Justin Fuentes out at VT / Brent Pry in

[Killdozer]

Who at Syracuse has said that is good enough?

The way it is going Wildhack feels that way. Of course SU fans "wants" are a low priority when dealing with a buyout of a coach and rightfully so. It just been a long time since SU has had back to back winning seasons and like eternity since the coach P days.

 

[qdawgg]

Andrea Adelson @aadelsonESPN


The writing has been on the wall for year(s) now. So the biggest question I have for Whit Babcock today is whether he regrets not making this move a year ago, when we all expected a change to be made.

This is exactly where we are at. Most of us know where all of this is headed. Why are we waiting another year to maybe make a change.

 

[kirbivore]

These bigger football programs don't care about these lower-level bowls or view them in the same light as SU does.

It's a business at these larger football programs and if your not first your last is the mentality. And that isn't necessarily a wrong mentality to have because if you leave a bad coach in place for too long he can dig you a hole that is impossible to get out of.

Just look at Tennessee. Multiple coaches after Fulmer and they might be digging out.

 

[qdawgg]

Appreciate the thought - but you’d fire him in year 1 or 2?!

You don’t fire him then unless there’s a scandal.

My point is people like to use collective stats to make overarching points (he’s blank and blank in ACC play!) without really thinking through *when* you’d fire him. Or in this case, saying we have low expectations.

Also note me “we’ll see” at the end of my post. We have two games left - if we lose both, I’m not sure which way it will go.

You’d fire him after last year. Pretty simple. A lot of people realized he had one good season with other peoples recruits but between that had all the makings of an underperforming coach. Simple stuff actually.

 

[SuFTW]

Where do you, and others, get this stuff? Nobody on this board, except maybe CTO, has any clue re the financial situation. I might just point out that SU raised >$1 Billion so far during the pandemic.

*Warning, speculation ahead*
I highly doubt the school would use University money to payout a fired coach from the athletic department. I would think it would have to be athletic department money. The $1 billion then becomes irrelevant.

 

[CusefanATL]

Why would Fuentes do that or his agent let him?

Because he nor his agent had absolutely any control over it. He got an extra $1.25m to not work a deadbeat month.

Va Tech would have just waited until Dec 15 - they asked him to coach the rest of the year. He said no. Great deal for Fuentes.

 

[kirbivore]

Heard a coach, or maybe it was a former coach, on the Packer and Durham show a few weeks ago say that “recruiting always beats coaching”.

The Mack Brown / Roy Williams corollary

 

[HRE Otto IV]

This is exactly where we are at. Most of us know where all of this is headed. Why are we waiting another year to maybe make a change.

We need to see how these next 2 games play out.

We are still a young team and that does factor in us being 2-4 in close games this year. Dino is also a factor in that record, but by what factor?

I think this team is setup for a breakout 2023. What gives us the best chance at achieving that? Staying the course with the current staff? Making a change now so it is year 2 of the new HC? Or having it be year 1 of the new HC?

I think with 2 competitive games to end this year and a Bowl next year, the best bet is to stay the course with Dino. The question is can he pull off 2 competitive losses (or better), and a Bowl next season? Personally I am leaning towards no.

If we are going to make a coaching change IMO it is better to do it this year than next year given our 2023 roster.

 

[SuFTW]

Because he nor his agent had absolutely any control over it. He got an extra $1.25m to not work a deadbeat month.

Va Tech would have just waited until Dec 15 - they asked him to coach the rest of the year. He said no. Great deal for Fuentes.

If he has a contract, then he has the control allowed by the contract. It can’t be unilaterally changed. Looks like he was willing to split the difference and leave early because he was going to be fired regardless of what happened in the remainder of the season.

 

[qdawgg]

We need to see how these next 2 games play out.

We are still a young team and that does factor in us being 2-4 in close games this year. Dino is also a factor in that record, but by what factor?

I think this team is setup for a breakout 2023. What gives us the best chance at achieving that? Staying the course with the current staff? Making a change now so it is year 2 of the new HC? Or having it be year 1 of the new HC?

I think with 2 competitive games to end this year and a Bowl next year, the best bet is to stay the course with Dino. The question is can he pull off 2 competitive losses (or better), and a Bowl next season? Personally I am leaning towards no.

If we are going to make a coaching change IMO it is better to do it this year than next year given our 2023 roster.

That’s assuming DB and whatever the coaching staff is between now and 2023 can coach the players up to have a breakout 2023.

 

[CusefanATL]

If he has a contract, then he has the control allowed by the contract. It can’t be unilaterally changed. Looks like he was willing to split the difference and leave early because he was going to be fired regardless of what happened in the remainder of the season.

Yeah - he had 2 options.

1. Coach until Dec 15th and get 7.5m
2. Leave now and get 8.75m renegotiated

there was no 10 mil option because va tech had to actually fire him for that to happen. And they wouldnt have had he not renegotiated. So he would have been coaching for a month as a lameduck coach. Probably publicly.

Va tech had 100% control of the situation.

 

[EuclidBred]

Helicoptering in here for a minute...

1. The narrative that Syracuse can't afford buy-outs, are broke, etc...is lazy and outdated. If JW wants to make a change - he'll be able to get it done. Reports of it being too expensive are just an excuse.

2. It's wild to think VT is firing a coach with two games left that has a 43-31 record while Cuse meddles with a coach that has a 29-41 record.

3. I really hope VT doesn't hire Jamey Chadwell from Coastal Carolina. He's a tremendous coach with an offense that would fit so well here with our built in recruiting deficiencies (see his OL size)

 

[NovaOrange]

Not going through all 4 pages of posts but from a VA person who has a lot of connections with VT this is the simple breakdown. The boosters hated him as a person/coach and one of the well known boosters told the AD last year he would triple his donation per year if they fired him last year. Long story short he never fit in at VT they all hated him. Not surprised at all I was shocked when he made it through last year honestly

 

[elimunelson]

Who hires these guys when the fit is so terrible with those results. These search committees are really terrible at figuring out fit.

Not going through all 4 pages of posts but from a VA person who has a lot of connections with VT this is the simple breakdown. The boosters hated him as a person/coach and one of the well known boosters told the AD last year he would triple his donation per year if they fired him last year. Long story short he never fit in at VT they all hated him. Not surprised at all I was shocked when he made it through last year honestly

 

[Pyle]

Would JF be a good fit here? Asking for a friend.

 

[Stevenson]

You also have to look at the state of the programs prior to the coaching hires.

They should be able to pay a buyout...

 

[orangeinohio]

one of the well known boosters told the AD last year he would triple his donation per year if they fired him last year

Kissing booster behind has got to be the crappiest part of that job. (no pun intended there)

 

[orangecuse]

*Warning, speculation ahead*
I highly doubt the school would use University money to payout a fired coach from the athletic department. I would think it would have to be athletic department money. The $1 billion then becomes irrelevant.

I find this topic to have a somewhat ironic potential. I don't want to borrow $100k from my 401K as I likely may need it down the road, not to mention having to pay the tax penalty, etc. Therefore, I'll just let a significant part of the hand that feeds me suffer beyond the point of no return and afterwards let the chips fall where they may.

 

[WoadBlue]

Who hires these guys when the fit is so terrible with those results. These search committees are really terrible at figuring out fit.

Search committees no longer control these things: so-called professionals do. And they rarely know the ins and outs and the differences among different conferences, much less of specific sets of boosters and schools.

An old fashioned search committee would have included, say: the AD; another couple of employees of the Athletics Department (at least 1 of whom is a coach of another sport); a couple of professors (at least 1 of whom has season tickets); a couple of members of a Board of Trustees; a couple of prominent football boosters; a couple of alums who lack the money to be true 'boosters' but are football fans; and an owner of a local business or local executive (and/or school alum) of a Big Business.

A consulting firm will never understand 'fit' like an old fashioned committee.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Who hires these guys when the fit is so terrible with those results. These search committees are really terrible at figuring out fit.

There are a lot of bad fits out there. Don't see Harsin lasting long as a fit. Then you have a guy like Addazio whose strength is Northeast recruiting and he goes out West.

 

[Chip]

I find this topic to have a somewhat ironic potential. I don't want to borrow $100k from my 401K as I likely may need it down the road, not to mention having to pay the tax penalty, etc. Therefore, I'll just let a significant part of the hand that feeds me suffer beyond the point of no return and afterwards let the chips fall where they may.

I think you can borrow from your 401k, without tax/penalty. And pay yourself back with interest.

Not highly recommended though, unless you're really disciplined and not leaving your job anytime soon.

So, to summarize, we should all get FBS head coaching jobs.

 

[Willy75]

They should be able to pay a buyout...

Not many students pay sticker, in fact surprisingly few.

 

[sufandu]

They should be able to pay a buyout...

I didn't say anything about a buyout. My comment was regarding expectations for coaching success at differwnt schools. When a guy comes into a program that has had sustained success the expectations for maintaining or enhancing that should be different than one that comes into a program that has been crap for the better part of 15 years.

 

[All4SU]

We have seen strong evidence that schools who bounce from Coach to coach every three/four years are more likely to perpetuate a pattern of failure than success. I would like to see a study comparing that hiring/firing style with instances have rode with a coach and let him make the staff/scheme adjustments necessary to increase success. I have nothing to base it on, but my opinion is that if you hire a coach who has had success someplace else, and you are patient, eventually he will have a better chance of repeating success than if you bounce to the next prospective coach.

 

[orangepassion]

We have seen strong evidence that schools who bounce from Coach to coach every three/four years are more likely to perpetuate a pattern of failure than success. I would like to see a study comparing that hiring/firing style with instances have rode with a coach and jet him make the staff/scheme adjustments necessary to increase success. I have nothing to base it on, but my opinion is that if you hire a coach who has had success someplace else, and you are patient, eventually half will have a better chance of repeating success than if you bounce to the next prospective coach.

I agree with this-The question is how many years is a fair sample size. Firing too early or too late can be damaging and make it harder to recover.