Favorite thing I keep seeing Duke fans saying...

[Geode]

"We've played other teams that play 2-3 so we should be fine."

Never heard that one before...

Have to love the people who don't quite get that our 2-3 is unique in college basketball.

Maybe they borrowed Beilein's practice brooms

 

[RMH44]

not just duke fans are saying that. jimmy dykes last nite said something like "duke played eastern michigan which plays an EXACT REPLICA of syacuse's 2/3 zone". how can he say that with a straight face?

Exactly. He actually showed video clips of Duke successfully attacking the EMU zone.

And then...when asked who wins the game...he picks us! Bizarre.

 

[NOD1]

And to say Coach K hasn't learned as much or more about SU's Zone from having Jimmy B on the Olympic staff is an understatement of epic proportions.

Duke will be as prepared as any opponent we face.

Yeah, there are reasons that JB is on the Olympic staff. K has always been very eager to pick the minds of his colleagues, whether it's implementing JB'z zone w/ the Olympians (who have the length and speed to be able to implement his zone the way it was meant to be played), or using D'Antoni's offensive principles and incorporating that into his offense over the past 10 yrs. Hell, when he worked with Tom Thibodeau with the Olympians and Tibs started talking about the principles of defending the pick 'n roll, K was sitting there taking notes.

As a Duke alum, I'll say that I don't see my colleagues saying anything about using past 2-3 zones as an indicator if ensured success. What most of us have some comfort in saying, OTOH, is that, if anyone knows JB's zone very well, it's K (hell, the play call for our zone is 'Orange' for a reason), and that knowledge makes us perhaps more confident that Duke may be able to score against it.

Can't wait for tomorrow night.

 

[SU94]

I am actually happy that Duke shot so well from deep on Monday at Pitt.
They went 13-for-25 (52%). It was impressive.

I will concede that Duke is an excellent shooting team from deep.

But I also believe in math, the law of averages, our zone and our length.
I think that this combo will not allow Duke to shoot "lights out" 2 games in a row.

If they do, then all the power to them, they'll likely win. But I just see them more apt to have a sub-par shooting game (33% or less).

Time will tell of course.

Maybe they borrowed Beilein's practice brooms

 

[rosconey]

coach k learned all he wanted to know about the zone when he and jimmy did the olympic staff for years-

that said- knowing the zone and knowing our constantly mutating zone are 2 different things -
wont be a easy game for either team

 

[jekelish]

coach k learned all he wanted to know about the zone when he and jimmy did the olympic staff for years-

that said- knowing the zone and knowing our constantly mutating zone are 2 different things -
wont be a easy game for either team

I agree.

I fully expect us to split with Duke this season. Just don't know which game we will win, which we will lose. I would be shocked if either team wins both games.

 

[ssbriefcase]

Like a chef giving his friend "his" recipe, you always leave an indgredient out so that it's still yours..

 

[Scooch]

Coaches always know how to attack the zone (except Creen) its having the players and getting them to do it which is usually the hurdle IMO. Duke has the players and K has had the time to teach them. Will they have success against us? Yes but to what extent? Also I believe we will have our stretches of bothering them on D.

Exactly.

The 2-3 zone is like playing Blackjack, it's about probabilities. JB bets that college players don't have the patience, passing skills, or court awareness to consistently beat it for 40 minutes. And he constantly makes adjustments to hedge that bet.

Most high-level D-1 coaches are certainly smart enough to know how to beat it. It's that very few have the players who can execute that plan over an entire game, and adjust accordingly.

 

[VeryCuse]

"We've played other teams that play 2-3 so we should be fine."

Never heard that one before...

Have to love the people who don't quite get that our 2-3 is unique in college basketball.

“Now that I think I’ve got everything down, it’s one of the craziest things,” Ennis said of the zone. “Just thinking about it and the ways of it is just genius.” From a Daily Orange article a few days ago.
Kind of thinking' he's got some inside information...

 

[moqui]

Seriously. I also love how some prognosticators equate them shooting well on Monday to how they will shoot on Saturday. I actually heard that moron Bruce Pearl suggest last night that Duke might "shoot us out of our zone." Riiiiight.

One thing we know for a mortal certainty with Jim Boeheim - you might run his team out of the building, but you will never shoot him out of the zone

 

[jekelish]

If those Notre Dame teams with Matt Carroll et al who seemingly always hit 15 treys against us never got us out of the zone, no one will. Ever.

 

[rrlbees]

We don't play a 2-3 zone. We play a 4-1 with great athletes who can slide and collapse quickly depending on where the ball is.

 

[Flora'cuse]

I don't remember who it was, but one of the teams we played (I think in last years tourney (coulda been the BET too)) said something to the effect of;

"regarding the Syracuse 2-3 zone, everywhere you turn, there they are"

Classic!, give me some time and I'll remember who it was.

 

[JeremyCuse]

One thing we know for a mortal certainty with Jim Boeheim - you might run his team out of the building, but you will never shoot him out of the zone

We have been shot out of the zone before, against BYU in the NCAA tourney with Gmac we switched to man because they literally were making everything.

 

[moqui]

only about 10% of the effectiveness of the zone is in the scheme, then maybe another 10% from the length and athleticism of the personnel. the other 80% comes from they way they play it. when the players are fully committed and extend their efforts - as they have the last 5 years - it becomes a weapon more than a simple defense. And that's why you can't replicate it in practice.

(of course, the same is true for coaching at all levels - 1 part Xs and Os, 1 part personnel, 8 parts getting the kids to play hard)

 

[Flora'cuse]

yo moqui; love the shirt

 

[CorduroyG]

If those Notre Dame teams with Matt Carroll et al who seemingly always hit 15 treys against us never got us out of the zone, no one will. Ever.

kyle mcalarney

 

[Doc5120]

not just duke fans are saying that. jimmy dykes last nite said something like "duke played eastern michigan which plays an EXACT REPLICA of syacuse's 2/3 zone". how can he say that with a straight face?

Because Jimmy Dykes is a complete a$$.

 

[Madbiker]

Anyone catch Bruce Pearl last night during the halftime break in the Cincy-Vill game? He was practically foaming at the mouth playing clips of how Duke will dismantle SU's zone using clips from their game against Eastern Michigan. You could tell Pearl really had to control himself from blurting out " I hate Boeheim and that cheap gimmick zone and I really want to see Duke just destroy it because real basketball is played m-2-m". What a tool or should I say what a lying, cheater tool.

 

[RMH44]

Exactly.

The 2-3 zone is like playing Blackjack, it's about probabilities. JB bets that college players don't have the patience, passing skills, or court awareness to consistently beat it for 40 minutes. And he constantly makes adjustments to hedge that bet.

Most high-level D-1 coaches are certainly smart enough to know how to beat it. It's that very few have the players who can execute that plan over an entire game, and adjust accordingly.

I think that many people forget that zone defense was illegal for most of the NBA's history. It was outlawed to promote more entertaining i.e. higher scoring (also see 24 second clock) games. In other words, when played well, zone defenses are very difficult to beat.

 

[RMH44]

I don't remember who it was, but one of the teams we played (I think in last years tourney (coulda been the BET too)) said something to the effect of;

"regarding the Syracuse 2-3 zone, everywhere you turn, there they are"

Classic!, give me some time and I'll remember who it was.

One of the Indiana guards from last year's tournament game said that he never even saw the rim in the first half because of our size.

 

[Bornorange]

And to say Coach K hasn't learned as much or more about SU's Zone from having Jimmy B on the Olympic staff is an understatement of epic proportions.

Duke will be as prepared as any opponent we face.

Exactly. When JB was teaching the team how to play zone, K was taking notes and he still has them.

 

[kuethstheman]

Exactly. When JB was teaching the team how to play zone, K was taking notes and he still has them.

Pity we're not as big this year.

 

[No Hoyas]

Anyone catch Bruce Pearl last night during the halftime break in the Cincy-Vill game? He was practically foaming at the mouth playing clips of how Duke will dismantle SU's zone using clips from their game against Eastern Michigan. You could tell Pearl really had to control himself from blurting out " I hate Boeheim and that cheap gimmick zone and I really want to see Duke just destroy it because real basketball is played m-2-m". What a tool or should I say what a lying, cheater tool.

How do you REALLY feel?

 

[victor]

One thing we know for a mortal certainty with Jim Boeheim - you might run his team out of the building, but you will never shoot him out of the zone

At the end of the day, it will come down to which team wants it more and that will be defined by who wins the battle of the boards. I think our guys will come out on top.