I may get killed for this,

[sufandu]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

 

[Trueblue25]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

Agreed.

 

[anomander]

I don't think your wrong, but I also think there were many aspects of MCW's game that were under-appreciated because they didn't show up in the box score. MCW was the reason we had the best defensive teams in Boeheim's career.

Ennis is a very special player though

 

[sufandu]

I don't think your wrong, but I also think there were many aspects of MCW's game that were under-appreciated because they didn't show up in the box score. MCW was the reason we had the best defensive teams in Boeheim's career.

Ennis is a very special player though

Yeah, I considered that. There is certainly some trade off defensively.

 

[Dave85]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

Agreed.

 

[Melancer46]

I don't think your wrong, but I also think there were many aspects of MCW's game that were under-appreciated because they didn't show up in the box score. MCW was the reason we had the best defensive teams in Boeheim's career.

Ennis is a very special player though

Agreed with this.

It's really just about fit. Both guys were great PGs that play in completely different ways. MCW, in my opinion, is more capable of carrying a team when nobody else is scoring. He can make things happen better than Ennis can IMO, whether it be forcing some turnovers and getting easy buckets in transition, or just some of the ridiculous passes he was able to make that nobody else in the country could even really see.

Ennis is a great fit for a team with a couple guys that can create some offense for themselves (CJ, Grant, and to an extent, Cooney). Ennis is definitely a better ball-handler, and is much safer in terms of protecting the ball.

I stand by what I said earlier in the year. I think that at some point, Ennis' preference to take care of the ball rather than making the amazing play happen sometimes will end up costing us a game here or there, just like MCW and Scoop's preference to try to make things happen cost us a few times.

In regards to being an NBA prospect, I think MCW was a far better prospect, but who knows how Ennis will develop in his time here.

 

[capeorange]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

Agree, Ennis protects the ball and makes smarter decisions. Ennis also does not have the jump with quarter turn do I pass or shoot turn the ball over move that MCW had.

 

[Jack Hall]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

The thing is, as good as MCWs defense was, you need to really score the ball too to win it all. MCW and BT struggled to score it. I am not convinced Ennis bogs down against a michigan the way MCW did...

 

[sufandu]

MCW, in my opinion, is more capable of carrying a team when nobody else is scoring. He can make things happen better than Ennis can IMO.

I don't know that I agree with this. Ennis gets in the paint just as easily, sometimes easier, than MCW did, and I think he's a better finisher (we will never know how much of that is because of the new rules). I also think he's a better interior passer off the dribble. I think MCW finished and passed in a more spectacular fashion because of his athleticism, but two points is worth the same no matter how it gets put up there.

 

[TheCusian]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

To be honest - I'm happy it's not open to debate. Ennis is here and MCW is not. Both are special, special PG's.

 

[SWC75]

Don't worry, we'll attend your funeral.

I think MCW was forced to try to do too much by himself due to the offensive limitations of the team. Ennis seems to have more options. And MCW was a big part of our excellent defense last year, especially down the stretch. I have a feeling that if MCW was quarterbacking this team, he'd seem "smoother" than he was last year.

That said, we are in great shape with Tyler at the helm.

 

[OttoMets]

The thing is, as good as MCWs defense was, you need to really score the ball too to win it all. MCW and BT struggled to score it. I am not convinced Ennis bogs down against a michigan the way MCW did...

The defense was awesome for a bunch of games and that's why we won our way to a Final Four. But the offense was putrid for much of the Big East season. I'll take a little less defense with a big bump in offensive execution.

Ennis is much better for this team.

There's no way to prove this, but if basketball kept track of assists as they do in hockey, I have a hunch that Ennis has a ton more second assists than Mike did. He was good at making the obvious pass for an assist. Ennis is excellent at making the pass before the pass, moving the defense and putting someone in a position to score. Very smart basketball player.

 

[Melancer46]

I don't know that I agree with this. Ennis gets in the paint just as easily, sometimes easier, than MCW did, and I think he's a better finisher (we will never know how much of that is because of the new rules). I also think he's a better interior passer off the dribble. I think MCW finished and passed in a more spectacular fashion because of his athleticism, but two points is worth the same no matter how it gets put up there.

Eh, I don't think that's really true. MCW could get into the paint against anybody. Ennis struggles to do so without a screen, and that's even with the new rules making it significantly easier, and I don't really think their passing abilities are very close to be honest. MCW saw the floor and passed the ball as well as I've seen in a college player in a long time. But obviously it cost us here and there as well because he'd try to do too much, whereas Ennis is extremely good at not forcing anything.

And I don't think we'll have a good gauge for how good a finisher Ennis is until we get into the meat of our conference schedule. My gut feeling is that he's going to struggle inside. Just too limited in terms of athleticism.

 

[Melancer46]

The defense was awesome for a bunch of games and that's why we won our way to a Final Four. But the offense was putrid for much of the Big East season. I'll take a little less defense with a big bump in offensive execution.

Ennis is much better for this team.

There's no way to prove this, but if basketball kept track of assists as they do in hockey, I have a hunch that Ennis has a ton more second assists than Mike did. He was good at making the obvious pass for an assist. Ennis is excellent at making the pass before the pass, moving the defense and putting someone in a position to score. Very smart basketball player.

Comparing this year's offense to last year's is just night and day though. This year, almost all of our offense is running Cooney off of screens and having CJ trail behind him for easy looks from the corner here and there, or clearing out for CJ and seeing what he can do. Last year, there was no off-ball movement. It really seemed like we had no half-court sets besides "Give the ball to MCW and let him beat his man and we'll go from there".

I agree that Ennis is probably better for this team, but I also think that MCW was better for last year's team. Like I said, they're two very different types of players, and have a certain team that they fit into better.

 

[OttosBestFriend]

I think I read somewhere that Ennis has ELEVEN (11) turnovers through TEN (10) 10 games.

Last season, after 10 contests, MCW had THIRTY EIGHT (38) turnovers - Or 345% more than Ennis.

And let's not forget how much more difficult the schedule has been this year.

Sure, SU played San Diego State and at Arkansas, but that was pretty much it for games one through ten in 2012-13.

This year, 'Cuse has played Minnesota, Cal, Baylor, Indiana and St John's - Much, much tougher opponents.

That's all you really need to know, if Ennis' turnover stat is indeed true.

 

[Guinness]

I think I read somewhere that Ennis has ELEVEN (11) turnovers through TEN (10) 10 games.

Last season, after 10 contests, MCW had THIRTY EIGHT (38) turnovers - Or 345% more than Ennis.

And let's not forget how much more difficult the schedule has been this year.

Sure, SU played San Diego State and at Arkansas, but that was pretty much it for games one through ten in 2012-13.

This year, 'Cuse has played Minnesota, Cal, Baylor, Indiana and St John's - Much, much tougher opponents.

That's all you really need to know, if Ennis' turnover stat is indeed true.

^This

I love the fact that Ennis doesn't make me yell at the TV the way MCW did. There is a just a level of maturity at the PG spot now that we have not had in a while.

 

[SoBristol]

Good case for Ennis at this stage of the season -- less flash, but way fewer turn-overs, and the team is winning against good opposition. Not an equal to MCW on defense or in leading fast breaks, not as explosive, but he gets in done in the half-court offense. He benefits (comparing to MCW) from improvements in his teammates at every position.

The issue is: does Ennis improve from here? He already plays with the maturity of a senior. He can't cut down on turn-overs.

 

[OttosBestFriend]

The issue is: does Ennis improve from here? He already plays with the maturity of a senior. He can't cut down on turn-overs.

Considering he's only 19 and has played all of 10 games at this level, I'd be willing to bet he can improve immensely.

Not even sure why you'd suggest he's plateaued.

 

[sufandu]

Eh, I don't think that's really true. MCW could get into the paint against anybody. Ennis struggles to do so without a screen, and that's even with the new rules making it significantly easier, and I don't really think their passing abilities are very close to be honest. MCW saw the floor and passed the ball as well as I've seen in a college player in a long time. But obviously it cost us here and there as well because he'd try to do too much, whereas Ennis is extremely good at not forcing anything.

And I don't think we'll have a good gauge for how good a finisher Ennis is until we get into the meat of our conference schedule. My gut feeling is that he's going to struggle inside. Just too limited in terms of athleticism.

I think you're using some selective memory. There were a number of games last year MCW had difficulty getting into the lane, mostly against smaller quick guards. Saying Ennis "struggles" is also inaccurate. He doesn't blow by his guy. He probes the defense and when he notices an opportunity he takes it. Can he take over a game like that? Maybe not, but it also leads to fewer mistakes.

 

[OttoMets]

Considering he's only 19 and has played all of 10 games at this level, I'd be willing to bet he can improve immensely.

Not even sure why you'd suggest he's plateaued.

Can't speak for Bristol, but I took that as a legitimate question, not a suggestion that he's peaked.

It's not uncommon for guys to come in as capable freshman and not develop much more over four years. There's a guy who graduated from Syracuse just a few months ago who probably fits that description.

That said, I assume Ennis is going to make more than incremental improvements: piling up the steal totals once defense is second nature to him and he doesn't have to think as much, becoming a good outside shooter with increased volume, making some S&C strides (though I don't think he's got the frame to bulk up too much).

 

[SoBristol]

Considering he's only 19 and has played all of 10 games at this level, I'd be willing to bet he can improve immensely.

Not even sure why you'd suggest he's plateaued.

Age has nothing to do with this. Same for # of games.
It is the way he plays (already like a 4 year starter) and a consideration of where the opportunity is to get better. Ennis played at a very high level as a senior in HS -- against good competition. Same, over the summer, for the Canadian team. He is smart, plays under control.
But he isn't like some of the players who develop in college -- by improving their ball-handling, by adding needed muscle, by adjusting form on a jump-shot, by adding a move to the left, or learning how to get the best from teammates.
Ennis can improve his S&C over the summer. His outside shooting should improve year over year. But how much?
This isn't a knock on Ennis -- it comes with noting that he already plays as a savvy senior.

 

[two3zone]

MCW had an NBA game through and through, his body and skill set were built for it. Ennis is the kind of point guard I like, pass first, no turnovers, high iq, will nail a shot if needed. May not be as exciting to watch but he is going to win a ton of games for us and be an absolute rock for us. Both are excellent point guards but Ennis is more suited for the college game, MCW better suited for the NBA game.

 

[SWC75]

Ennis probably is 90% of the player he would be as a senior. That's fine. No quantum improvement is needed. Sometimes people get frustrated when they don't see players "blossom" while they are here. Lawrence Moten, GMAC and Brandon Triche are players who got criticized for not "getting better" when they really didn't need to.

 

[Melancer46]

For what it's worth, in regards to Ennis being a better finisher inside than MCW was, he's currently shooting 40.3% inside the arc. MCW shot 43.6% last year inside 3 point range.

I think Ennis' missed dunk attempt yesterday kinda shows why I think he's going to struggle with that facet of his game, and I don't think it's something that he'll ever really develop. Even Trey Burke struggles immensely finishing inside (shooting around 25% inside 3 point range in the NBA right now compared to around 40% from 3). He's very much an under-the-rim player. It just makes it very difficult to finish with any consistency.

And yeah, I agree with some of the other guys that wonder how much he'll really develop here. He's not going to improve his ball-handling significantly since he's already great there. He probably won't improve his assist numbers, though I could see him getting more comfortable and seeing the floor a little better or something. If he can get better defensively, improve his 3 point shot a bit more (which is already good, but I think he tends to be hesitant shooting the ball), and improve in his ability to run the fast break, I think that's pretty much what we need to hope for.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

but I like Ennis better than MCW as a point guard for this team. I know MCW has been great this year in the association and I'm not saying I necessarily think Ennis will even be as good as a pro (I don't know one way or the other). I think Ennis does a great job of being exactly what this team needs. He is always under control and makes far fewer mistakes than any of us had the right to expect. He does a great job of getting everyone involved and, I think, manages to promote great team chemistry and unselfishness. Then to top it off, he knows how to pick his spots to go to the basket and almost always gets a controlled shot off (despite not being particularly big or superiorly athletic) or finds the open man. I'm looking forward to watching him the rest of this season.

IMO - TE is a far superior COLLEGE PG to MCW. MCW is a far superior NBA prospect as a PG than TE will be. The biggest difference for the NBA is size and speed. For college, a guy that understands what a coach wants, is always in control, and looks for his teammates 1st, is a better option, usually.