If Tulsa fires Phil Montgomery

[OburgOrange]

I rather go for Addazio if he is let go. That fixes the OL and Northeast recruiting

And he can be the next HC when Dino leaves

 

[shu 49]

1. Find a tough, young O line coach from a smaller, successful program.
2. Bring back Dave Boll.
3. Make Nick Monroe, along with the new position coach, responsible for recruiting offensive linemen.
4. Get a proven football S+C expert to review our program. We all love Wolverine but something is not right in our O line development.

I disagree about wolverine. He is doing what Dino wants as far as training olineman. Serv in my opinion should have stayed about 290. They train the bigs for endurance cause most bigs don’t have it. Serv seems to be not really explosive at all. U can improve it but u can’t suddlnly make them freeney explosived

 

[All4SU]

And he can be the next HC when Dino leaves

If Edinger and The Dazzler were on the same staff, there would probably be spontaneous combustion.

 

[hoopsupstate]

And he can be the next HC when Dino leaves

Addazio isn’t going anywhere. BC will go bowling again and BC can’t get anyone better.

 

[Chip]

Addazio isn’t going anywhere. BC will go bowling again and BC can’t get anyone better.

Did you look at their remaining schedule?

Not easy to find 2 wins there without a passing game. I don’t think they can rely on getting over 400 yards rushing again in those games.

 

[CanadianSU]

This would be something I could get behind. I don't see how Dino will fire Lynch who has been by his side the entire time. Dino preaches family and all that stuff I just don't see how he fires someone who has been so loyal to him over the years.

This is what led a previous coach here to his demise. I hope the current one realizes this.

 

[longtimefan]

Is this offense working anywhere at this point? It seems like it may have run its course.

Not sure it's the end of the line, but it appears to have been figured out. Time for some serious tweaking?

 

[Keger03]

Is this offense working anywhere at this point? It seems like it may have run its course.

Agreed. the 3-3-5 defense, paring with our Oline, they have found that loop hole to this Offense.

 

[Millhouse]

Is this offense working anywhere at this point? It seems like it may have run its course.

who else is running it beside Tulsa? when a traditional offense fails at tulsa no one notices

 

[Chip]

Agreed. the 3-3-5 defense, paring with our Oline, they have found that loop hole to this Offense.

If you can rush 3 and get to the QB, you've figured out the secret to the best defense ever.

 

[orlandoorange]

who else is running it beside Tulsa? when a traditional offense fails at tulsa no one notices

No idea. Do u still think it's the best offense given our recruiting issues? I'm an idiot when it comes to this so I just curious.

 

[Millhouse]

No idea. Do u still think it's the best offense given our recruiting issues? I'm an idiot when it comes to this so I just curious.

i don't know anything about recruiting either. i'm treating this as a blip but i don't know if i'm right. i don't think any offense can work with this line and i don't see why this offensive system can't bring in lineman

 

[Millhouse]

don't know if this was mentioned but tulsa is the most penalized team in the country. yards and number of flags

 

[GoSU96]

don't know if this was mentioned but tulsa is the most penalized team in the country. yards and number of flags

like I said a lot of the same problems. My personal opinion is Dino is trying to do to much could use a second set of eyes and someone he could delegate the offense day to day and game day to.

Saban hasn’t had a problem bringing in former HC’s as his OC, it’s worked pretty well.

 

[Chip]

like I said a lot of the same problems. My personal opinion is Dino is trying to do to much could use a second set of eyes and someone he could delegate the offense day to day and game day to.

Saban hasn’t had a problem bringing in former HC’s as his OC, it’s worked pretty well.

Montgomery is probably trying to do too much as well.

There's no shame in your ceiling being a coordinator. And when guys realize/accept that, drop back down, get "less off their plate" (finger down throat), they end up re-creating prior success.

It would work. Are there rumblings about him being fired? I know the record the past few years has been pretty bad.

 

[tep624]

i don't know anything about recruiting either. i'm treating this as a blip but i don't know if i'm right. i don't think any offense can work with this line and i don't see why this offensive system can't bring in lineman

The line is a wreck and you are right, it's hard to gauge anything right now on the offensive side of the ball because they can't do anything right, Passing, Running, even blocking on specials.

I think the biggest issue is the lack of HS offensive linemen we are recruiting in general. It leaves you little margin of error if development is an issue or becomes an issue. 2016 was the high watermark with 4 (one medically DQ'ed in Liam O'Sullivan) and since then we've only taken 2 a year with a JUCO or Grad Transfer sprinkled in. This year we needed a higher end Grad transfer badly with the senior talent we lost off the line but there weren't that many available. I think the one kid we really wanted from Northern Illinois went to FSU. But I mean that's pretty telling when even FSU is chasing after MAC grad transfer lineman, it just wasn't a particularly strong grad transfer market for OL. Alexander was the best remaining option but clearly hasn't come along like we expected.

2016
Heckel - Injured
Servais - C Starter
Clark - Not on 2 Deep
O'Sullivan - DQ'ed

2017
D. Davis - RG Starter
P. Davis - RG Backup

2018
Vetorello - LT Starter
White - Not on 2 Deep

2019
Red - Not on 2 Deep
Bergeron - Not on 2 Deep

I mean development for HS'ers, I think 2018 and 2019 follows the standard course. You have one guy in Vetorello playing now, he really should be at RT but due to injuries he's been bounced around. You put him on a veteran cohesive line and I think he does fine. Rest of the guys are redshirting or need another year in White's case.

16/17 is the issue really. 2016 in particular. Heckel's injury has compounded it but Clark not panning out, O'Sullivan getting DQ'ed, those were 2 guys that should be in the Tackle 2 deep right now and are not. To only have 1 guy on the 2 deep right now out of a class of 4 as seniors or RS Jr's is lousy. Then 2017 follows that up with just 2 interior guys. Not a lot of balance at all there.

And again you can sprinkle in some grad transfers to help, and I don't think that's a bad strategy but when you run into a weak grad transfer year for OL and you really need them, you find what we have right now.

 

[Millhouse]

like I said a lot of the same problems. My personal opinion is Dino is trying to do to much could use a second set of eyes and someone he could delegate the offense day to day and game day to.

Saban hasn’t had a problem bringing in former HC’s as his OC, it’s worked pretty well.

i'm not holding tulsa against him, i'd be fine with it. penalties are worrisome but untalented players commit them, i'm not going overboard with it - just nagging at me a little

 

[GoSU96]

Montgomery is probably trying to do too much as well.

There's no shame in your ceiling being a coordinator. And when guys realize/accept that, drop back down, get "less off their plate" (finger down throat), they end up re-creating prior success.

It would work. Are there rumblings about him being fired? I know the record the past few years has been pretty bad.

He's won 5 games the last three years. Very close at Cinci on Saturday, but mucho penalties and TO's did them in. They have a $1.5M problem if they want to let him go, and they have no money.

The book is out on this offense. Tulsa, FSU, and SU's OL's are being dominated and getting a ton of calls against. There's a reason for that beyond pure talent (not that it's not a baseline problem in all three places).

It's back to if you have great talent (OU, Oregon) or a very experienced offense (Wake), there is no great advantage in just going fast (or trying to).

There are very few guys that can handle the HC defacto coordinator dual hatted role.

 

[GoSU96]

i'm not holding tulsa against him, i'd be fine with it. penalties are worrisome but untalented players commit them, i'm not going overboard with it - just nagging at me a little

If there's not credible quick game or run threat, 5 man protections with just average guys are going to be stressed and lose a lot of individual battles.

 

[orlandoorange]

He's won 5 games the last three years. Very close at Cinci on Saturday, but mucho penalties and TO's did them in. They have a $1.5M problem if they want to let him go, and they have no money.

The book is out on this offense. Tulsa, FSU, and SU's OL's are being dominated and getting a ton of calls against. There's a reason for that beyond pure talent (not that it's not a baseline problem in all three places).

It's back to if you have great talent (OU, Oregon) or a very experienced offense (Wake), there is no great advantage in just going fast (or trying to).

There are very few guys that can handle the HC defacto coordinator dual hatted role.

So if the book is out does that mean you cant win schematically? That's my greatest fear given our recruiting difficulties.

Deleone brought success with the freeze option and talent followed. It seems like we need to string a few good years together to before the talent flows.

 

[GoSU96]

So if the book is out does that mean you cant win schematically? That's my greatest fear given our recruiting difficulties.

Deleone brought success with the freeze option and talent followed. It seems like we need to string a few good years together to before the talent flows.

No, you have to adjust and attack where ever the defenses have vacated to take away what you wanted to do to.

Or get an NFL WR1, and have one side of the OL that you can run behind with impunity.

 

[orlandoorange]

No, you have to adjust and attack where ever the defenses have vacated to take away what you wanted to do to.

Or get an NFL WR1, and have one side of the OL that you can run behind with impunity.

So why dont we do that? Not being a smart ass

 

[GoSU96]

So why dont we do that? Not being a smart ass

I think these are fundamental challenges to the approach Dino and the "Baylor" offense takes. It's a deeper schematic thing that isn't going to be fixed in season.

It's not unfair to say that in many ways the offense is fundamentally unsound. The theory is that that is overcome by going fast and getting the other team forced to play a very base defense, tired, and out of position as the pace of play increases, which is great if you are marginally efficient enough to not go three and out four out of ten possessions and avoid constant third and longs.

 

[All4SU]

Average skill players will look above average with a good OL. Average skill players will look below average with a poor OL. (Not rocket science, I know.) Throw more efforts and resources at recruiting above average OL-men. The skill recruits will follow.

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

I think these are fundamental challenges to the approach Dino and the "Baylor" offense takes. It's a deeper schematic thing that isn't going to be fixed in season.

What you said above about the offense being figured out is frightening. I'm concerned that Dino's offense is just a watered down version of what Briles did, and a watered down version of what Leach does. They are very different and are run using different types of players. Ultimately, Dino may just need to pick his poison.