I think its all out in the Colgate game no holding back

[Newhouser]

I don't think they can beat us. I do however think that people who see us totally shutting down their offense are in for a surprise. I think we score at will, and eventually wear them down with tempo and deeper and better people.

 

[TheCusian]

I think 55-17. And that not enough people have watched game tape of this offense.

YouTube: Bowling Green vs Indiana, Baylor vs TCU, etc.

 

[donniesyracuse]

I think 55-17. And that not enough people have watched game tape of this offense.

YouTube: Bowling Green vs Indiana, Baylor vs TCU, etc.

You don't think it's possible that the offense could struggle in its first game?

 

[OrangePA]

Agree 100%, two new schemes, I can see the O being too hyped up and executing poorly and confusion on defense and giving up some big plays. I say down at halftime and we win a close one. I have just seen it too many times, hopefully it's not as bad as Villanova but I agree people tend to lump FCS teams together too often. Colgate is a good team capable of beating Syracuse if we play poorly on BOTH sides of the ball

Based on what I saw during the spring game, I don't think we'll see poor execution - at least on offense.

During the spring game, the offense functioned remarkably well - for the number of plays run, there were very few mistakes.

The team looked very well coached.

I have a feeling that the offense could really cook on opening night against a far less talented team.

 

[TheCusian]

You don't think it's possible that the offense could struggle in its first game?

Of course it's possible. Just not likely. This offense is pretty unique in CFB. I'm not sure how Colgate will deal with it. It's the combo of P5 athleticism and scheme that tilts this thing heavily in our favor. Even if it's running at 60% and we give away a few possessions - it will be enough.

If game 1 was vs an ACC school, I'd be more worried as the talent gap would be closed.

 

[FAL]

You don't think it's possible that the offense could struggle in its first game?

Haven't we seen enough of that for the past decade? I want to see an offensive juggernaut right from the first snap!

 

[donniesyracuse]

I want to see an offensive juggernaut right from the first snap!

Me too!

 

[Pyle]

Dino Baber's offense scored 49 points in his first ever game as a HC. In the first game of his 2nd season he scored 40 points. First game at BG, 31 points. First game 2nd season, 30 points. In both games at BG he was outmatched and still put up 30. The first game at BG was against eventual Bahamas Bowl winner WKU and the 1st game of the 2nd season was against top 25 Tennessee. I don't think Colgate's FCS defense is going to slow down this offense. Babers has the offense ready to go on day 1. It takes 2 years to fully implement the system but that doesn't mean the initial roll-out is without its merits.

 

[TheCusian]

Dino Baber's offense scored 49 points in his first ever game as a HC. In the first game of his 2nd season he scored 40 points. First game at BG, 31 points. First game 2nd season, 30 points. In both games at BG he was outmatched and still put up 30. The first game at BG was against eventual Bahamas Bowl winner WKU and the 1st game of the 2nd season was against top 25 Tennessee. I don't think Colgate's FCS defense is going to slow down this offense. Babers has the offense ready to go on day 1. It takes 2 years to fully implement the system but that doesn't mean the initial roll-out is without its merits.

This.

 

[KaiserUEO]

if im Babers, I put a BIG 44 on the wall in new football center...wait, theres already 1 there?? cool.

then I point to it and tell the Offense that is the minimum # of acceptable points per game.

every game.

no matter the opponent.

 

[Chip]

If I were Babers, I think I would let Colgate beat us.

Louisville won't know what hit them.

 

[upperdeck]

I think people over look that the style we ran the last few years was not dramatically different to what we will be doing now. with all its parts we moved the ball pretty well at times. this isnt a huge learning curve like going from BC power run would be. the learning curve is on pace of play and reads. with so many WR playing it takes time for many to get up to speed and for the team to see all the things the D wants to do to stop it.

still all the best plays in the world fall apart when the throws are poor and the passes are dropped, we left big pass plays all over the field last year against LSU on throws and drops. these throws are easier but you still need to make the play. one thing pace does is give you 20-30 more chances to make plays.

the next step is getting P5 players running this. BG had 2-3 pretty good ones and then filled in with 6-7 lower level talent. I think our on the low end is much better than BG and time will tell if our top end is better.

again with pace though our 3-4-5-6 level WR will not have to play against the other teams top 2-3 like they had to last year. this system will force them to swap out and only the elite teams go 4-5 deep with quality corners. they will need to go 7-8 deep if we have any luck moving the ball with all the verticals this offense throws..

 

[TheCusian]

I think people over look that the style we ran the last few years was not dramatically different to what we will be doing now. with all its parts we moved the ball pretty well at times. this isnt a huge learning curve like going from BC power run would be. the learning curve is on pace of play and reads. with so many WR playing it takes time for many to get up to speed and for the team to see all the things the D wants to do to stop it.

still all the best plays in the world fall apart when the throws are poor and the passes are dropped, we left big pass plays all over the field last year against LSU on throws and drops. these throws are easier but you still need to make the play. one thing pace does is give you 20-30 more chances to make plays.

the next step is getting P5 players running this. BG had 2-3 pretty good ones and then filled in with 6-7 lower level talent. I think our on the low end is much better than BG and time will tell if our top end is better.

again with pace though our 3-4-5-6 level WR will not have to play against the other teams top 2-3 like they had to last year. this system will force them to swap out and only the elite teams go 4-5 deep with quality corners. they will need to go 7-8 deep if we have any luck moving the ball with all the verticals this offense throws..

I dunno. Seems like a pretty dramatic departure.

- No playbook
- Tempo all the time
- WR's line up really wide
- 4 WR sets
- RB runs between tackles vs sweeps
- QB doesn't run the option, ever

 

[KaiserUEO]

No playbook : lets try and keep your spurs from all jingling & jangling Lash LaRue, you know there is a 'playbook'
- Tempo all the time : boo the hoo. get in shape
- WR's line up really wide : um, OK?? hey, stand and start from here, not there.
- 4 WR sets : welcome to the 90s, our guys should've (gulp) done that in HS
- RB runs between tackles vs sweeps : hey line...BLOCK!!!
- QB doesn't run the option, ever : can we get Mrs Dungey a Hallelujah??!! now make your throws...

of this, im with upperdeck. I don't see how we cant come out smokin...

I was in Lake George last weekend (it rained the whole Fn time...thank you Mother Nature you bitch), but I was able to catch the Spring Game on TWSports, we will be fine on O.

 

[TheCusian]

No playbook : lets try and keep your spurs from all jingling & jangling Lash LaRue, you know there is a 'playbook' - Tempo all the time : boo the hoo. get in shape - WR's line up really wide : um, OK?? hey, stand and start from here, not there. - 4 WR sets : welcome to the 90s, our guys should've (gulp) done that in HS - RB runs between tackles vs sweeps : hey line...BLOCK!!! - QB doesn't run the option, ever : can we get Mrs Dungey a Hallelujah??!! now make your throws... of this, im with upperdeck. I don't see how we cant come out smokin... I was in Lake George last weekend (it rained the whole Fn time...thank you Mother Nature you bitch), but I was able to catch the Spring Game on TWSports, we will be fine on O.

To be clear, I wasn't saying we wouldn't come out and crush them. I think that it is a whole new system - I just think it's designed to be simple enough to be implemented quickly. The spring game was a sign of that progress.

I just don't think you can say "hey Lester and Babers systems are basically the same - should be easy to pick up."

 

[KaiserUEO]

To be clear, I wasn't saying we wouldn't come out and crush them. I think that it is a whole new system - I just think it's designed to be simple enough to be implemented quickly. The spring game was a sign of that progress.

I just don't think you can say "hey Lester and Babers systems are basically the same - should be easy to pick up."

well taken like that, I agree.

but that's not what theyre doing and not what he said.

bottom line, of which I think we agree...they should be ready to go and put up some serious points v a d1aa team on week 1.

 

[TheCusian]

well taken like that, I agree. but that's not what theyre doing and not what he said. bottom line, of which I think we agree...they should be ready to go and put up some serious points v a d1aa team on week 1.

I'd drink to that

 

[FAL]

I'd drink to that

That's what the tailgate is for! Er...uh...um...I mean comraderie and all that...

 

[upperdeck]

its far simpler for a WR to go from a 3-4 wide 1 RB look than a 2 wide 1 TE 2 Rb look . our guys are used to being spread and blocking in space, used to subbing in and out.

the uptick in pace is a huge change and the change it what reads you have to make instead of running a set route will not be a huge as we were already doing some of that, just not full time.

as for the spacing its unclear to me how that changes what the WR has to do other than it by design makes it easier for the WR and QB to see the reads they need to make as the D has to commit pre snap much more often.

the other issue is the oline play is greatly simplified since they run so many less blocking schemes. more reps doing the same thing can only help.

the learning curve is how efficient the plays get run and fast they can get in and out of the plays. by mid year 2 maybe they run all the plays properly and start of year 1 game 1 maybe 30%, thats for the coaches to say.

it may be telling that some players seem to run certain plays because those are the reads they make well.. once a player makes all his reads well the offense can take off. we wont know until probably end of Sept. and who here has the time to really break down the plays from a high level camera to even see what we are doing.

 

[HtownOrange]

its far simpler for a WR to go from a 3-4 wide 1 RB look than a 2 wide 1 TE 2 Rb look . our guys are used to being spread and blocking in space, used to subbing in and out.

the uptick in pace is a huge change and the change it what reads you have to make instead of running a set route will not be a huge as we were already doing some of that, just not full time.

as for the spacing its unclear to me how that changes what the WR has to do other than it by design makes it easier for the WR and QB to see the reads they need to make as the D has to commit pre snap much more often.

the other issue is the oline play is greatly simplified since they run so many less blocking schemes. more reps doing the same thing can only help.

the learning curve is how efficient the plays get run and fast they can get in and out of the plays. by mid year 2 maybe they run all the plays properly and start of year 1 game 1 maybe 30%, thats for the coaches to say.

it may be telling that some players seem to run certain plays because those are the reads they make well.. once a player makes all his reads well the offense can take off. we wont know until probably end of Sept. and who here has the time to really break down the plays from a high level camera to even see what we are doing.

Net result:

With a simplified scheme and increased repetition, week 1 should show some improvement over the spring game. Week 2 should show a little more. As you said, by the end of September, we should recognize the players who are the quick learners. By the end of the year, the team should be around 65-70% efficient within the HCDB system (using HCDB's estimate of 1.5 years before the players really understand the offense fully).

Add to the above: 1) HCDB statement that the Orange will never be that slow again (following the spring game); and, 2) HCDB being pleasantly surprised with the the talent on hand

Which equals the team should show weekly improvement and be in a lot of games, winning the games against slower offenses (BC, Wake, NCState) and being competitive with others (no, I am not claiming victory over FSU and Clemson...yet.) Seriously, there is good reason to be expecting good things for this football team this fall.

 

[blizz]

 

[CuseOnly]

I can see all view points on what could happen against Colgate, however knowing Babers, this team is not preparing for Colgate or for that matter Louisville or any specific team..., they are preparing for the game itself. It's THE GAME that is what the offense will prepare for and the game is the culmination of what you work for. Baber's philosophy is to own the game and you own the game by concentrating mentally on what you are doing. Too many teams work on preparing for the opponent and then get slapped beside the head when the game starts. Scripted starts can get stuffed down your throat and defensively you can experience the unexpected when you are looking too much for the expected. This offense of which Baber's is an experienced master, has a variety of ways to beat you all over the field leading up to long strikes for touchdowns. It messes with coverages, hitting weak spots. It makes the defense run without being able to catch a breath and to get set. Even when you are defensively perfect, one bad step one hesitation and its bye bye.
The coaching staff will work on making the players mentally ready, focused without getting too tight leading up to game being fun. This is what I expect for Colgate game.

It is an interesting system that Babers has in that you take what the defense gives you on each and every play. I would guess that like preparation for any team they look at tendencies but I am not sure that you necessarily have a "game plan" for each and every team you play, at least on offense. Defense would be a little different and a defensive game plan is something that you would have to have, and execute.

 

[jr4750]

Steven Clark, and Chris Slayton are going to make the Colgate Offensive Line, wish they were somewhere else before the end of the game. Our DT's by the end of the year, might be the best group we have had, Anthony Giudice, Kayton Samuels, and Tyler Cross add depth.

 

[CanadianSU]

All out !!!

 

[kcsu]

Our subs will play most of the second half. This wont be close