Etan thinks Zion should quit playing for Duke

[SoBeCuse]

such a fantastic starting 5. nba talent and size, experience, excitement.

jason gardern
gilbert arenas
michael wright
richard jefferson
Loren Woods (a victim of timing - he would have been a good pro in the 90's)

I saw those guys play @USC live when I was there in grad school. Nobody went to games and my friends and I basically had courtside seats at that old LA Sports Arena. I saw Arenas play once and knew he would be a star. 2nd round pick! I remember calling my buddy at the time who now works for Sirius/NBA telling him about this Gilbert Arenas cat and to look out for him.

 

[Cusefan0307]

there is a lot wrong with this.

zion wasnt forecasted to make $1bil 5 weeks ago. he was the #2 or #3 guy in his class. people have really short memories. no one predicted zion to have this start. no one.

so that clearly means zion has very very very strongly benefited from Duke in just 10 games. right? thats not a debate? so what are we saying? use duke until you reach the pinnacle of your potential and then retire from NCAA?

here is what would have happened had he gone to g league or taken a year off or hell was able to go straight to NBA. He almost certainly would not have been the #1 pick (this year or even next year had he not gone to duke - you cant use today's data with the benefits of duke to improve his stock - or potential earnings - from where he was or where he would have been in other scenarios, which i think we can all agree on wouldnt be as high had he not gone to duke), his shoe deal would be FAR more restricting and smaller in value because he had much less leverage in any of those scenarios.

on a side note, $1 bil was just a boeheim esque number thrown out there that had exactly 0 factual evidence behind it other than an off the cuff opinion.

also on a side note - he is a horrific outside shooter right now. not average, not bad - he is horrific. Lebron was probably an average shooter at this stage. Zions jumper takes like 20 seconds to get off and it looks like he is throwing an actual brick. he is an insane athlete - but so was josh smith. their jumpers actually look somewhat similar (zion is a better finisher and mid range than smoove ever had. dont get me wrong. zion is a legit talent)

the answer is not to just quit on a team, especially after that team helped you grow your brand to immeasurable numbers. all of that being said - let the kid make a few bucks.

Duke has strongly benefitted from Zion. They didn't have their own TV show on ESPN with any other prospects they have had. They are getting the same treatment the UK undefeated regular season team received and that's really not arguable. He's totally turned them into their own brand along with Lebron/Steph/Tom Brady/The Dallas Cowboys etc...

It's also a reason why I refuse to watch the world wide leader anymore.

 

[DaCuse]

why are we talking so much about Duke and their players on a Syracuse forum?

 

[SoBeCuse]

Zion is not making any money for anyone. If he was not walking the planet earth Duke would still be talked about and they would still be having people watch their games. I don't know a single person who has said to me, I don't ever watch college ball but I am now because of Zion. The people watching are either alumni of the school or fans of college basketball. I watch the tournament every year like many people do and that would continue to happen without the top 5 kids in every class. Also I wouldn't take Zion first, I would take RJ. Zion is shooting less than 20% from 3 and is 6'7" and weights 270 pounds. Not exactly the best fit for the current NBA. Also he isn't a good defender. He just blocks like 2 shots a game really hard that makes a highlight. His lateral movement on defense is not good. If he improves his defense maybe he can become Draymond Green but that is his ceiling and I would be shocked if he reaches it.

Agreed except for his lateral agility. IMO it’s more than fine. In fact, I think you could put that beast on top on one side of the zone. He’s quick enough that most guys wouldn’t get by him and NOBODY is getting their shot off!

 

[SoBeCuse]

why are we talking so much about Duke and their players on a Syracuse forum?

Oh that’s right bruh. Not allowed. You must not be a fan of college bball, lol.

 

[Tony DeFranco]

I think Etan was just making a point about the hypocrisy of the money making machine that is college basketball. And Zion is the most insanely talented and most popular. Do you guys notice that when espn announced the upcoming Duke game they kept saying the other school by name only against “Zion Williamson and Duke”. The dude is making a lot of money for people other than himself.

Yeah, it must be tough having to wait until ur 20 years old to make 200 mil - all because it good at a game - the struggles this kid has endured

 

[CusefanATL]

Duke has strongly benefitted from Zion. They didn't have their own TV show on ESPN with any other prospects they have had. They are getting the same treatment the UK undefeated regular season team received and that's really not arguable. He's totally turned them into their own brand along with Lebron/Steph/Tom Brady/The Dallas Cowboys etc...

It's also a reason why I refuse to watch the world wide leader anymore.

whoa whoa whoa!!! im not against paying zion for marketing along with giving them some more stipend money than they already get.

but zion has already benefited too. both can be true.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Oh that’s right bruh. Not allowed. You must not be a fan of college bball, lol.

If he went to Clemson like he should have there would be no threads about Clemson. I can almost guarantee that.

whoa whoa whoa!!! im not against paying zion for marketing along with giving them some more stipend money than they already get.

but zion has already benefited too. both can be true.

I’m sure he’s already paid. That’s what the evidence in the FBI trial alluded to.

 

[CusefanATL]

I saw those guys play @USC live when I was there in grad school. Nobody went to games and my friends and I basically had courtside seats at that old LA Sports Arena. I saw Arenas play once and knew he would be a star. 2nd round pick! I remember calling my buddy at the time who now works for Sirius/NBA telling him about this Gilbert Arenas cat and to look out for him.

definitely 1 of my favorite non cuse teams of all time. St Joes undefeated team, a Gonzaga team or 2, the UMass Camby team.

Its not often you get perfect pg, sg, sf, pf, c. They were all literally build for their specific position and they could all translate to both college and nba. all 5 of them had stints and/or careers.

 

[Ghost]

I think Etan was just making a point about the hypocrisy of the money making machine that is college basketball. And Zion is the most insanely talented and most popular. Do you guys notice that when espn announced the upcoming Duke game they kept saying the other school by name only against “Zion Williamson and Duke”. The dude is making a lot of money for people other than himself.

You don't think he gets any sort of benefit from having ESPN refer to the games as "Zion Williamson and Duke." I mean, Duke benefits in the same way he does. He just can't monetize it - yet.

If he's sitting at home right now hanging out with Bazley, do you think anyone is talking about him? Would we have threads talking about the "monster dunks" he's throwing down over DB in their trainer's driveway? j/k

I doubt we would have any threads on him though...or much of anywhere. He'd likely have a nice shoe contract...but he'll get that anyway and be able to get more with all the hype.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Nope.

He most certainly needs this year to get his game ready for the NBA. Being good as a rookie is paramount to having a good NBA career none of the greats sucked as rookies. Or at least none of the stars in the 1 and done era have sucked as rookies. A few HS players pre 1 and done had red shirt years and became stars but everyone good recently has walked into the league as a good player.

 

[SoBeCuse]

“If he went to Clemson like he should have there would be no threads about Clemson. I can almost guarantee that.”

He’d get some pub. Not Duke level of course. He would be talked about here because he would be averaging like 30/15.

 

[djcon57]

Life experience (college) will always take a back seat to money. It’s what we have become as humans. So sad.

Agreed. Tickets should be free for Syracuse games and JB should be paid 50k a year

 

[Cusefan0307]

“If he went to Clemson like he should have there would be no threads about Clemson. I can almost guarantee that.”

He’d get some pub. Not Duke level of course. He would be talked about here because he would be averaging like 30/15.

Where’s the Bol Bol threads then? His numbers are as good or better across the board than Zion and he’s 7’2”.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

I thought our boy Etan valued education.

Really?
As of January he won't go to class, then will withdraw from school for draft prep.
What education will he get this year?
If he wants, he can pay for a Duke education.

 

[NateW]

Really?
As of January he won't go to class, then will withdraw from school for draft prep.
What education will he get this year?
If he wants, he can pay for a Duke education.

It was a snarky comment mostly...

Still think the kid is better off challenging himself. That’s how you get better as a player and person.

 

[JoeySimz]

You don't think he gets any sort of benefit from having ESPN refer to the games as "Zion Williamson and Duke." I mean, Duke benefits in the same way he does. He just can't monetize it - yet.

If he's sitting at home right now hanging out with Bazley, do you think anyone is talking about him? Would we have threads talking about the "monster dunks" he's throwing down over DB in their trainer's driveway? j/k

I doubt we would have any threads on him though...or much of anywhere. He'd likely have a nice shoe contract...but he'll get that anyway and be able to get more with all the hype.

I agree with you that both are benefitting but the point remains, as you have more succinctly stated, that as of right now Duke and ESPN etc. and sponsors are profiting while Zion remains unpaid. I’m talking money right now, not future salary or media attention. Duke kids always get hype but this is on another level. People tune in and buy tickets just to see him. The supposed future benefit for the player is hard to quantify while the current structure is unfair at best, imho.

 

[RandygoCuse]

Even if he were to quit Duke, he'd still have to train right? Is he at any less of a risk for injury in that situation? I think he if he just sat on his butt and got fat, his draft stock would slip.

 

[RandygoCuse]

Where’s the Bol Bol threads then? His numbers are as good or better across the board than Zion and he’s 7’2”.

Bol Bol isn't as highly ranked a prospect (or as big a name) as Zion. I think most of the pub Zion gets is because of the hype - which may be very well deserved -surrounding him, not because he went to Duke.

 

[HakAttack]

Wow. I’d love to hear this one. So I voted for trump, and I don’t like blacks? Is that what you’re trying to say?

So defensive. What about my statement implies you don’t like black people? Unless you’re part of the “shut up and dribble” camp, to which I would say, yes, that would indicate that I’m correct in that regard.

Do you deny that the NCAA as a system exploits the labor of mostly (for football and basketball) lower income, African American men? Etan is (correctly, I might add) pointing that out and offering the take that Zion has given Duke already far more than Duke has given him. From a cost/benefit analysis Etan is right on point. From a sociological analysis of sports (which is exactly what he’s taking) he’s also right on point.

Go read William Rhoden’s “$40 Million Dollar Slaves” or Harry Edwards’s “Revolt of the Black Athlete”. Then you might have some idea of why people are agreeing with Etan.

And for the record, we need more folks like him (and Dave Zirin and Michael Bennett among others) speaking out against the systems of power embedded in our sports institutions.

So it’s not really a stretch to say that if you have a problem with a former (by all accounts) SU athlete who is also an exemplary person critiquing the power structure in sports that contributes to the ongoing oppression of black people in this country, you likely voted for 45.

But then again sports should just exist for your entertainment only, and aren’t really made up of anything more complicated than that, right?

 

[Cusefan0307]

Bol Bol isn't as highly ranked a prospect (or as big a name) as Zion. I think most of the pub Zion gets is because of the hype - which may be very well deserved -surrounding him, not because he went to Duke.

Really? Probably because to my point he doesn't play for Duke.

He was the 3rd or 4th ranked prospect depending on the service right next to Zion, projected top 5 pick in the draft next year who is averaging 21/10.3 on 56/52/76. He's freaking 7 foot 2 shooting 52 percent from 3.

And oh yeah his dad is the tallest player in NBA history.

 

[RandygoCuse]

Really? Probably because to my point he doesn't play for Duke.

He was the 3rd or 4th ranked prospect depending on the service right next to Zion, projected top 5 pick in the draft next year who is averaging 21/10.3 on 56/52/76. He's freaking 7 foot 2 shooting 52 percent from 3.

And oh yeah his dad is the tallest player in NBA history.

I still think Zion is receiving more pub because of what people think he will be able to do at the next level (and no doubt his skills are one of the reasons Duke recruited him). In my opinion, if Bol and Zion switched schools, Zion would still get more attention.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I still think Zion is receiving more pub because of what people think he will be able to do at the next level (and no doubt his skills are one of the reasons Duke recruited him). In my opinion, if Bol and Zion switched schools, Zion would still get more attention.

See I actually differ here. Guys who can't shoot have no place in the NBA anymore.

 

[Horn88]

Really? Probably because to my point he doesn't play for Duke.

He was the 3rd or 4th ranked prospect depending on the service right next to Zion, projected top 5 pick in the draft next year who is averaging 21/10.3 on 56/52/76. He's freaking 7 foot 2 shooting 52 percent from 3.

And oh yeah his dad is the tallest player in NBA history.

Zion is tailor made for the social media era where people want quick gifs or videos that can be shared and then go viral. A 5-10 second clip of him doing something that is insanely athletic whether it be one of his dunks or violent blocks is something the casual fan thinks is fun and spreads all over social media/the internet quickly. Also the fact his name is Zion and not Joe Smith helps him with branding and the name is easily recognizable to people who don't really pay attention to the sport.

I think a 7'+ guy dribbling and knocking down 3's is equally if not more so impressive from a basketball standpoint but a gif of that isn't going to catch on and lead to widespread popularity.

I may look stupid in a few years but if I had the number 1 pick I'd probably take Barrett over both of those guys.

 

[Col. Bleep]

All this discussion does is highlight the point that big time "college" sports have little to do with a college education.
Major colleges now are mostly showcases/developmental programs for players and farm teams for the pros. They're potential big moneymakers for the "schools."

It seems there are few real "college athletes" - think Rakeem Christmas.
I laugh thinking that players once lived in dorms at Syracuse (they still do at Duke).

Colleges should drop the pretext.
Don't even require classwork.
Just recruit players to wear their uniforms.
And give them a choice: full scholarship, room & board and stipend or the equivalent in salary.