In 2015

[Scooch]

This I agree with 100%.

And I don't think it's just about flashy free-stuff - I think fashion is lost on older people. I used to care what was new and popular - but now I'm going with comfort and class. Basically - there is a big gulf between the fashion of 18 year olds and adults 30+. Not to mention possible cultural differences.

Come on, we're talking about 18 year olds. Uniform "fashion" is being dictated to them by the adults working at Nike and Under Armour, not by Drake.

I like cool, new-age uniforms. I love what Oregon wears. The problem is that our cool, new-age uniforms totally suck. The design sucks, the colors suck, the combos suck... they are hot, steaming piles of garbage.

 

[KaiserUEO]

No. This is wrong and at the core of the uni debate.

It's a shared thing. When a player wears our uni, putting his life/body/hard work (or blood, sweat, tears) on the line he's as much a part of the program as any of us, or the AD, or president, or rich alumni. Is it a privilege? Yes, absolutely. But - can you honestly argue that your money and time spent going to games or on a forum is the same as a four year commitment to live, eat, sleep football? It's an apples to oranges comparison.

If by "our program" you mean "the schools program" then your point is a whole lot more salient.

Finally, no one is arguing that the uni is a big part of the branding - and that it's important to both player and fan. I'm simply saying that it's okay to mortgage some of my say and opinions on uni's if it means the players buy in more, we get better recruits, and we stand out from the crowd (advertising). Watch Shafer's press conference on the new design. He basically says that it's not what he thinks looks good - but if it helps the team, he's all for it.

If I were designing the uni - it wouldn't look like it does now. But that's not the point.

you join the military, the military dresses you.

you join a football program, the football program should dress you.

its my program, theyre cattle.

if the cattle wants a sweatsuit in blue that they can wear on the quad or at home...done.

on the field the cattle should wear ORANGE.

 

[TheCusian]

Come on, we're talking about 18 year olds. Uniform "fashion" is being dictated to them by the adults working at Nike and Under Armour, not by Drake. I like cool, new-age uniforms. I love what Oregon wears. The problem is that our cool, new-age uniforms totally suck. The design sucks, the colors suck, the combos suck... they are hot, steaming piles of garbage.

And you're 18?

(kids love Nike and Under Armour - they are huge companies for a reason and it's not selling geriatric sweat pants to old guys.)

 

[TheCusian]

you join the military, the military dresses you. you join a football program, the football program should dress you. its my program, theyre cattle. if the cattle wants a sweatsuit in blue that they can wear on the quad or at home...done. on the field the cattle should wear ORANGE.

It's not hard to imagine you as a greasy cowboy with two teeth, riding some skinny over worked horse off into the sunset talking about things in the "olden days"...

Back in reality, I'm really thankful our program has more respect for our kids than you seem to have.

 

[KaiserUEO]

It's not hard to imagine you as a greasy cowboy with two teeth, riding some skinny over worked horse off into the sunset talking about things in the "olden days"...

Back in reality, I'm really thankful our program has more respect for our kids than you seem to have.

too bad the kids have no respect for the history of the program.

and too bad you think so little of them that a nice shiny balloon, lollypop or jersey makes 1oz of a difference as to whether they come here or not.

 

[Millhouse]

too bad the kids have no respect for the history of the program.

and too bad you think so little of them that a nice shiny balloon, lollypop or jersey makes 1oz of a difference as to whether they come here or not.

do people think Alabama is making a mistake with their uniforms? that they're just so good that they can indulge their fans with silly tradition?

not recognizing uniforms is what MACtion is all about

 

[OrangeXtreme]

you join the military, the military dresses you.

you join a football program, the football program should dress you.

You know who has a really sharp uniform ... the Marine Corps.

Odd that they haven't changed it for 239 years. And they don't have a problem getting recruits.

 

[storange]

There will likely be a Ben Schwartzwalder statue outside the IPF.

There will be more orange in the football uniform.

The staff will be expected to win.

good, good and good

 

[TheCusian]

too bad the kids have no respect for the history of the program. and too bad you think so little of them that a nice shiny balloon, lollypop or jersey makes 1oz of a difference as to whether they come here or not.

They have no respect for the history of the program because they like their helmets shiny?

That's rich. It's also completely at odds with how they talk about the past and the history of the program.

I don't need to "think so little" - we have you know actual quotes. I asked my wife who works with college athletes everyday if she thought uni's play any part in a kids choice in schools and she said "of course."

And you're the one who called them cattle. A really horrid thing to say about another human being. 18 or otherwise.

 

[Scooch]

And you're 18?

(kids love Nike and Under Armour - they are huge companies for a reason and it's not selling geriatric sweat pants to old guys.)

Do you really think that, say, the 16-24 demographic is where Nike and UA get the majority of their revenue from?

Hint: the answer is no.

But that's not the point.

The point is that our current uniforms blow. I say that as someone who likes cool new uniform designs. I'm not pining for us to return to the 80s SU unis. If Nike came up with something like this I'd be doing cartwheels in excitment:

But they didn't, they gave us this garbage:

 

[rrlbees]

I agree completely. Frankly, it's not their program - it's our program. We invite them to have the privilege of playing for our program. The players come and go, but the program and the brand remains - and the uniform is the essence of the brand.

I agree. It's SUs program and brand. Right now SU is struggling with what their brand is. We used to have one. Uniforms are one of the easiest and cheapest says to display your brand. I doubt SU asks the players year by year what unis they want.

 

[TheCusian]

Do you really think that, say, the 16-24 demographic is where Nike and UA get the majority of their revenue from? Hint: the answer is no. But that's not the point. The point is that our current uniforms blow. I say that as someone who likes cool new uniform designs. I'm not pining for us to return to the 80s SU unis. If Nike came up with something like this I'd be doing cartwheels in excitment: But they didn't, they gave us this garbage:

You'll notice that I haven't been defending the current uni's. I've been defending the players right to have a say in what they wear.

I think Nike's rise to prominence has been built on its popularity with that age demographic.

 

[Chip]

I wish we had data on any recruits we've lost out on because of our uniforms. No one talks about that possibility. You're the Syracuse Orange yet you dress like some kind of Civil War reject. Plus no one will know who I am because the numbers are some made up stupid bottom heavy font. I might as well be number threve.

 

[Moontan]

If the Orange are still alive ...

If teflon roofs can survive...

 

[Scooch]

You'll notice that I haven't been defending the current uni's. I've been defending the players right to have a say in what they wear.

I think Nike's rise to prominence has been built on its popularity with that age demographic.

I'm not really interested in arguing about that "right".

Kids mostly just like things that are different. That's why they spend far more time listening to whatever music acts are current than to 70s rock.

BUT, the vast majority of SU's fanbase is older than 21. Wearing uniforms that aren't abhorrent to that demographic, which is pretty damn broad and diverse, seems like a decent idea.

Hell, how much input have our players had in our hoops unis? As far as I know, none. And yet we seem to be recruiting pretty well on that front, right? And those are pretty modern? Imean, I like 'em. Why is football so different?

 

[Chip]

But they didn't, they gave us this garbage:

That was the worst combo ever, by far. Even you picking the one single highlight from that entire game doesn't help.

 

[TheCusian]

I wish we had data on any recruits we've lost out on because of our uniforms. No one talks about that possibility. You're the Syracuse Orange yet you dress like some kind of Civil War reject. Plus no one will know who I am because the numbers are some made up stupid bottom heavy font. I might as well be number threve.

I don't think it's a deciding factor in either direction - just that it plays into a decision. Like one of 30 variables or something.

Apparently that opinion is radical and demeaning to 18 year olds who prefer to be called cattle. Also: military!

 

[OrangePA]

They have no respect for the history of the program because they like their helmets shiny?

That's rich. It's also completely at odds with how they talk about the past and the history of the program.

I don't need to "think so little" - we have you know actual quotes. I asked my wife who works with college athletes everyday if she thought uni's play any part in a kids choice in schools and she said "of course."

And you're the one who called them cattle. A really horrid thing to say about another human being. 18 or otherwise.

Just curious.

What does your wife do?

You know how I feel about the issue.

First, I don't care how the players feel - they come and go.

The Program - its history and its branding - is more important than how an 18 year old kid with no previous connection to the program wants the uniforms to be designed.

And, second, Alabama, Auburn, Texas, Penn State and USC have retained the their traditional uniforms and have had no problems recruiting.

In fact, Penn State - the antithesis of the funky uniform look - is having the best recruiting year it's had in many years.

So, I buy the notion that uniforms impact recruiting and again don't really care what a kid who has no connection to SU feels about the traditional uniform.

 

[TheCusian]

I'm not really interested in arguing about that "right". Kids mostly just like things that are different. That's why they spend far more time listening to whatever music acts are current than to 70s rock. BUT, the vast majority of SU's fanbase is older than 21. Wearing uniforms that aren't abhorrent to that demographic, which is pretty damn broad and diverse, seems like a decent idea. Hell, how much input have our players had in our hoops unis? As far as I know, none. And yet we seem to be recruiting pretty well on that front, right? And those are pretty modern? Imean, I like 'em. Why is football so different?

Are we so good that we can afford any edge in recruiting?! If bring back the pink and green if it meant a top ten recruiting class.

Also - I don't know that they forced all fans of the team to wear the uni's in the stands upon entry to the dome. So many people arguing about what other people should wear. Makes my head hurt.

 

[O-pulse]

Stop shouting!!!

you must be kidding, right?

 

[TheCusian]

Just curious. What does your wife do? You know how I feel about the issue. First, I don't care how the players feel - they come and go. The Program - its history and its branding - is more important than how an 18 kid with no previous connection with the program wants the uniforms to be designed. And, second, Alabama, Auburn, Texas, Penn State and USC have retained the their traditional uniforms and have had no problems recruiting. In fact, Penn State - the antithesis of the funky uniform look - is having the best recruiting year it's had in many years. So, I don't care and I don't buy the notion that uniforms impact recruiting.

She works at SUNY Cortland as an advisor.

I think they went too far with the uni - I wish we'd found a happy medium between the two extreme sides (McNabb era vs Tron).

I don't care to argue about how we are or are not those programs. Some change is good (I like the "S" on the helmets) but don't care for the numerals on the jerseys of the current iteration.

People are taking everything to the extreme. I'm just saying that it's likely that kids like the uni's, that it plays a part however small in the decision, and that I don't mind giving some choice to the kids who actually have to wear them.

I also can't believe I'm the only one who finds Kaiser's comments beyond the pale. Whatever.

 

[SWC75]

Do you really think that, say, the 16-24 demographic is where Nike and UA get the majority of their revenue from?

Hint: the answer is no.

But that's not the point.

The point is that our current uniforms blow. I say that as someone who likes cool new uniform designs. I'm not pining for us to return to the 80s SU unis. If Nike came up with something like this I'd be doing cartwheels in excitment:

But they didn't, they gave us this garbage:

Notice how the white Oregon State Uniform looks so much like ours. I saw 12-15 teams wearing that design this year. It's not our uniform. It's Nike's. Their brand is what's being advertised.

 

[tipphill]

I think I saw something on twitter from maybe Syracuse.com about some of those items. They were interviewing Dr. Gross. I know he addressed the orange in the uni's and let me tell you I couldn't be happier. Now we can have threads about how ugly the uni's are and how we need to go back to McNabb era one's

rather go back to the early 60's home unis were white jerseys orange pants

 

[FAL]

you must be kidding, right?

NO I'M NOT!

 

[OrangePA]

No. This is wrong and at the core of the uni debate.

It's a shared thing. When a player wears our uni, putting his life/body/hard work (or blood, sweat, tears) on the line he's as much a part of the program as any of us, or the AD, or president, or rich alumni. Is it a privilege? Yes, absolutely. But - can you honestly argue that your money and time spent going to games or on a forum is the same as a four year commitment to live, eat, sleep football? It's an apples to oranges comparison.

If by "our program" you mean "the schools program" then your point is a whole lot more salient.

Finally, no one is arguing that the uni is a big part of the branding - and that it's important to both player and fan. I'm simply saying that it's okay to mortgage some of my say and opinions on uni's if it means the players buy in more, we get better recruits, and we stand out from the crowd (advertising). Watch Shafer's press conference on the new design. He basically says that it's not what he thinks looks good - but if it helps the team, he's all for it.

If I were designing the uni - it wouldn't look like it does now. But that's not the point.

Just don't agree.

No player or prospective player tells Alabama or Texas or USC what uniforms those teams should wear. And nobody at those schools care what some player might think.

I don't know about you, but I do feel that it is my Program. My family and I have invested in the Program financially and emotionally for decades.

And I frankly don't care what some snot nosed kid from Florida thinks about the uniforms. I just don't. If he doesn't want to play in our uniforms then go to Rutgers or Wake Forest for all I care.

This year we saw the results of what the players think. And it was an indecipherable mess. The uniforms were ugly - they didn't identify Syracuse University and they certainly didn't prompt the players to play better. Are you suggesting that had the players wore the traditional uniform we would lost the three games we won? Of course not.

The uniforms are for the fans and benefactors of the Program. The players should feel honored to wear our uniform as far as I'm concerned.

And as far as Scott Shafer's press conference is concerned, it seemed to me that he gritted his teeth and took the company line. He seemed basically acknowledged that the issue was out of his control - that he would prefer the traditional uniforms.

And I understand that. What's he going to say in that situation?

So, I understand your points.

But I just disagree.