Is it allowed as a Syracuse fan to say JB is awesome but our offensive system sucks?

[cuseinseattle]

Is that okay? Are we as fans allowed to respect JB and believe his lack of changing the offense is a problem?
After these last March runs this decade it’s undisputed his D works.
I don’t even bother questioning it.
His D will be fine.
Somebody on the staff needs to be given this task of developing a system on offense that is all ISO heavy.
We don’t recruit the 1 and done athletes that have the NBA skills to rely on ISO ball to be effective.
Are we allowed to respect JB but believe this?

Paging sobecuse. Come on down

 

[Sherman20]

Is that okay? Are we as fans allowed to respect JB and believe his lack of changing the offense is a problem?
After these last March runs this decade it’s undisputed his D works.
I don’t even bother questioning it.
His D will be fine.
Somebody on the staff needs to be given this task of developing a system on offense that is all ISO heavy.
We don’t recruit the 1 and done athletes that have the NBA skills to rely on ISO ball to be effective.
Are we allowed to respect JB but believe this?

I have suggested that you call his radio show. none of us here can do anything about what you want. We have heard you.

Old coaches who are set in their ways can change as they age. Beilein is a great example. He’s of course one of the best offensive system minds in the game. But he admitted last year that he didn’t spend as much time thinking about defense or even making it as much of a focus in practice as his offense. Last season, he hired a new assistant coach (can’t remember the name), who took over the teaching and implementation of their man to man defense. The result? Michigan’s best defense ever under Beilein. And they look even better this season. Even Beilein admitted all of this and credited his new assistant with changing his thinking. JB is way more stubborn than Beilein, but you never know. Hop tried to convince him to run more and press more. And JB has changed things up on offense in the past, after coaching the Olympians for the first time in 2008 and working with NBA guys.

 

[cuseinseattle]

The biggest downside of losses like this is the back and forth I subject myself to with francopizza, captainj and zepharus.

 

[cuseinseattle]

How often do you see a box and one in college hoop? This isn't high school. I also would like to see a mix of defense. Man and zone and a press works for me. but we won't have that for at least 3 more years.

While we are it we should run a triangle and 2.

 

[cuseinseattle]

No offense to Alsacs and others but some of you only watch high profile games. Brissett missed about 6 layups tonight. Is that JB’s fault. He was awful.

I’m convinced certain people record the games and only go back and watch the loses

 

[SoBeCuse]

No doubt the same 'ol same 'ol stagnant style of ISO O is problematic. However, UConn put 83 up on us tonight, I don't know how many games we have won the last 10-15 years when a team scores that much.

I think the offense contributes to it. Bad shots lead to leak outs and times to attack before the defense is set. Defense seemed okay at times. They had 20 turnovers! The offense was horrific. Literally all ISO. It’s like Boeheim said don’t pass. Even if he had Golden St. type players it would be hard to fathom players playing this loosely, recklessly, or selfishly, IMO. I mean the number of bad shots seemingly allowed to take is mind blowing. Does he really think these guys are this talented to play this way? This was the worst offense in the P5 last year.

 

[CaptainJ]

we have a team full of slashers, we badly need a post up presence.

This team needs Akok.

 

[SoBeCuse]

This team needs Akok.

He wants to camp out and shoot threes all day. We need ISO players as long as Boeheim is still coaching. Guys with thr most playground/streetball abilities.

 

[CaptainJ]

It is clearly JB’s fault that Yukon was hitting 3’s from 5’ behind the NBA line like layups, while our players shot layups like they were half court shots.

Bad coaching.
He should feel bad.

/end sarcasm.

Could it be a mix of missed shots AND some coaching mistakes as well?

I get that the nature of reality is supposedly binary, but that doesnt mean it has to be on here, does it? Cant it be some of each?

 

[CaptainJ]

The biggest downside of losses like this is the back and forth I subject myself to with francopizza, captainj and zepharus.

I take comfort in knowing that I am a disappointment to someone other than my family. Thanks to you, I can now forgive them. As for the other 2 fellas you mentioned, I will have to pay closer attention to their posts. Thanks for pointing out the all stars.

 

[CaptainJ]

He wants to camp out and shoot threes all day. We need ISO players as long as Boeheim is still coaching. Guys with thr most playground/streetball abilities.

I mostly agree with you, but dont you feel there is a chance that Boheim could mold him a bit more into what could work for us? The only reason I ask is because we arent like Duke or Kentucky who take the best of the best, and then round out their #13 spot with someone who would have started for us, right? (ok, and I am a long admitted fan of names, and could probably write a decent set of lyrics for the kid...and want to see what OttoInGrotto would oficially dub him as, being he is the official arbiter of nicknames).

That does bring another interesting(to me) question to mind. Does everyone on the team need to be a street baller on offense to be successful under current JB's style? Can we have 1 or even 2 guys on the court at a time who aren't, yet are still useful?

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

Being a Boston sports fan...and a Syracuse sports fan...is such a remarkable study in contrasts.

Far too many Boston sports fans cannot wait to rip their coaches. No matter how good they have been, they are only 1 bad game from being complete bums. Its obnoxious and ridiculous and allows for no real objective analysis that is not sky is falling hysteria. I hate it.

Far too many Syracuse sports fans refuse to criticize their coaches. No matter how bad a loss is, there is no ability to step back and say, "he's great but didnt have his best coaching game." Its obnoxious and ridiculous and allows for no real objective analysis that is not "He's HOF so shut up". I hate it.

 

[HakAttack]

Being a Boston sports fan...and a Syracuse sports fan...is such a remarkable study in contrasts.

Far too many Boston sports fans cannot wait to rip their coaches. No matter how good they have been, they are only 1 bad game from being complete bums. Its obnoxious and ridiculous and allows for no real objective analysis that is not sky is falling hysteria. I hate it.

Far too many Syracuse sports fans refuse to criticize their coaches. No matter how bad a loss is, there is no ability to step back and say, "he's great but didnt have his best coaching game." Its obnoxious and ridiculous and allows for no real objective analysis that is not "He's HOF so shut up". I hate it.

Best post I’ve read in a long time. Well done.

 

[Alsacs]

Being a Boston sports fan...and a Syracuse sports fan...is such a remarkable study in contrasts.

Far too many Boston sports fans cannot wait to rip their coaches. No matter how good they have been, they are only 1 bad game from being complete bums. Its obnoxious and ridiculous and allows for no real objective analysis that is not sky is falling hysteria. I hate it.

Far too many Syracuse sports fans refuse to criticize their coaches. No matter how bad a loss is, there is no ability to step back and say, "he's great but didnt have his best coaching game." Its obnoxious and ridiculous and allows for no real objective analysis that is not "He's HOF so shut up". I hate it.

I will say I wish we Boston sports media/fans were like Syracuse fans after Belichick refused to play Malcolm Butler in this last SB.
Our media lost its minds and did everything they could try and argue it was a firable offense.
If it was Syracuse fans I can’t imagine.
JB isn’t Belichick either.

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

I will say I wish we Boston sports media/fans were like Syracuse fans after Belichick refused to play Malcolm Butler in this last SB.
Our media lost its minds and did everything they could try and argue it was a firable offense.
If it was Syracuse fans I can’t imagine.
JB isn’t Belichick either.

(Many) Boston fans, and (Most) Boston media, are obnoxious. Boston sports radio is the lowest common denominator.
But I think its equally as obnoxious to use the same, "he's HOF and you are not so he must be right" to shut down ANY criticism. I wish I could take both fan mentalities, put them in a blender, and level them both out

 

[Alsacs]

Boston fans, and Boston media, are obnoxious. Boston sports radio is the lowest common denominator.
But I think its equally as obnoxious to use the same, "he's HOF and you are not so he must be right" to shut down ANY criticism. I wish I could take both fan mentalities, put them in a blender, and level them both out

What ticks me off. My criticism isn’t any the coach doesn’t disagree with but these fans who say he is HOF are basically saying shut up you say the same thing time after time.
Newsflash if the problem hasn’t changed what the hell should be said? It’s all good? No! This is the first time it’s been said this year as well.
How can people not watch Syracuse basketball play in the halfcourt since 2012 and realize it is a bad system and if the solution is get better talent then ugh.

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

What ticks me off. My criticism isn’t any the coach doesn’t disagree with but these fans who say he is HOF are basically saying shut up you say the same thing time after time.
Newsflash if the problem hasn’t changed what the hell should be said? It’s all good? No! This is the first time it’s been said this year as well.
How can people not watch Syracuse basketball play in the halfcourt since 2012 and realize it is a bad system and if the solution is get better talent then ugh.

I'm not even going there. Im not saying change the system. I'm saying have a couple speciality plays, a couple wrinkles, you can drop in to change things up. I coach youth ball and I have a couple different defensive sets I run when my team is getting gashed inside, a couple I run when the team is lighting it up outside, a press play or two, etc. Im not an expert but in a game that I am clearly on the short end of, I will change things up and step out of my base D run one or two of these a game to see if they work. Sometimes they do, and we run more, sometimes they dont and the results are exactly the same as the defense I had been running previously. Equally bad. No worse. Shots dont count for 4 points if I run a differnt D. Its a no brainer risk worth taking for a possession or two.

But i digress. And yes, I know this isnt youth ball. Im talking about a thought process. Yes, I know JB is a great coach and I am not. And yes I will now go flagellate myself for the heretic commentary above.

 

[Chip]

We are a zone team. He shouldn't change. He is a HOF coach and that's his system. But damn. Draw up a couple plays here and there for situational purposes. Its obscene to keep giving teams looks that are shooting 60%. Dare them in the first half. When you are down 10 with 5 to go, it's time to play aggressive D.

If the other team is chucking up 25 footers, then JB is happy. If they’re hitting them, he’s going to tip his cap.

We weren’t going undefeated. We’re playing without our starting point guard. We played a team who considered last night their biggest game of the year. We didn’t match their intensity and we just didn’t have a good night shooting the ball.

I’m not worried and really didn’t spend much time analyzing it.

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

If the other team is chucking up 25 footers, then JB is happy. If they’re hitting them, he’s going to tip his cap.

We weren’t going undefeated. We’re playing without our starting point guard. We played a team who considered last night their biggest game of the year. We didn’t match their intensity and we just didn’t have a good night shooting the ball.

I’m not worried and really didn’t spend much time analyzing it.

I've never been a fan of "have this and if you do it you win". I'm more a fan of "this is what we are going to give you because its harder. if you do it successfully, we will adjust"

 

[Chip]

I've never been a fan of "have this and if you do it you win". I'm more a fan of "this is what we are going to give you because its harder. if you do it successfully, we will adjust"

Well, sure, but it's not like Frank is a question mark for the season. We went into the year with the expectation that he'd be ready for the regular season. Now we're playing it safe (so it seems) and it's going to be 2 weeks delayed.

It doesn't make everything ok. As Go said, Battle and Brissett need to be a lot better than they were last night, and I think they will be. When we were down 70-66 with the ball and Battle immediately stops and short rims the 3 instead of going to the basket, sure, I was screaming a bit in my inside voice. Felt like I'd seen that movie way too many times.

But I also just don't think it's worth too much stress over. I'm hopeful we'll look a lot better today against a good Oregon team.

 

[Alsacs]

Well, sure, but it's not like Frank is a question mark for the season. We went into the year with the expectation that he'd be ready for the regular season. Now we're playing it safe (so it seems) and it's going to be 2 weeks delayed.

It doesn't make everything ok. As Go said, Battle and Brissett need to be a lot better than they were last night, and I think they will be. When we were down 70-66 with the ball and Battle immediately stops and short rims the 3 instead of going to the basket, sure, I was screaming a bit in my inside voice. Felt like I'd seen that movie way too many times.

But I also just don't think it's worth too much stress over. I'm hopeful we'll look a lot better today against a good Oregon team.

Even with Frank our half court offense isn’t going to be much better.
If the solution is our players play better that isn’t really reassuring.
Of course they need to play well. It doesn’t mean our halfcourt offense is good.

 

[Zepharus]

The biggest downside of losses like this is the back and forth I subject myself to with francopizza, captainj and zepharus.

Woah hey. I get it, as afan I can be prone to "H0T Takes" but I care and honestly im a realist. I call em how a see and feel. That was pathetic last night and motivation is on the leader..

 

[cuseguy]

When you give up 83 points, it’s not just the offense. UConn scouted us very well. Guards drive and dish to open wings for 3. Pretty simple if you make the shots. This is a better shooting UConn team.

Live by the zone, die by the zone.

Defensively, UConn played tight man to man. We didn’t have many open shots and the few we had, we missed. Still looks a lot like last year’s team that struggled to make the tourney.

 

[Chip]

Even with Frank our half court offense isn’t going to be much better.
If the solution is our players play better that isn’t really reassuring.
Of course they need to play well. It doesn’t mean our halfcourt offense is good.

I don't disagree. We play a lot of hero offense (here's the ball, go be a hero). But not 100% of the time. The question is with Frank back, are there enough extra buckets to give us 8 more points? I'd say probably, but I can't really prove it.

Even with our offensive identity being as it is, we had way too many open looks last night that didn't go in the basket.

 

[Alsacs]

When you give up 83 points, it’s not just the offense. UConn scouted us very well. Guards drive and dish to open wings for 3. Pretty simple if you make the shots. This is a better shooting UConn team.

Live by the zone, die by the zone.

Defensively, UConn played tight man to man. We didn’t have many open shots and the few we had, we missed. Still looks a lot like last year’s team that struggled to make the tourney.

We shot 26 for 66 (39.4%)
We shot 6 for 22 (27.3%) from 3 point range.
The Offense was the bigger problem.
You can’t expect to win a game shooting those percentages.