Future Campus Framework Discussion

[upperdeck]

many schools have to replace the tech buildings more than once every 35 years and re-do the dorms and other buildings too.

most programs on campus dont bring in any revenue even the ones that get grants, most of that money goes to things that the school doesnt get any money for.

 

[tipphill]

To the point about Bowl Games:
Do The Economics Of Bowl Games Make Sense For Schools, Sponsors?
And for the record, when's the last time we were consistently involved in Bowls, let alone the major BCS ones?

I agree and agreed in my previous post that the student experience is enhanced. I do see the value of a high profile athletics program. Is that student experience worth $250 million? Even if taken over the life of the building, about 35 years, that is about $7.25 million a year. That's not including the other work already done to the Dome over the course of its life. That's at least two roofs prior to this, as well as two new carpets, new video signage, new sound systems, etc. To suggest that would put us over the $10 million per year life cost here is not that far fetched. There are about 25k students. That's $400/student per year just for the Dome if we include this roof. I see the investment, and that really doesn't seem like a lot, but that is an extraordinarily large percentage of the student activity fee. If they spent nothing but the cost to have a team, they'd still have that commonality and community within the school and amongst alumni. What are they investing in? $100 million would buy a substantial new academic building that could bring new programs, and new revenue streams in the form of grants, and new applicants, and potentially part of a patent or two that could raise funds for a new building.
Princeton unveils chemistry lab financed by cancer drug proceeds

Again, I am all for doing this work and I see the potential value, however intangible but I can also see the other facets of the discussion. Your point about other schools with Div. 2 or 3 teams having better academic profiles is only making the point of the nay sayers. Your pointing to Wake Forest or Boston College, Rice, Duke makes even less sense as those are schools with similar or lesser athletic profiles than we have, (really only Duke compares) older smaller stadiums in greater need of attention, and all with academic profiles that are in all honesty higher than that of Syracuse. The aspirant private institution is Notre Dame. Maybe what holds alumni back from donating (just conjecture here) is that they never went to the school for athletics, and yet watched the school's reputation tarnished by it, or saw it held up as the reason the classrooms were not renovated while the Melo Center gets built. I know that's not truly fair, especially if there are donors directing their dollars to that effort, but it seems to me that isn't typically happening. The feeling about the administration when I was on the hill was that they didn't care about us, and on a personal ratifying note, when they called me about a week after I graduated, after five years in a professional degree, and asked for a donation, I said yes, put me down for $50 at this time (I still didn't have a job). They told me they wouldn't take less than $500. I told them they just took about $160K and they could lose my number if that was their attitude. It hasn't been until recently that they started accepting smaller donations. Think of the dollars lost and the feelings of animosity and disrespect they generated. Think of the volume of alumni they alienated.

Congratulations to your daughter. She is a part of a great program. Does she donate? Serious question, not a snide comment.

thank you for the thoughtful reply.
my reference to duke,bc,wake forest,and i forgot northwestern--- was pertaining to their academic prowess and not just football. they do not seem to have issues such as we do.
if we have such success at getting grants and generating income why are we having such financial issues??? has anyone ever polled the alumni and asked why they do not donate and not just to athletics??? the lack of funds does not appear to be related to football only.
what kind of academic building would we build--more of the same???
one of the issues is that no one ever knows where the money goes and for what. su has no transparency and as a private thats fine. it does not on the surface add up.
virtually nothing has occurred in several years to enhance the academics on the hill. there has been no leadership and in fact the academic reputation had declined. where were all the grants and money then??? i am not trying to be difficult, but to be big time (and not football)su needs to take that step---they need to make an investment.
for football it would be at the very least renovations. i wonder how many season ticket holders have been lost in recent years. i would bet none due to the stadium. i bet a whole lot do to watching a bad product in a less than desirable space. hopefully the product will get better and as many posters say and i agree win and they will come.
i have no idea if my daughter donates to any school and i would never ask her. however, i did ask her for the money i spent for the groceries she asked me to p/u as she was tied up at work.

 

[NJCuse97]

Quick and simple in response to couple of your questions:
SU is missing out on many of the grant opportunities due to the lack of many true research programs especially in theoretical science and applied science and engineering. Syverud has singled this issue out as a growth target, and is maybe only second to the VA centric med school (which would also be flush with federal grant opportunities). I think this appetite comes from his experience at Michigan. The new provost is a biologist and a well regarded research advocate. The new CFO is from Carnegie Mellon who is on par with Stanford for patents and entrepreneurial grants and "income". To me, the writing is on the wall with regard to the desired direction. A new academic building would be a science or engineering research facility, something I do not believe truly exists at SU now.

40 Colleges Spending the Most on Research & Development in 2016

 

[shandeezy7]

Quick and simple in response to couple of your questions:
SU is missing out on many of the grant opportunities due to the lack of many true research programs especially in theoretical science and applied science and engineering. Syverud has singled this issue out as a growth target, and is maybe only second to the VA centric med school (which would also be flush with federal grant opportunities). I think this appetite comes from his experience at Michigan. The new provost is a biologist and a well regarded research advocate. The new CFO is from Carnegie Mellon who is on par with Stanford for patents and entrepreneurial grants and "income". To me, the writing is on the wall with regard to the desired direction. A new academic building would be a science or engineering research facility, something I do not believe truly exists at SU now.

40 Colleges Spending the Most on Research & Development in 2016

Seems like the opportunity for more research dollars would have been much better prior to the Trump presidency, with his budget calling for massive cuts to the NSF, NIH, the Office of Science at the DOE and a number of other government organizations that provide research grants to higher education.

 

[NJCuse97]

Seems like the opportunity for more research dollars would have been much better prior to the Trump presidency, with his budget calling for massive cuts to the NSF, NIH, the Office of Science at the DOE and a number of other government organizations that provide research grants to higher education.

Agree, but corporate pharma has changed their business model some to rely more heavily on colleges and academic research to do their R&D. If SU can re-engage BMS in the area, I'm confident they'd see a state match.

 

[chakka3421]

Talk about a major flip flop...

Hearing now we are still in for a renovation just not as expansive or all at once as we all hoped for or what info was released so far. Might have to be done more in phases. How? Supposedly using unexpected ACC TV money but also how much can be raised through normal fundraising. Main focus and #1 goal is to have enough funding to replace the fabric roof with hard roof, led lighting & sound - and get this direct quote, "we are not going to kick the can down the road" and the fabric roof replacement option "is only a last resort".

Other phases would be paint, seating, boxes, lockers & such can be done earlier or later depends upon ACC TV money streams and general fundraising. No changes to widening of walkways, walls, pee troughs, signs, scoreboards or any other structural changes other than roof (unless NY kicks in extra but less and less likely anymore).

2 to 3 years out but no idea on formal announcement.

 

[Toga]

Talk about a major flip flop...

Hearing now we are still in for a renovation just not as expansive or all at once as we all hoped for or what info was released so far. Might have to be done more in phases. How? Supposedly using unexpected ACC TV money but also how much can be raised through normal fundraising. Main focus and #1 goal is to have enough funding to replace the fabric roof with hard roof, led lighting & sound - and get this direct quote, "we are not going to kick the can down the road" and the fabric roof replacement option "is only a last resort".

Other phases would be paint, seating, boxes, lockers & such can be done earlier or later depends upon ACC TV money streams and general fundraising. No changes to widening of walkways, walls, pee troughs, signs, scoreboards or any other structural changes other than roof (unless NY kicks in extra but less and less likely anymore).

2 to 3 years out but no idea on formal announcement.

Me love you long time.

 

[CuseLegacy]

Talk about a major flip flop...

Hearing now we are still in for a renovation just not as expansive or all at once as we all hoped for or what info was released so far. Might have to be done more in phases. How? Supposedly using unexpected ACC TV money but also how much can be raised through normal fundraising. Main focus and #1 goal is to have enough funding to replace the fabric roof with hard roof, led lighting & sound - and get this direct quote, "we are not going to kick the can down the road" and the fabric roof replacement option "is only a last resort".

Other phases would be paint, seating, boxes, lockers & such can be done earlier or later depends upon ACC TV money streams and general fundraising. No changes to widening of walkways, walls, pee troughs, signs, scoreboards or any other structural changes other than roof (unless NY kicks in extra but less and less likely anymore).

2 to 3 years out but no idea on formal announcement.

From what has been posted before the maximum life expectancy of the roof is 25 years and it was last replaced in 1999.

 

[xc84]

Me love you long time.

LOL...he's the one who first posted that basically nothing would be done with the dome and everyone gets in a tizzy about it ready to jump off a ledge. Now he posts that it is not true...and you want to kiss him!

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

thank you for the thoughtful reply.
my reference to duke,bc,wake forest,and i forgot northwestern--- was pertaining to their academic prowess and not just football. they do not seem to have issues such as we do.
if we have such success at getting grants and generating income why are we having such financial issues??? has anyone ever polled the alumni and asked why they do not donate and not just to athletics??? the lack of funds does not appear to be related to football only.
what kind of academic building would we build--more of the same???
one of the issues is that no one ever knows where the money goes and for what. su has no transparency and as a private thats fine. it does not on the surface add up.
virtually nothing has occurred in several years to enhance the academics on the hill. there has been no leadership and in fact the academic reputation had declined. where were all the grants and money then??? i am not trying to be difficult, but to be big time (and not football)su needs to take that step---they need to make an investment.
for football it would be at the very least renovations. i wonder how many season ticket holders have been lost in recent years. i would bet none due to the stadium. i bet a whole lot do to watching a bad product in a less than desirable space. hopefully the product will get better and as many posters say and i agree win and they will come.
i have no idea if my daughter donates to any school and i would never ask her. however, i did ask her for the money i spent for the groceries she asked me to p/u as she was tied up at work.

I bet the donors know where the money goes.

 

[Townie72]

Seems like the opportunity for more research dollars would have been much better prior to the Trump presidency, with his budget calling for massive cuts to the NSF, NIH, the Office of Science at the DOE and a number of other government organizations that provide research grants to higher education.

Wasn't $100 Million of the $250 Million for Federally mandated Accessibility upgrades? That's the heavy hand of Federal mandates in action.

 

[xc84]

Wasn't $100 Million of the $250 Million for Federally mandated Accessibility upgrades?

No. The $100M included the accessibility upgrades.

 

[Townie72]

IMO. the SU alumni don't give like the alumni at other schools because of their view of their relationship to the University versus the views of the alumni of schools where the percentage of alumni giving is very high.

Generally SU alums don't view their time "on the Hill" as being the greatest, most important times of their life.

I've never met an Ivy Leaguer, who didn't manage to tell me in the first 5 minutes of any conversation where they didn't tell me overtly or subtly where they went to school. I have never been to the home of a Duke, UVA, or UNC grad where there was't some visible evidence of where the couple went to school.

These people are connected to their schools.

You'd have to do a very thorough search of our house to figure out where I went to school. And it's the same with people I know that went to most schools. They aren't really connected and when the mailers come in the mail looking for money, they are added to the pile of others looking for "support".

 

[Bayside44]

IMO. the SU alumni don't give like the alumni at other schools because of their view of their relationship to the University versus the views of the alumni of schools where the percentage of alumni giving is very high.

Generally SU alums don't view their time "on the Hill" as being the greatest, most important times of their life.

I've never met an Ivy Leaguer, who didn't manage to tell me in the first 5 minutes of any conversation where they didn't tell me overtly or subtly where they went to school. I have never been to the home of a Duke, UVA, or UNC grad where there was't some visible evidence of where the couple went to school.

These people are connected to their schools.

You'd have to do a very thorough search of our house to figure out where I went to school. And it's the same with people I know that went to most schools. They aren't really connected and when the mailers come in the mail looking for money, they are added to the pile of others looking for "support".

Come over for a drink sometime, you'll know where I went to school.

 

[Townie72]

Come over for a drink sometime, you'll know where I went to school.

I get that.

But you are in the minority and you may be connected via being a bigger-than-usual sports fan. And we are talking about a set of glasses, I suspect.

But if you go around your neighborhood, you'll find some houses with college flags flying. You'll see people with Alumni stickers on the rear or side windows of their cars. They wear alma mater hats and sweatshirts 30 years after graduating. (Unless their kids went to an even fancier school and then they wear that apparel.)

The Cornell people I met in Upstate were the worst. Where they went to school made them feel superior and they definitely liked that feeling.

Having gone to SU isn't, for most, some sort of badge of achievement or indicator of status.

Besides, as much as I like SU sports and want to see them successful, the University seems to want to piss me off with some of the public positions and programs. Gross's lionization of the players who quit the 1970 team was nauseating to me. Cantor's attempt to use the University to pursue all sorts of social goals was off-putting. My SU giving has shrunk significantly.

 

[Cheriehoop]

I don't believe this for a minute. I know so many alumni(alumnae) who absolutely loved their time on the hill and readily tell you tales from the time they were there. What I do sadly believe is there is a disconnect with the administration regarding gift giving. I've also heard that they feel only big time donors are appreciated or even wanted. It seems that there have been many changes over the years in personnel, policies and strategies too. Difficult to make a consistent and meaningful relationship with alumni if small donations are ignored , pleas are disjointed, not coordinated so it's easy to see when alumni can donate larger amounts they look to organizations that seem more appreciative, where they currently feel they have a personal relationship with as the years go by. Hopefully this is all being understood and addressed. I don't believe for a minute that it has anything to do with dissatisfaction with their time at the school itself.

 

[Cuseman78]

I don't believe this for a minute. I know so many alumni(alumnae) who absolutely loved their time on the hill and readily tell you tales from the time they were there. What I do sadly believe is there is a disconnect with the administration regarding gift giving. I've also heard that they feel only big time donors are appreciated or even wanted. It seems that there have been many changes over the years in personnel, policies and strategies too. Difficult to make a consistent and meaningful relationship with alumni if small donations are ignored , pleas are disjointed, not coordinated so it's easy to see when alumni can donate larger amounts they look to organizations that seem more appreciative, where they currently feel they have a personal relationship with as the years go by. Hopefully this is all being understood and addressed. I don't believe for a minute that it has anything to do with dissatisfaction with their time at the school itself.

I'm with you. I'm not sure who Townie hangs out with but there is a tremendous amount of Syracuse pride when I meet fellow alums.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Half the time you read Townie's posts one would think he's a Georgetown grad. I get the frustration with Cantor/Gross, but Cantor hasn't even been in charge for 4 years.

 

[bnoro]

IMO. the SU alumni don't give like the alumni at other schools because of their view of their relationship to the University versus the views of the alumni of schools where the percentage of alumni giving is very high.

Generally SU alums don't view their time "on the Hill" as being the greatest, most important times of their life.

I've never met an Ivy Leaguer, who didn't manage to tell me in the first 5 minutes of any conversation where they didn't tell me overtly or subtly where they went to school. I have never been to the home of a Duke, UVA, or UNC grad where there was't some visible evidence of where the couple went to school.

These people are connected to their schools.

You'd have to do a very thorough search of our house to figure out where I went to school. And it's the same with people I know that went to most schools. They aren't really connected and when the mailers come in the mail looking for money, they are added to the pile of others looking for "support".

All the people I went to school with bleed orange regardless of their connection to the sports program, and every person I meet that went to SU definitely considers it "the greatest, most important times of their life".

The reason I haven't donated (outside of purchasing STs) is because of the debt I'm still in for going there...

 

[Townie72]

All the people I went to school with bleed orange regardless of their connection to the sports program, and every person I meet that went to SU definitely considers it "the greatest, most important times of their life".

The reason I haven't donated (outside of purchasing STs) is because of the debt I'm still in for going there...

That's primarily because you are still in your debt/ initial earning years.

The money comes from the older alums who have acquired some wealth. They are older and the college experience is many years in the past.

Some stay connected and these are the ones who donate significant amounts. At some schools there are a higher percentage than at others.

 

[upperdeck]

how can you be in debt? every college financial aid person i have talked with says its the parents who are paying for kids college bills.

 

[whobut03]

Our higher earning alumni do not contribute to athletics like other schools... It's a fact... Sure, there are certain donors that open their wallets. I've mentioned this to a poster here via PM but a good friend of mine played in the early 70's. Since graduating, he's had 8 teammates turn into multi-millionaires. 8. Do they donate? Sure... But not how a multi-millionaire COULD donate...

Another factor was Gross, particularly during the Robinson years. I know of two instances where two different significant donors donated $100K each to the football team specifically. Only thing is that money went somewhere else... Those two donors have not set foot on campus in 10+ years...

Yeah McNabb donated for the weight room... Well that was because he got a seat on the board of trustees

Carmelo, sure. And I thank him.

Where's Dwight Freeney? Hell, where's Billy Fuccillo?

It's not about how much you "bleed orange". It all comes down to support specifically with those higher earners. What will get them to support I don't know, but I trust John to figure it out.

 

[Bayside44]

I get that.

But you are in the minority and you may be connected via being a bigger-than-usual sports fan. And we are talking about a set of glasses, I suspect.

But if you go around your neighborhood, you'll find some houses with college flags flying. You'll see people with Alumni stickers on the rear or side windows of their cars. They wear alma mater hats and sweatshirts 30 years after graduating. (Unless their kids went to an even fancier school and then they wear that apparel.)

The Cornell people I met in Upstate were the worst. Where they went to school made them feel superior and they definitely liked that feeling.

Having gone to SU isn't, for most, some sort of badge of achievement or indicator of status.

Besides, as much as I like SU sports and want to see them successful, the University seems to want to piss me off with some of the public positions and programs. Gross's lionization of the players who quit the 1970 team was nauseating to me. Cantor's attempt to use the University to pursue all sorts of social goals was off-putting. My SU giving has shrunk significantly.

I have all sorts of stuff. Tastefully done of course.

Plenty of Cuse stuff in Alexandria - gotta remember that kids are playing lax and hoop and our brand is still pretty golden. My son's lax program has more Cuse gear out there than all other schools combined (Duke may be 2).

Syracuse has an issue that so many of what would be a big donor scrambles 6 hours away from campus right after graduation. Most of our peer group doesn't have that issue.

 

[Cheriehoop]

All the people I went to school with bleed orange regardless of their connection to the sports program, and every person I meet that went to SU definitely considers it "the greatest, most important times of their life".

The reason I haven't donated (outside of purchasing STs) is because of the debt I'm still in for going there...

Exactly. Not being in a position to donate or to give a large donation will probably change over one's lifetime. That fact should be understood but involvement should be encouraged regardless. Time and situations change but true relationships last. Ask when an alumnus, alumna feels they would be in a better position to give and follow up but continue to invite all to be involved in local, national alumni events ,organizations etc so the close connection continues.

 

[MSOrange]

I don't believe this for a minute. I know so many alumni(alumnae) who absolutely loved their time on the hill and readily tell you tales from the time they were there. What I do sadly believe is there is a disconnect with the administration regarding gift giving. I've also heard that they feel only big time donors are appreciated or even wanted. It seems that there have been many changes over the years in personnel, policies and strategies too. Difficult to make a consistent and meaningful relationship with alumni if small donations are ignored , pleas are disjointed, not coordinated so it's easy to see when alumni can donate larger amounts they look to organizations that seem more appreciative, where they currently feel they have a personal relationship with as the years go by. Hopefully this is all being understood and addressed. I don't believe for a minute that it has anything to do with dissatisfaction with their time at the school itself.

Totally agree. I graduated from Mercer in 1998 and only recently started giving $250 year a couple years ago. The very next year after my first donation, they were calling and emailing like I was Bill Gates throwing money around.