke the first two go arounds in ACC. I want to beat these schools, just not sure we have the firepower to do so yet.

Heck there were years when Su was that against Louisville/UConn/Pitt. 2013 SU FF team was 2-4 against them.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Heck there were years when Su was that against Louisville/UConn/Pitt.

We have had issues against Pitt that are more than well known, but for as much postseason success Uconn has had, we certainly won our fair share of games against them, especially when Calhoun coached. Him and JB were about 50/50. We've also currently won 4 out of 5 against Louisville.

The ACC, especially Duke is a different animal.

We have and will win recruiting battles against the schools you mentioned.

 

[SBU72]

We have had issues against Pitt that are more than well known, but for as much postseason success Uconn has had, we certainly won our fair share of games against them, especially when Calhoun coached. Him and JB were about 50/50. We've also currently won 4 out of 5 against Louisville.

The ACC, especially Duke is a different animal.

We have and will win recruiting battles against the schools you mentioned.

Don't disagree but the post I responded to said 2-5 against the top 3 schools over 2 years and I just pointed out that SU did much the same in the BE.

 

[tee1222]

So tee (or Dean if you're online) ... what's the story with our frontline recruiting lately? Seems that a few years ago, we were killing it. After Arinze we picked up steam with Fab (who was a good recruit at the time - 7 footer), Rak in 2011, Coleman and Grant in 2012, McCullough in 2013 (Obokoh in between).

This year's class has a decent low post guy, Diagne, and a stretch 4 (Lyden) with some size. But no one over 6-8/6-9 who can anchor the zone and clean the glass against the frontlines we face in conference.

For those with short memories, the ACC is raining 6'11-plus bigs everywhere but central NY. -St has twin towers in Turpin and Ojo; Oakafor just carried Dook to a NC (7' Plumlee is back); UNC returns Meeks, Johnson and Jones (all beasts); there's 7' Tobey at Virginia flanked by Gill (thank god Atkins graduates); Jekiri at Miami who's coming back for another year; Uchebo at Pitt; Onuako and Mahmoud at Lousiville... (6-10; 7'). We need bigs to compete in this group!!

Our front line became a concern as soon as the post-Bryant era began. We have two guys with (any) experience -- a project with potential (long way off) and a guy coming off not one, but 2 years of injuries. Last year, we got our as*es kicked on the glass against the top half of the league. TB was the shot that went half-way down and then spiraled out --- with mysteriously no contact by the coaching staff in the last 8 weeks before his decision. Once the season rolls out, I'd be shocked if DC2 can play anymore than 25-30 mpg ... which leaves 10-15 for Obokoh (and no Chris McCullough to slide over).

Calling Thomas' mom was nice. But it would have been smarter to have TB on campus or on the telephone in person .. to explain that: Duke just won a ship with 8-9 scholarship players; IU went through the same thing; we're appealing Swankey's public spanking; we're NOT IN CHAOS, etc, etc!

No doubt the COI report was rough. I feel for the staff.. especially since their recruiting record is clean and the sanctions were over the top. But there have to be prospects out there at or close to 7 feet that want to play for a top-10 caliber program in front of 30k!

About the big men...I get what you're saying, but we are still killing it. Could we use a 6'10+ guy anchoring the zone? Sure! Of course it helps. That said, I don't think we lose much when it comes to freshmen, comparing Diagne to Bryant. Bryant has 1 or 2 inches on Diagne, but Moustapha makes up for it in athleticism. He's not a freak athlete, but I bet my money he gets up off the ground better than TB does. Diagne has at least a 7'2" wingspan. Not as much as TB's, but nothing to take lightly either. Both are terrific rebounders. I will give the edge to TB when it comes to motor. The guy is a gamer, takes every loss to heart.

But all in all, Moustapha will surprise most. As long as one of him, DC2, or Chino show up and play defense, we will be ok. Make no mistake. The offense will not be running through these guys, yet. Yet. Diagne has a great array in the low post and I've never seen a big man use his off hand finishing like Moustapha does.

 

[Madbiker]

I'm not getting how this is a bad thing for us...

a) Thornton is a PG and Battle has made it clear he is going to be a PG.
b) Battle will be committing by this summer. If Thornton is OAD that won't be apparent until next Feb-March at the earliest. Why would he commit to Duke knowing there's a chance Thornton will be there playing point?

According to a story on Zags Battle and Thornton are close friends and have talked about going to the same school to play together.

http://zagsblog.com/articles/derryck-thornton-to-duke/

 

[OrangeDW]

Heck there were years when Su was that against Louisville/UConn/Pitt. 2013 SU FF team was 2-4 against them.

Yup. 2003 national champs were 1-3 against Pitt and UConn, and that 1 W was incredibly hard fought and well earned. We got our butts kicked in the 3 losses.

Virginia seems like that team that may have our number a bit. We've played mostly well against Duke and UNC, they just caught us in a down year this year. Got robbed of a W at Duke last year.

 

[longtimefan]

If only Louisville won the Fab Melo recruiting battle...

Do you think he would have had the same academic problems at Louisville?

 

[Conrad13]

Do you think he would have had the same academic problems at Louisville?

Good question. If he did have academic problems I wonder if Louisville would have self reported them.

 

[longtimefan]

Good question. If he did have academic problems I wonder if Louisville would have self reported them.

That was the question that my question begged.

 

[alphaorange]

How is this even a thing? A kid can simply decide to do a little extra work and skip an entire year of HS? Or was his original graduating class supposed to be 2015 and he fell behind? Either way, this is sketchy and if it were Kentucky, I'd call BS.

Pretty easy, actually. I had everything I needed to graduate by the end of my Jr year. My brother did graduate a year early, and my son already had college credits at the end of his Jr HS year. If you meet the requirements, it's not hard. Meeting them is not all that hard, either.

 

[Janner]

Maybe I am not understanding the situation, which is very possible but I though Thornton and Battle talking about playing together in the same class? With Thornton re-classifying that would not be able to happen. Both have the potential to be OAD so it would make sense that the idea of them playing together is far less likely I would believe.

 

[PeteCalvin]

I don't know Jordo... We want to compete with the best of the best of the ACC. Will our veterans be up to the task next year? We are 2-5 against UNC, UVA and Duke the first two go arounds in ACC. I want to beat these schools, just not sure we have the firepower to do so yet.

Anomaly. We happened to hit UVA during an unusually strong period in their program's history. Can they continue that success? We'll see. Had we played that UNC game in the Dome this year, we win it. We stood toe to toe and ran out of gas at the end. Plus, foul trouble and no depth underneath the basket hurt.

JB always gives Duke a game, and he will continue to do so. We'll be OK. Jahlil Okafor is a once a decade player, and K usually doesn't recruit guys like Winslow all that often. We just need a beast in the middle and solid shooters to have the chance to beat Duke any given game.

 

[PeteCalvin]

According to a story on Zags Battle and Thornton are close friends and have talked about going to the same school to play together.

http://zagsblog.com/articles/derryck-thornton-to-duke/

So did Kenny Anderson and Billy Owens. And LeBron and Carmelo too, but that was never in the cards. Kids talk like this all the time, but why do it when you play the same position? That is stupid.

 

[Madbiker]

So did Kenny Anderson and Billy Owens. And LeBron and Carmelo too, but that was never in the cards. Kids talk like this all the time, but why do it when you play the same position? That is stupid.

I know it rarely happens , it's mostly just talk. But Duke seems to want Battle to play off the ball so they wouldn't play the same position. Hey I hope Battle comes to SU... just pointing out the article that says he talked with Thornton about playing together.