Free pass?

[Pyle]

Reasons why I don't think Dino should be given a free pass and needs to be held accountable now. Not fired, accountable, as in using Scott Shafer as an excuse won't cut it.

He doesn't need 3 years to bring his guys in. That's a BS blanket statement and Dino hasn't coached anywhere for 3 years yet. He's won with other coaches recruits both times. He's never even had his own guys so that statement is garbage.

People said they could feel the Gerg disaster starting as early as year 1. I'm feeling it with Dino. We gave up 50 or more points 5 times last year. That is the equivalent of Gerg's offenses failing to crack 20. On Sat we couldn't get stops when we really needed them.

Blatantly getting outcoached. We got outcoached in every aspect of the game on Sat. It wasn't Jimmy's and Joe's. It was not having the team prepared, not able to adjust, and not able to take advantage of lesser talent.

We wanted a HC with D1 experience so we didn't have to do this shiat again. We still are.

 

[CuseCPT]

I didn't think we had the firepower to adjust. They had a better football team. Who do I put that on? A bunch of problems in the past but mostly SS.

Put me on record as saying Dino is not going to be a disaster.

 

[orange79]

Yay! Because we needed yet another thread like this!

Kudos on free pass - I know UNACCEPTABLE and Man Up were taken.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Shoot me. It was 1 game and while I truly believe that this was the worse loss since the GERG era, It was one game. Lets get through it and hope for a better game versus CMU.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

A month ago everyone was worried that Dino would bolt for a new job.

Now people can't wait to fire him.

And it's still September.

 

[orange79]

Reasons why I don't think Dino should be given a free pass and needs to be held accountable now. Not fired, accountable, as in using Scott Shafer as an excuse won't cut it.

He doesn't need 3 years to bring his guys in. That's a BS blanket statement and Dino hasn't coached anywhere for 3 years yet. He's won with other coaches recruits both times. He's never even had his own guys so that statement is garbage.

People said they could feel the Gerg disaster starting as early as year 1. I'm feeling it with Dino. We gave up 50 or more points 5 times last year. That is the equivalent of Gerg's offenses failing to crack 20. On Sat we couldn't get stops when we really needed them.

Blatantly getting outcoached. We got outcoached in every aspect of the game on Sat. It wasn't Jimmy's and Joe's. It was not having the team prepared, not able to adjust, and not able to take advantage of lesser talent.

We wanted a HC with D1 experience so we didn't have to do this shiat again. We still are.

After you take a deeeeeeeep breath, please tell me exactly what you mean by he "needs to be held accountable now". What does that mean? Serious question. He's already accountable. The loss goes on his record, not the OC or DC. What do you want to do, take away his jet privileges?

 

[omg_cuse_rules]

He lost a game. I think he gets it. Fans are pissed. He said it was on him.

Should he be on his knees crying and begging for forgiveness?

 

[PhatOrange]

eye roll

 

[Cuseregular]

Oy ve

 

[dasher]

The problem goes back to '77. We should never have let Saban leave.

 

[Marroniac]

Perfect time to give him an extension.

 

[Pyle]

I

A month ago everyone was worried that Dino would bolt for a new job.

Now people can't wait to fire him.

And it's still September.

I don't want him fired. I want people to stop blaming Shafer and saying how horrible the program was when he left. Same crap they said about P when Robinson choked.

 

[Pyle]

He lost a game. I think he gets it. Fans are pissed. He said it was on him.

Should he be on his knees crying and begging for forgiveness?

this isn't so much about Dino as his apologists still blaming Shafer.

 

[Pyle]

Yay! Because we needed yet another thread like this!

Kudos on free pass - I know UNACCEPTABLE and Man Up were taken.

If you want to merge this, feel free. Since it was more about the apologists I thought maybe it deserved its own space but I do t care either way.

 

[TheCusian]

this isn't so much about Dino as his apologists still blaming Shafer.

I think you've misread things here. Most everyone is unhappy with how the team played last week. Because we lost to a Shafer D, it's been on everyone's mind.

The reasons we lost are many - including players not executing, coaches not adjusting soon enough, coaches not dealing with Shafer stuff well, etc. But you have to ask where was the program when Babers took over if you want to evaluate him properly in full context. When we do that with the Robinson to Marrone transition, it's favorable for Marrrone. When we do that from Shafer to Babers, it's favorable for Babers IMO (I know you disagree).

You think Babers is Robinson, that's fine. I disagree. But to have the arguement you have to look at context (Shafer).

 

[Alsacs]

What coaches said anonymously about Syracuse football in 2015

ACC Coaches Talk Anonymously About Conference Foes for 2015
What they said then.
"They're one of the most unique teams we play because defensively, it’s like they’re always just coming after you.”

“They play a lot of zone and blitz a lot but whatever the book says, they’ll do the opposite. If it says you’re supposed to sit back and play coverage, they’re coming. As a play-caller, you’re trying to get in a rhythm and build one thing into the next, but they’re coming from everywhere.”

“I don’t want to say they’re unsound, but they’re just always turning guys loose and if you can get the ball out you have a chance to hit them in the mouth, and if they have a busted protection you’re going to hit them.”

“They struggled offensively before the quarterback (Terrel Hunt) got hurt and struggled even more after he got hurt.”

“Watching them on film, it seemed like they were trying to do way too much to compensate for the fact that they didn’t have enough playmakers. The probably outsmarted themselves a little bit.”

“What’s their bread and butter? If they can figure that out they may have a chance because their defense will keep them in some games but they’re probably not going to beat you throwing the ball.”


ACC Coaches Talk Anonymously About Conference Foes for 2017
What they say now.

“Being Year 2 in that system, I think they can be dangerous."

"It’s not easy to pick up that offense in a short period of time, not so much from the schematics but really the tempo of it. (Dino) Babers is used to having a track team at that position when he was at Baylor, and I don’t see that kind of speed there. They had two good veteran receivers who graduated (Amba Etta-Tawo and Brisly Estime), and they can’t run that system without some guys who can beat you vertically."

"They’re still going to play Eric Dungey at quarterback. He’s got some ability, you know, but he gets hurt all the time."

"Their O-line was atrocious last year."

"Syracuse is the kind team you kind of don’t want to play, particularly up there. It’s a bad environment, and if your guys don’t go in there with their mind right, they can beat you. That’s what happened when they beat Virginia Tech."

"Obviously their defense struggled, but it’s so easy to point at that. In reality, their offense put them in a bind quite a bit. They’ll turn the ball over or go quick three-and-out or put their defense in bad situations.”

Syracuse upgraded HCs. Too bad this HC was left the least talented roster in the ACC.

 

[bcubs9497]

Saturday sucked. No doubt about it. Tons of reasons why. That being said, Babers has to stay. First, because his system is proven in the P5 (Baylor and Wazzu come to mind immediately), second is because there's not a coach out there, including the Almighty Saban and the Holy Dabo, who could take what we've got now and be even remotely considered as a serious contender for a divisional championship in the next year or two. At best, it'll be year 3, in my opinion, before anything REALLY positive starts to happen. Third, getting rid of Babers, or taking his legs out from under him, will seriously hinder hiring a replacement. No coach worth their salt would come into the toxic crap hole his leaving prematurely would create. In the meantime, get used to another 4-8 year, followed by a 5-7 or 6-6, before getting above .500 and becoming relevant.

 

[Pyle]

There's been an overall Shafer backlash that it isn't deserved imo and is childish. Shafer may have never scored 60 but he never gave up 70 either. Shafer left holes on the OL, but he brought in good rbs, our best qb since mcnabb according to this whole board before sat, guys like Clark, Franklin, etc. I certainly don't buy claims he set the program back years.

 

[TheCusian]

There's been an overall Shafer backlash that it isn't deserved imo and is childish. Shafer may have never scored 60 but he never gave up 70 either. Shafer left holes on the OL, but he brought in good rbs, our best qb since mcnabb according to this whole board before sat, guys like Clark, Franklin, etc. I certainly don't buy claims he set the program back years.

If you want to pick at it - we gave up 70 because of the increase in tempo. More tempo, more possessions = more points. Shafer oversaw some real ****storms vs FSU and Clemson and GTech, but tried to play keep away, slow ball run the clock. They were every bit the beatdown Babers got last year.

For example, in their first seasons:

Babers, 2016 vs FSU: gave up 8.61 yards per play and 45 points at home
Shafer, 2013 vs FSU: gave up 11.62 yards per play and 59 points on the road to the national champs

Babers, 2016 vs Clemson: gave up 6.73 yards per play and 54 points on the road to the national champs
Shafer, 2013 vs Clemson: gave up 8.10 yards per play and 49 points at home

EDIT: Added points given up

 

[TheCusian]

Saturday sucked. No doubt about it. Tons of reasons why. That being said, Babers has to stay. First, because his system is proven in the P5 (Baylor and Wazzu come to mind immediately), second is because there's not a coach out there, including the Almighty Saban and the Holy Dabo, who could take what we've got now and be even remotely considered as a serious contender for a divisional championship in the next year or two. At best, it'll be year 3, in my opinion, before anything REALLY positive starts to happen. Third, getting rid of Babers, or taking his legs out from under him, will seriously hinder hiring a replacement. No coach worth their salt would come into the toxic crap hole his leaving prematurely would create. In the meantime, get used to another 4-8 year, followed by a 5-7 or 6-6, before getting above .500 and becoming relevant.

I'm a bit more bullish, but not by much. We've got a ways to go.

 

[bcubs9497]

I'm a bit more bullish, but not by much. We've got a ways to go.

Those two 4 star OL in the upcoming class is a good start.

 

[Pyle]

Saturday sucked. No doubt about it. Tons of reasons why. That being said, Babers has to stay. First, because his system is proven in the P5 (Baylor and Wazzu come to mind immediately), second is because there's not a coach out there, including the Almighty Saban and the Holy Dabo, who could take what we've got now and be even remotely considered as a serious contender for a divisional championship in the next year or two. At best, it'll be year 3, in my opinion, before anything REALLY positive starts to happen. Third, getting rid of Babers, or taking his legs out from under him, will seriously hinder hiring a replacement. No coach worth their salt would come into the toxic crap hole his leaving prematurely would create. In the meantime, get used to another 4-8 year, followed by a 5-7 or 6-6, before getting above .500 and becoming relevant.

I don't want him fired and agree with just about all your reasons why he needs to stay. It would be a disaster to do so now. That being said this is in fact our first major What loss since Robinson. Worst loss since Akron imo.

 

[TheCusian]

I don't want him fired and agree with just about all your reasons why he needs to stay. It would be a disaster to do so now. That being said this is in fact our first major What loss since Robinson. Worst loss since Akron imo.

MTSU is better than that Akron team. We should win - but they are no easy win

 

[DeGrozz]

I didn't think we had the firepower to adjust. They had a better football team. Who do I put that on? A bunch of problems in the past but mostly SS.

Put me on record as saying Dino is not going to be a disaster.

I don't think 'we didn't have the firepower' is correct. We basically have the same team that beat VTech in the Dome, less Clark and AET plus we added on a few hand-picked grad transfers.

We've been lucky to avoid pre-season upsets the last 6 or so years, we were due for one, but that doesn't mean that the coach is exempt from blame.

He'll be fine in the long run and is the right coach for Cuse, I just think he had an awful week.

 

[sdhall01]

There's been an overall Shafer backlash that it isn't deserved imo and is childish. Shafer may have never scored 60 but he never gave up 70 either. Shafer left holes on the OL, but he brought in good rbs, our best qb since mcnabb according to this whole board before sat, guys like Clark, Franklin, etc. I certainly don't buy claims he set the program back years.

Wait, what good RBs did he bring in? I'm confused. Moe and Strickland are fine athletes, but they are hardly even serviceable RBs. Hell, Strickland would probably be better served on defense.

The talent he left on D is abysmal. Some of that is due to people leaving after he got fired, but a lot of that is because he left a dearth of talent. We are getting better with the D-Line and secondary taking some positive steps, but there is a reason why, other than Slayton and the linebackers, we're so young on D.

Our O-Line will get there, but we are starting 2 RS Freshmen and RS Freshmen are going to struggle. Hell, a true freshman is on our 2-deep; that's B.A.D. BAD. This will not change with the new guys coming in (if they come in) because a true freshman is going to find it truly difficult to play on the O-Line in the ACC.

Finally, our best offensive player last year was a graduate transfer WR. Yeah, at this point we just don't have a lot of game-ready talent on either side of the ball. Our players with potential are still raw, and our best players, save a couple, are freshman, redshirt freshman, and sophomores. So yeah, it's fair to say that Shafer set us back a couple of years.