It's Time to Pull the Plug on Babers

[Shrmdougluvr]

Did anyone else not read a single post and jump to the bottom to say how stupid this is? Just checking.

the hot take thread is on the OT board.

You've been more diplomatic than most, but I don't think the OP is crazy.
Getting curb-stomped by Maryland, FSU, BC, and Louisville, and looking hapless against a terrible NC State team (coming off of a bye), is really poor. Sprinkle in the o-line mess, his chosen QB's mental errors, other teams offenses having program record days, "no film," and brand new coaches running a spread, hurry-up offense more effective than us, and it's truly cause for concern. I mean, how much better does the team look this year than in year 1? Team is a mess, and that's despite our schedule is easy.

I am not in the fire Dino camp. But i dont begrudge those who are and voice their opinion on the matter.

 

[CuseOnly]

Did anyone else not read a single post and jump to the bottom to say how stupid this is? Just checking.

the hot take thread is on the OT board.

Our 4 year coach just got trounced by a first year coach. And basically admitted to being out talented on the field. "Our guys can't run with those guys" - Why don't we have those types of kids after 4 years of recruiting with Babers?

I also heard that their "offense is hard to defend based on the scheme" - Why don't we run an offense that is hard to defend like theirs?

Well, exactly who can we run with? I used to consider Maryland and Louisville peer type schools and to hear that was pretty disheartening to say the least. Sad thing is that we have had a talent upgrade since Shafer and we still are light years away it seems from being more than occasionally competitive every 4th or 5th year.

It all eventually rolls up to investment in the program. We don't have and more than likely will never have the bells and whistles that attract the top notch athletes.

Sad and disheartening.

 

[tipphill]

Gentlemen,

Faith is belief without evidence...but we cannot believe if we had one fluke season out of four in Babers tenure here. Wildhack and the Athletic Department better get moving...and moving fast. Babers is in over his head. Look at the stats...

Our Record
2016...4-8
2017...4-8
2018...10-3; and I honestly do not give him much credit that year led by a senior quarterback in Eric Dungey, 5th year senior wideout in Custis, veteran offensive line and most importantly a weak strength of schedule. Louisville was down last year...Florida State was down last year...UNC was very bad that year, but are much better this year as they may make a bowl this year. That record was a paper tiger.
2019...soon to be 4-8 after an increase in season tickets.

Overall record...22-27 with a fluke 10-3 season in there. Guys the ACC is not a gauntlet...Take out the outlier and its an average record of 4-8. This is Shafer-esque. Our defense is getting shredded and our offense has been figured out.

Player Morale
Dino has lost this team...Harris with his outbursts which are visible on the field...players laughing and joking around on the sideline after getting their butts kicked in. DIno does not even look engaged on the sideline. I saw the same loss of emotion with Marrone the year before he left. It is a sense of giving up or he doesn't know how to fix the issue.

Recruiting
We are recruiting worse and worse every year. We are at the bottom of the ACC in recruiting even after a 10 win season. We already fired our D-coordinator. Face it---Dino's defense is pathetic with the talent that is back there. The offense is not the new fast as we have got out-gained throughout the year.


My passion is still there, but tonight and this season was an eye-opener. Disucss.

i am not in the fire dino camp at all. i do question his supervision of the coaches . most everything has been pathetic. play calling, leadership, discipline and recruiting.
i am not sure why this there has been a dramatic decline this year other than coaching,lack of discipl;ne. and leadership.
what is very disconcerting to me is dino appears to be very stubborn.
i hope he is looking hard at the transfer portal as well as cc players.
i would very much like to know what he really thinks why this season was so bad.
feel bad for devito. he needs a different kind of system to survive. he does not appear to have the leadership skills as well. he is talented etc etc etc.
i question harris as well. why does he play???
i will be at the wake forest game

 

[tipphill]

I'm still very Pro-Dino, but I don't disagree with this. He has really difficult decisions to deal with in about 10 days time.

i agree but he had season full of time to make decisions and not just about personnel. it will be interesting to see what he does now. most everything was a disaster---not just one person. it starts with him and how he manages.

 

[tipphill]

The issue with this team is we aren’t stacked with a deep roster.
Our OL was awful for 9 games.
The coaching staff should have made changes earlier that is on Dino.
DeVito is young and honestly made a lot of mistakes that shouldn’t happen.
The holding onto the ball, the terrible picks the offense has been poor.
The DL has been underachieving.

Blame Dino for bad coaching decisions. If he had a roster with better talent he wouldn’t be the issue.

all true. why has our recruiting been so bad????

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Dino is also under contract for a number of years as well. Funny just 4 months ago people were in a panic about keeping him. Have to stop hiring and firing and hang in there with Dino. I don’t think any assistant should be safe at this point.

recruiting at Syracuse is what it is. Don’t really care who you hire it’s a very difficult place to recruit. have to develop talent and I think as a head guy you wont find many better than Dino with regard to recruiting.

i don’t think you could hire a better coach than Dino anyway. i believe he’s under contract for 4 more years and we are going to have to ride or die with him for at least 2 more years at a minimum. We aren’t FSU thank god

i also believe that if Dino can’t win here consistently we are in serious trouble. It’s a tough place to win. Syracuse is not a great destination for a lot of athletes or coaches.

 

[cusefan88]

Easily the stupidest thread all year. The program is fine. Dino has to make changes this offseason and he will.

 

[Eric15]

Firing Dino this year would be a mistake. It would be too much of a knee jerk reaction one year removed from a 10 win season.

Next year our non-conference schedule is almost embarrassingly easy. If next year is more of the same (losing record, heavily penalized, defense ranked in the 100s, visible lack of discipline, bizarre clock management and game management, etc.) you can officially remove “knee-jerk” from the equation.

 

[kcsu]

Dino is also under contract for a number of years as well. Funny just 4 months ago people were in a panic about keeping him. Have to stop hiring and firing and hang in there with Dino. I don’t think any assistant should be safe at this point.

recruiting at Syracuse is what it is. Don’t really care who you hire it’s a very difficult place to recruit. have to develop talent and I think as a head guy you wont find many better than Dino with regard to recruiting.

i don’t think you could hire a better coach than Dino anyway. i believe he’s under contract for 4 more years and we are going to have to ride or die with him for at least 2 more years at a minimum

i also believe that if Dino can’t win here consistently we are in serious trouble. It’s a tough place to win. Syracuse is not a great destination for a lot of people pr coaches.

I dont buy that we are such a tough place to win. SU might not be able to hang with the elite schools but we can certainly be competitive. Getting embarrassed by Maryland, BC, Ville... Is 100% being out coached. It has nothing to do with a lack of talent.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I dont buy that we are such a tough place to win. SU might not be able to hang with the elite schools but we can certainly be competitive. Getting embarrassed by Maryland, BC, Ville... Is 100% being out coached. It has nothing to do with a lack of talent.

OK. I think the past 20 years tell a different story. Go hire another coach and see where that gets you. Wash, rinse, repeat. Syracuse is not a desirable destination for most athletes or coaches. Plain and simple. It’s a very difficult place to win. Extremely difficult for many reasons.

too many fans living in the past here. Mid 80’s through late nineties.

 

[cuseguy]

OK. I think the past 20 years tell a different story. Go hire another coach and see where that gets you. Wash, rinse, repeat. Syracuse is not a desirable destination for most athletes or coaches. Plain and simple. It’s a very difficult place to win. Extremely difficult for many reasons.

too many fans living in the past here. Mid 80’s through late nineties.

But it was a desirable place to attend college at that time? Was the weather nicer then?

 

[Trueblue25]

I have lived in a lot of places, but to be honest I have not had anything that has come close to a Tully’s Tender. A plate of Tully’s tenders and honey mustard? Just perfect.

Dont tempt me withh a fun time

 

[kcsu]

OK. I think the past 20 years tell a different story. Go hire another coach and see where that gets you. Wash, rinse, repeat. Syracuse is not a desirable destination for most athletes or coaches. Plain and simple. It’s a very difficult place to win. Extremely difficult for many reasons.

too many fans living in the past here. Mid 80’s through late nineties.

I disagree. It might be a difficult place to win an ACC title but it certainly isnt a difficult place to win 6-8 games a year. This years failure is on the coaches. Vet should have been moved to center after the first bye week. Possibly sooner. Ward completely screwed up one of the most talented D rosters we have had in years.
Dino needs to surround himself with guys who can coach. SU is never going to win on talent alone. We will however win more than not if we have exceptional coaches. It is obvious to me that our talent isnt the issue. Its our coaches. Other than possibly 3 coaches we are mediocre at best. OL LB WR DB QB coaching is worse than the talent they have to coach.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I disagree. It might be a difficult place to win an ACC title but it certainly isnt a difficult place to win 6-8 games a year. This years failure is on the coaches. Vet should have been moved to center after the first bye week. Possibly sooner. Ward completely screwed up one of the most talented D rosters we have had in years.
Dino needs to surround himself with guys who can coach. SU is never going to win on talent alone. We will however win more than not if we have exceptional coaches. It is obvious to me that our talent isnt the issue. Its our coaches. Other than possibly 3 coaches we are mediocre at best. OL LB WR DB QB coaching is worse than the talent they have to coach.

good luck getting those great/ exceptional coaches to come to Syracuse. Like I said the body of work over the past 20 years proves my point. We have won 6 games maybe 6-7 times in the last 20 years? It’s not easy and its taken my awhile to really believe it but I’m not sure Syracuse could even hire a better coach than Dino Babers at this point if they had too.

 

[CousCuse]

I feel like a big part of the reason that Dino hasn't gotten a great recruiting class is because the expectation was that he was using this job as a stepping stone and wouldn't be here to coach those recruits. He needs more time, at least 2 or 3 seasons. He should professionalize his assistants though.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I feel like a big part of the reason that Dino hasn't gotten a great recruiting class is because the expectation was that he was using this job as a stepping stone and wouldn't be here to coach those recruits. He needs more time, at least 2 or 3 seasons. He should professionalize his assistants though.

probably some truth here

 

[CuseOnly]

I don't want Dino fired at all, but I still think the University doesn't support athletics the way they should be. HE needs way more support, more staff, better athlete housing and a new football facility.

 

[Alsacs]

I don't want Dino fired at all, but I still think the University doesn't support athletics the way they should be. HE needs way more support, more staff, better athlete housing and a new football facility.

Dino is being given all the support from this AD.
He is the best guy for the job but the facilities he has versus what Marrone had only a decade ago are miles better.
The AD is giving him a charter service to recruit, more funding, more staff.
The facilities are better.
This isn’t 2004 when it took getting a donation from McNabb to build a freaking weight room.

Dino needs to clean up his statf. Train these kids disciplined football. He can do it.

 

[kcsu]

good luck getting those great/ exceptional coaches to come to Syracuse. Like I said the body of work over the past 20 years proves my point. We have won 6 games maybe 6-7 times in the last 20 years? It’s not easy and its taken my awhile to really believe it but I’m not sure Syracuse could even hire a better coach than Dino Babers at this point if they had too.

Dont get me wrong i hope Dino is here for the next 10 years. I think he is perfect for SU. I simply hope that he upgrades his staff. Coaches are like teachers, like business managers, like doctor's, lawyers, mechanics, electricians...
There are bad, good, better, best at everything. We have all experienced the range of ineptitude and excellence. We have all at some point in our lives been exceptional or inept at something.
I played three sports in HS. Football/QB DB. Basketball Guard mostly 2, Baseball pitcher and 3rd. I also played Hockey. Left wing but chose basketball after 7th ggrade.At this point in life i ski, raft, and climb and still play rec bball. I have started, worked for and ran companies and its my personal believe that based on my life experiences that great management regardless of what is being attempted is the difference between winning and losing.
The Allies didnt win the war because of better athletes or facilities. We won because we had better coaching and game/battlefield management.
Dont get me wrong your not going to flush many pheasants with a poodle but this years SU team has more than enough talent to perform significantly better than it has.
Dino is fine. His assistant coaches are weak. SU is well positioned from a resource standpoint to succeed. We have an excellent administration. They have been extremely supportive. No more excuses. Hire some talented managers and the next thing you know the company will do better.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Dont get me wrong i hope Dino is here for the next 10 years. I think he is perfect for SU. I simply hope that he upgrades his staff. Coaches are like teachers, like business managers, like doctor's, lawyers, mechanics, electricians...
There are bad, good, better, best at everything. We have all experienced the range of ineptitude and excellence. We have all at some point in our lives been exceptional or inept at something.
I played three sports in HS. Football/QB DB. Basketball Guard mostly 2, Baseball pitcher and 3rd. I also played Hockey. Left wing but chose basketball after 7th ggrade.At this point in life i ski, raft, and climb and still play rec bball. I have started, worked for and ran companies and its my personal believe that based on my life experiences that great management regardless of what is being attempted is the difference between winning and losing.
The Allies didnt win the war because of better athletes or facilities. We won because we had better coaching and game/battlefield management.
Dont get me wrong your not going to flush many pheasants with a poodle but this years SU team has more than enough talent to perform significantly better than it has.
Dino is fine. His assistant coaches are weak. SU is well positioned from a resource standpoint to succeed. We have an excellent administration. They have been extremely supportive. No more excuses. Hire some talented managers and the next thing you know the company will do better.

better coaches will certainly help. I don’t think the talent is as bad as many do either. The better Syracuse teams over the past 20 years have all had a very significant influence of senior leadership as well. The 2001 team, marrones last season and last year. All great seniors and by far the best teams of the last 20 years. Dino needs a staff that can develop talent for sure

 

[Alsacs]

better coaches will certainly help. I don’t think the talent is as bad as many do either. The better Syracuse teams over the past 20 years have all had a very significant influence of senior leadership as well. The 2001 team, marrones last season and last year. All great seniors and by far the best teams of the last 20 years. Dino needs a staff that can develop talent for sure

The talent we have is inferior to fo along with bad coaching from the position coaches.

How many NFL draft picks have we had on offense this decade? 2010-2019?
Ryan Nassib-QB 4th round 2013
Justin Pugh- OL 1st round 2013
Zero RBs and WRs.

We don’t have game breakers.
Where are our Stefan Diggs, Leonte Carroo NFL picks at WR.

Our biggest problem is talent. We don’t get the 4 star talent at skill position. Dino has brought in some speed it’s just underclassmen.

Tutu Atwell’s make coaches look good.
They turn 30 yard plays into 90 yard TDs.

 

[EnviroSciGuy]

He was 7-5 in the regular season his last year with a beatdown of WVU in the Pinstripe Bowl. I'd gladly sign up for that every year.

Most importantly, the coaching appeared competent. You can't win without that unless you have truly elite talent and/or a special player or group of players.

 

[Chris02M]

all true. why has our recruiting been so bad????

we are at a disadvantage in recruiting because ny state recruits are at best 3 stars or if there are 4 stars we cant get them because of 15 years of being awful so we dont have a real strong base to lean on

 

[Frozen]

Gentlemen,

Faith is belief without evidence...but we cannot believe if we had one fluke season out of four in Babers tenure here. Wildhack and the Athletic Department better get moving...and moving fast. Babers is in over his head. Look at the stats...

Our Record
2016...4-8
2017...4-8
2018...10-3; and I honestly do not give him much credit that year led by a senior quarterback in Eric Dungey, 5th year senior wideout in Custis, veteran offensive line and most importantly a weak strength of schedule. Louisville was down last year...Florida State was down last year...UNC was very bad that year, but are much better this year as they may make a bowl this year. That record was a paper tiger.
2019...soon to be 4-8 after an increase in season tickets.

Overall record...22-27 with a fluke 10-3 season in there. Guys the ACC is not a gauntlet...Take out the outlier and its an average record of 4-8. This is Shafer-esque. Our defense is getting shredded and our offense has been figured out.

Player Morale
Dino has lost this team...Harris with his outbursts which are visible on the field...players laughing and joking around on the sideline after getting their butts kicked in. DIno does not even look engaged on the sideline. I saw the same loss of emotion with Marrone the year before he left. It is a sense of giving up or he doesn't know how to fix the issue.

Recruiting
We are recruiting worse and worse every year. We are at the bottom of the ACC in recruiting even after a 10 win season. We already fired our D-coordinator. Face it---Dino's defense is pathetic with the talent that is back there. The offense is not the new fast as we have got out-gained throughout the year.

My passion is still there, but tonight and this season was an eye-opener. Disucss.

 

[OrangeDW]

A "great" season for Marrone in his last year is very debatable and an exaggeration in my opinion. A 6-6 regular season that included a miracle comeback against USF and an eeked-out win against Missouri, who was without All-American Sheldon Richardson is not what I'd call "great."

As for Dino - I'm not ready to give up on him yet, but man do I have a lot of doubts these days. This season has been an abject disaster and is shaping up to be the third 4-8 seasons in Dino's four seasons here. There's not much of a positive spin to put on that, unfortunately.

It was a 7-5 regular season, not 6-6.

We started 1-3, but finished 6-2 with Justin Pugh back. We we rolling the last 2/3 of the season. We got robbed at Cincy and against Northwestern early in the year. Nonconference schedule was brutal. At Missouri was a great win with a great game winning drive, so not sure how you’re putting that in as a negative. For where we’d been as a program, you think we should’ve blown them out on the road?