i've completely flipped on the paying players thing

[OttoinGrotto]

No but when you're worth billions, you can and will do whatever you want with your money, whether it's deemed a good investment or not. That's the point I'm making, in that the actual market value of endorsement deals for these athletes will mean nothing. People do crazy things for their schools, and some booster paying a top athlete way more that what they are worth, just so they'll choose to attend their beloved school, might be worth it in their minds.

I still don't see what the problem is with that.

 

[EastCoast2]

That doesn't solve any problems, though. Teams with larger budgets can take more risks and offer more money to more kids. If Phil Knight pays $1m to a top recruit and he doesn't pan out, it's not a big loss. He could offer $1m to the entire McDonald's All-American roster and take the first 10 that accept. Oregon State can't do that, if they offer $1m and the kid stinks, they're stuck with him for 4 years, they're toast.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This would be true for a while, maybe a long while at some schools. It solves the problem that the people who are most responsible for generating massive revenues for their schools are not receiving proportional compensation by creating a new revenue stream. The schools income is not significantly affected at first (I may be wrong , but assume that media revenue and mandatory donations to secure tickets dwarfs voluntary donations - at least outside of facility construction efforts which might rely on naming rights-level donors).

However, all this money is floating around because lots of people are interested in seeing top level competitions involving either or both of this age group and/or schools they are somehow associated with. Connecting players with boosters/endorsers will definitely result in concentrations of higher-rated players at certain schools that have fans offering to pay more. If it results in a small group of ultra elite teams, there is potential that overall interest will wane if school-first fans find their alma mater on the outside. Meaning less viewers and butts in seats, which leads to lower direct revenue and media contracts for the universities and subsequently reduced endorsement opportunities for the players.

Recruits don't always pan out though. So, unless transfer rules are liberalized, there will be star players at non-factory schools who may benefit from national corporate endorsements (smart companies will also take care of their teammates to ensure ROI). Will this be enough to counter booster endorsements and maintain a broad level of competition? Who knows.

I think my point got away from me as I typed, but I do think I'm starting to lean toward the deregulate and lets see what happens side.

I'm telling you, the more and more people think this through, the clearer it is that it's a bad situation for schools to directly pay players, and a much better situation to simply allow all student-athletes to directly benefit from their own name and likeness.

Heck, you might even see better behavior from them with endorsements on the line, to say nothing of the fact that you might see instances of people staying in school longer if their financial needs are met/they figure out that their name and likeness is more valuable as a celebrity collegian in a mid or small market than a pro at the end of the bench in a major market.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

That doesn't solve any problems, though. Teams with larger budgets can take more risks and offer more money to more kids. If Phil Knight pays $1m to a top recruit and he doesn't pan out, it's not a big loss. He could offer $1m to the entire McDonald's All-American roster and take the first 10 that accept. Oregon State can't do that, if they offer $1m and the kid stinks, they're stuck with him for 4 years, they're toast.

Phil Knight's team of Burger Boys might not mesh. Who says the coach even wants Phil Knight dictating the roster?

I'm telling you guys, this stuff will get itself worked out.

 

[djcon57]

to say nothing of the fact that you might see instances of people staying in school longer if their financial needs are met/they figure out that their name and likeness is more valuable as a celebrity collegian in a mid or small market than a pro at the end of the bench in a major market.

Without question, this would be true for your 2nd round types

 

[EastCoast2]

Phil Knight's team of Burger Boys might not mesh. Who says the coach even wants Phil Knight dictating the roster?

I'm telling you guys, this stuff will get itself worked out.

Syracuse would not get any top 50 players.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Without question, this would be true for your 2nd round types

I think of Jimmer Fredette as a prime example.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Syracuse would not get any top 50 players.

First off, that's not a sure thing, and second, so what? This is bigger than Syracuse.

 

[EastCoast2]

First off, that's not a sure thing, and second, so what? This is bigger than Syracuse.

You'd need to propose a more specific solution. I'm for paying players in some revenue-sharing scheme, but paying by minutes played, or having unlimited payment opportunities would cause serious problems IMO.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

You'd need to propose a more specific solution. I'm for paying players in some revenue-sharing scheme, but paying by minutes played, or having unlimited payment opportunities would cause serious problems IMO.

My specific solution is that student-athletes be free to sign endorsement deals for their own name and likeness once they are enrolled. It can genuinely be that simple.

 

[EastCoast2]

My specific solution is that student-athletes be free to sign endorsement deals for their own name and likeness once they are enrolled. It can genuinely be that simple.

No limits on compensation? I think this would scare a lot of schools, afraid to compete with Oregon (Phil Knight aka Nike) or Michigan (Larry Page aka Google) or Auburn (Tim Cook aka Apple)

 

[OttoinGrotto]

No limits on compensation? I think this would scare a lot of schools, afraid to compete with Oregon (Phil Knight aka Nike) or Michigan (Larry Page aka Google) or Auburn (Tim Cook aka Apple)

Let those guys spend to their limit. They don't have all of the money.

 

[orangehomer]

i don't know what would be the best way to implement it, I guess my imagination is that the school would be able to offer a player anything from zero above scholarship up to a cap, like maybe $200K per season. and the player is free to do endorsements on top of it. I think the system would work itself out, I don't think that many programs would want to pay the cap to all guys 1-13, and I don't think that every player would only choose the max offer because they would still care about playing time and geography and what not.

I guess I just keep thinking of guys like trevor cooney or scoop. good college players that won't play pro. there is a good chance that for those guys, their 5 years at SU could have been their prime earning years of their lives. even with a relatively modest (compared to the revenue of SU basketball) salary and the opportunity to do endorsements it is easy to imagine that those guys could and should be graduating $500K in the bank. that money could be life changing to those families.

 

[Briancuse]

No. What the athletes receive from the school in terms of benefits remains the same and is equal. No Title 9 issue. You're simply not stopping them from getting endorsements.

Look, I know people think college sports is all Kentucky basketball and Alabama football, but if every athlete is eligible to benefit from their name and likeness you're going to see women's volleyball players and men's crew benefit too.

But how do they profit from the name and likeness? You mean the jerseys that they sell?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

But how do they profit from the name and likeness? You mean the jerseys that they sell?

The same way celebrity endorsers do.

 

[Briancuse]

The same way celebrity endorsers do.

Im confused, how are they profiting from their likeness? You mean every time they are on espn, or a highlight reel?

 

[Rage4CUSE]

But how do they profit from the name and likeness? You mean the jerseys that they sell?

Which every company that wants to offer them money.

 

[Rage4CUSE]

Im confused, how are they profiting from their likeness? You mean every time they are on espn, or a highlight reel?

Celebrities sign contracts with companies to endorse thier products.the amount of money is negotiated in the contact.

 

[Briancuse]

Which every company that wants to offer them money.

But how does that work? Then only some players are going to be getting money, do you know the rift that is going to cause among teams.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

i don't know what would be the best way to implement it, I guess my imagination is that the school would be able to offer a player anything from zero above scholarship up to a cap, like maybe $200K per season. and the player is free to do endorsements on top of it. I think the system would work itself out, I don't think that many programs would want to pay the cap to all guys 1-13, and I don't think that every player would only choose the max offer because they would still care about playing time and geography and what not.

I guess I just keep thinking of guys like trevor cooney or scoop. good college players that won't play pro. there is a good chance that for those guys, their 5 years at SU could have been their prime earning years of their lives. even with a relatively modest (compared to the revenue of SU basketball) salary and the opportunity to do endorsements it is easy to imagine that those guys could and should be graduating $500K in the bank. that money could be life changing to those families.

Look, there are already all kinds of weird factors increasing the price of higher education in the US. We really do not need to add direct payment to athletes.

This can all be skirted if the NCAA just drops the prohibition on student-athletes. If they can profit from their own name and likeness directly, the problem is solved.

 

[Briancuse]

Celebrities sign contracts with companies to endorse thier products.the amount of money is negotiated in the contact.

But you are paying athletes, if your star shooting guard is getting paid, the rest of the athletes in your athletic department also have to be paid.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

But how does that work? Then only some players are going to be getting money, do you know the rift that is going to cause among teams.

So what? That's not the objective.

 

[Briancuse]

So what? That's not the objective.

So what is the objective, to only pay the star players?

 

[Briancuse]

I was listening to Mike Francessa the other day, and he was talking about Rick Majerus. One of his players father passed away, and the kid didn't have enough money to fly home for the funeral. So Rick paid for him to go, even though the Ncaa told him it was a violation, and he didn't care. There needs to be funds available to a player who desperately needs some money.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

So what is the objective, to only pay the star players?

I'm not sure if you even actually read what I post.