Gotta say Kaiser is right about the CFB playoffs the Big XII is in trouble

[Millhouse]

it's ridiculous that Baylor is ranked ahead of Okie State. OSU just beat a top team in TCU and Baylor has the 109th ranked schedule. As mentioned, their OOC schedule is laughable. I personally don't trust the committee, too much subjectivity and agendas with the human element. The BCS computers always got the top 2 right and would have gotten the top 4 also.

all the big 12 stuff will sort itself out, the 3 good teams play each other the rest of the way. they should have 3 unbeatens, that would really be a fun end to the season

 

[bpo57]

No.

Betting on it is stupid.

Why the fluck would I care to bet on something, that I really don't give a fluck about?

And the only days to do so, would be the Sunday and Monday after championship weekend.

Your act is tiresome. You said a week ago that ND was "out of the playoff picture." Yet here they are ranked 4th. It's hard to take you seriously.

 

[sabach]

If rather have the chance to play it out on the field for a markedly better chance than leaving a flimsy case in the hands of the committee.

ND has a chance to play it out on the field - by going undefeated. All they want is access to the playoff. An easier road to give up the identity of the program is not sufficient of a reason to give up independence and if you prefer, the money that comes from independence. Call it arrogance or craziness if you want.

 

[bpo57]

And if that is the case, why do you care that ND has made it harder to win a NC? If the one OOC game ND loses is Navy, that is a big deal. ND has a gentlemen's agreement to play Navy in perpetuity as a thank you for saving ND as a school years ago. I get that tradition and such mean less and less in today's society, especially in college sports but ND does value its tradition and independence even if it means that an 11-1 ND team misses out on the playoffs. If a 12-0 ND team is left out, things may change.

Re your last sentence: better chance of seeing JB go man to man for the rest of his coaching career then that happening.

 

[TheCusian]

Your act is tiresome. You said a week ago that ND was "out of the playoff picture." Yet here they are ranked 4th. It's hard to take you seriously.

ND's case at one loss is really tricky every year. This year they have a shot because they happen to play Stanford who is in direct competition for the same spot. Won't always happen like that.

 

[TheCusian]

ND has a chance to play it out on the field - by going undefeated. All they want is access to the playoff. An easier road to give up the identity of the program is not sufficient of a reason to give up independence and if you prefer, the money that comes from independence. Call it arrogance or craziness if you want.

I love it. You forget we were independent in lacrosse until 2010. We have more hardware and prestige in lacrosse than ND does in FB. Our identity is intact as a member of the ACC.

Edit: money wise - it's not clear it's a better deal http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissm...-acc-move-doesnt-make-sense-without-football/ ... The article references a deal that hadn't been made yet, but the extension in 2016 is roughly the same $.

 

[bpo57]

ND's case at one loss is really tricky every year. This year they have a shot because they happen to play Stanford who is in direct competition for the same spot. Won't always happen like that.

I agree with that. But with all of the upsets that happen in college football every year you can usually rely on some help here and there. With their typical sked I'd say an 11-1 ND will get in around 75% of the time minimum.

 

[KaiserUEO]

Your act is tiresome. You said a week ago that ND was "out of the playoff picture." Yet here they are ranked 4th. It's hard to take you seriously.

Your nd love act is annoying.

I said that nd would be out at 11-1 under the circumstances I have repeatedly laid out here.

I have also said why the Bevo will left out if certain circumstances are met too.

You said no nd wouldn't, want to place a bet on it for some god knows reason, keep pointing to this weeks poll and basically state that the committee is ready to screw over more deserving teams to put them in like the calendar states its 1985 or something.

 

[bpo57]

I love it. You forget we were independent in lacrosse until 2010. We have more hardware and prestige in lacrosse than ND does in FB. Our identity is intact as a member of the ACC.

Edit: money wise - it's not clear it's a better deal http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissm...-acc-move-doesnt-make-sense-without-football/ ... The article references a deal that hadn't been made yet, but the extension in 2016 is roughly the same $.

That article compares what ND receives just for its home games with NBC, which is $15 mil per year. Every road game they play is usually on prime time tv and they get paid plenty of $$$ for those games, too. Add all of that up and they make more $$$ than anybody in the ACC and yet still get to keep their independence.

 

[TheCusian]

I agree with that. But with all of the upsets that happen in college football every year you can usually rely on some help here and there. With their typical sked I'd say an 11-1 ND will get in around 75% of the time minimum.

Way, way too high. They won't beat out any P5 one loss team that wins its conference championship. They will be on pretty even footing with the Big 12 1 loss teams (could go either way). So you're hoping that one of the P5 conf champs has two losses, the SEC doesn't have two teams with 1 loss, and the Big 12 doesn't have an undefeated team or a compelling 1 loss team with a greater SOS?

 

[sabach]

I love it. You forget we were independent in lacrosse until 2010. We have more hardware and prestige in lacrosse than ND does in FB. Our identity is intact as a member of the ACC.

Edit: money wise - it's not clear it's a better deal http://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissm...-acc-move-doesnt-make-sense-without-football/ ... The article references a deal that hadn't been made yet, but the extension in 2016 is roughly the same $.

I'm not even going to get into a discussion which compares ND football to SU lacrosse though I love them both.

 

[sabach]

That article compares what ND receives just for its home games with NBC, which is $15 mil per year. Every road game they play is usually on prime time tv and they get paid plenty of $$$ for those games, too. Add all of that up and they make more $$$ than anybody in the ACC and yet still get to keep their independence.

It's funny you bring this up. My seven year old son is just getting into sitting down and watching FB with me this year. He couldn't understand why ND wasn't playing at night last week. I told him they sometimes play in the afternoon. That said, last week at Pitt was the first time ND has played at noon in 4 years.

 

[bpo57]

Your nd love act is annoying.

I said that nd would be out at 11-1 under the circumstances I have repeatedly laid out here.

I have also said why the Bevo will left out if certain circumstances are met too.

You said no nd wouldn't, want to place a bet on it for some god knows reason, keep pointing to this weeks poll and basically state that the committee is ready to screw over more deserving teams to put them in like the calendar states its 1985 or something.

I wanted to place a bet with you because you have a lot of bravado but when called on it you back off. I was willing to bet you right now that ND would be in at 11-1 and even take the risk that "Bevo" has an undefeated team. Stupid comments like ND is "out of the picture" show you to be a common bloviator.

 

[sabach]

Way, way too high. They won't beat out any P5 one loss team that wins its conference championship. They will be on pretty even footing with the Big 12 1 loss teams (could go either way). So you're hoping that one of the P5 conf champs has two losses, the SEC doesn't have two teams with 1 loss, and the Big 12 doesn't have an undefeated team or a compelling 1 loss team with a greater SOS?

No - we are hoping ND goes 12-0 and are willing to live with the consequences if it doesn't happen.

 

[bpo57]

Way, way too high. They won't beat out any P5 one loss team that wins its conference championship. They will be on pretty even footing with the Big 12 1 loss teams (could go either way). So you're hoping that one of the P5 conf champs has two losses, the SEC doesn't have two teams with 1 loss, and the Big 12 doesn't have an undefeated team or a compelling 1 loss team with a greater SOS?

I disagree for two reasons. It's hard to go 12-1 and to have four P5 teams do it is unlikely to happen every year. Also, ND often will play some of their potential competitors for that F4 spot each year whether it be Clemson, FSU, USC, Stanford, MSU, OSU (in the future) etc. so they can box out one or more of these teams with a win as would be the case if they beat Stanford.

 

[bpo57]

Way, way too high. They won't beat out any P5 one loss team that wins its conference championship. They will be on pretty even footing with the Big 12 1 loss teams (could go either way). So you're hoping that one of the P5 conf champs has two losses, the SEC doesn't have two teams with 1 loss, and the Big 12 doesn't have an undefeated team or a compelling 1 loss team with a greater SOS?

Are you including the B12 in that one loss prediction?

 

[KaiserUEO]

I wanted to place a bet with you because you have a lot of bravado but when called on it you back off. I was willing to bet you right now that ND would be in at 11-1 and even take the risk that "Bevo" has an undefeated team. Stupid comments like ND is "out of the picture" show you to be a common bloviator.

I've backed off on nothing.

My position is clear on this.

I also see no reason to 'bet' on something in which there's no skill or any more fun involved than I'm already having now.

And yes, part of my position is bloviating to make you look like an arse.

It's working quite well, if I may so myself.

 

[TheCusian]

That article compares what ND receives just for its home games with NBC, which is $15 mil per year. Every road game they play is usually on prime time tv and they get paid plenty of $$$ for those games, too. Add all of that up and they make more $$$ than anybody in the ACC and yet still get to keep their independence.

I don't think the away team takes in TV money, near as I can tell.

ACC team: 18m + bowl $ divided
ND: 15m NBC football money + ACC non-football money + bowl money

Adding ND in all sports but football added roughly 1.2m for each team. Adding ND for football would lead to new deal worth more (in theory at least).

 

[TheCusian]

No - we are hoping ND goes 12-0 and are willing to live with the consequences if it doesn't happen.

Hey man, good luck! It just may work out this year.

 

[suorange08]

ALL I am saying is that I am happy that OSU, Baylor & TCU were not ranked in the first four. I assume that a good chunk of that was due to their abysmal OOC schedule.

And if their OOC schedule ends up being the determining factor that keeps one of them from getting into the top four, maybe it will force them to schedule some marquee opponents in the OOC.

And that will be more really attractive, early season games.

Also, the more games there are between the top teams of the different P5 conferences, the more data points one has for determining conference superiority - potentially helping to make a case for who got in and who didn't...

I definitely agree. It's ridiculous that they have been scheduling like Rutgers. I thought that after last year Baylor would have learned though they only have Duke as P5 school in the next few years. TCU at least is home and home with Arkansas, Ohio State and California.

I think we are going to start seeing some great early season games though. Ohio State has Oklahoma, TCU and Oregon home and home. In 2022 and 2023 they play Texas and Notre Dame both years.

 

[TheCusian]

I disagree for two reasons. It's hard to go 12-1 and to have four P5 teams do it is unlikely to happen every year. Also, ND often will play some of their potential competitors for that F4 spot each year whether it be Clemson, FSU, USC, Stanford, MSU, OSU (in the future) etc. so they can box out one or more of these teams with a win as would be the case if they beat Stanford.

Since 2010, the P5 has had 4-6 undefeated or 1 loss teams after conference championship games every year:

2010: 1 SEC / 2 Pac12 / 3 B1G / 0 ACC / 0 B12 = 6 (no room for a 1 loss ND team)
2011: 2 SEC / 1 Pac12 / 0 B1G / 0 ACC / 1 B12 = 4 (maybe get in over 1 loss, #3 Ok St)
2012: 2 SEC / 1 Pac12 / 0 B1G / 0 ACC / 1 B12 = 4 (ND went undefeated, but with one loss could have been interesting)
2013: 2 SEC / 0 Pac12 / 2 B1G / 1 ACC / 1 B12 = 6 (no room for a 1 loss ND team)
2014: 1 SEC / 1 Pac12 / 1 B1G / 1 ACC / 2 B12 = 6 (no room for a 1 loss ND team)

Now they were only in "play off contention" (had it existed) in one of those years (2012 - where they went undefeated) and would have been in no matter what. (In fact they've only been in "playoff contention" once since 2002.)

So - it's not that hard to go 12-1. At least 4 have done it every year since 2012. It's far more unlikely that there is a "clean" open spot for a 1 loss ND team. Usually, if you get a shot it will be against a 1 loss B12 team and SOS.

 

[bpo57]

I don't think the away team takes in TV money, near as I can tell.

ACC team: 18m + bowl $ divided
ND: 15m NBC football money + ACC non-football money + bowl money

Adding ND in all sports but football added roughly 1.2m for each team. Adding ND for football would lead to new deal worth more (in theory at least).

I don't know for sure but it seems odd to me that ND would not get any money for playing prime time games on the road. NBC pays for the right to air six or seven ND home games. Who pays ND when they play those other 5-6 games? I'm assuming they don't play those for free.

 

[TheCusian]

I don't know for sure but it seems odd to me that ND would not get any money for playing prime time games on the road. NBC pays for the right to air six or seven ND home games. Who pays ND when they play those other 5-6 games? I'm assuming they don't play those for free.

I'm not totally sure. It's hard to find that info. But as far as I can tell, teams with TV deals get the money when they play on that network or family of networks. That's TV money.

Getting into things like Syracuse vs ND at MetLife? No idea how much each team actually walked away with from the stadium.

 

[bpo57]

Since 2010, the P5 has had 4-6 undefeated or 1 loss teams after conference championship games every year:

2010: 1 SEC / 2 Pac12 / 3 B1G / 0 ACC / 0 B12 = 6 (no room for a 1 loss ND team)
2011: 2 SEC / 1 Pac12 / 0 B1G / 0 ACC / 1 B12 = 4 (maybe get in over 1 loss, #3 Ok St)
2012: 2 SEC / 1 Pac12 / 0 B1G / 0 ACC / 1 B12 = 4 (ND went undefeated, but with one loss could have been interesting)
2013: 2 SEC / 0 Pac12 / 2 B1G / 1 ACC / 1 B12 = 6 (no room for a 1 loss ND team)
2014: 1 SEC / 1 Pac12 / 1 B1G / 1 ACC / 2 B12 = 6 (no room for a 1 loss ND team)

Now they were only in "play off contention" (had it existed) in one of those years (2012 - where they went undefeated) and would have been in no matter what. (In fact they've only been in "playoff contention" once since 2002.)

So - it's not that hard to go 12-1. At least 4 have done it every year since 2012. It's far more unlikely that there is a "clean" open spot for a 1 loss ND team. Usually, if you get a shot it will be against a 1 loss B12 team and SOS.

The first and main premise I don't agree with is the notion that a one loss ND can't get in over a one loss P5 team. I don't think I will have to wait long to be proven right IF ND beats Stanford.

 

[TheCusian]

The first and main premise I don't agree with is the notion that a one loss ND can't get in over a one loss P5 team. I don't think I will have to wait long to be proven right IF ND beats Stanford.

They won't unless it's a B12 team. That one extra game vs one of the best teams in your conference does them in every time. 12-1 > 11-1.