Last home game for many players tonight

[iommi]

goodbye and thank you to
Triche
Southerland
MCW
Roc
Hop

Wow, that would be quite the turnover. CJ and The Miracles. That's what we'd need in the ACC.

 

[cusetown1]

Wow, that would be quite the turnover. CJ and The Miracles. That's what we'd need in the ACC.

Never fear, Seth Greenberg will right the ship.!

 

[iommi]

Never fear, Seth Greenberg will right the ship.!

Don't forget his daughters! Hubba Hubba!

 

[br801]

goodbye and thank you to
Triche
Southerland
MCW
Roc
Hop

So you anticipate Xmas will be transferring?

 

[realorange]

With the way the CBA is structured now, if you are Dion or MCW, I wouldnt go...you need that guaranteed money.

If Fab didnt as he did, he probably should have stayed. This team with him would've been highly ranked, he wouldve got tons of pub and with this weak draft this year, he would prob been top 10.

If Fab hadn't screwed up last year and we got to the Final Four, he would have likely been an earlier pick with a guarenteed contract.

 

[RF2044]

I feel like our team will be deeper as far as scoring options go next year. I think the absolute peak for him next year will likely be around his Big East averages (16 and 7). Good numbers, but unless I'm overestimating some of the ACC guys, I feel like that probably isn't enough to be POY. I think he'll likely end up putting up around 14 and 7 like he's averaging this year if Coleman, Xmas, Grant, Gbinije, and Cooney make the contributions I'm expecting of them next year.

That's not my expectation, given the scoring we lose this offseason. If MCW goes [as expected], then we lose four of our top 5 scorers. The offense is going to be structured around CJ next season--book it.

 

[Melancer46]

That's not my expectation, given the scoring we lose this offseason. If MCW goes [as expected], then we lose four of our top 5 scorers. The offense is going to be structured around CJ next season--book it.

You think Xmas is gone?

And I don't know, I feel like it'll be a more balanced offensive attack next year. I think Coleman will give us a post presence, Grant will take a big step forward, Gbinije will replace Triche, Cooney will get his shot working, and Ennis will provide some scoring too.

I hope I'm wrong, but I honestly don't think CJ is capable of being the center of the offense unless he really works on his ball-handling or becomes a dependable scorer in the post or something. I don't really see either of those things happening.

 

[RF2044]

You think Xmas is gone?

And I don't know, I feel like it'll be a more balanced offensive attack next year. I think Coleman will give us a post presence, Grant will take a big step forward, Gbinije will replace Triche, Cooney will get his shot working, and Ennis will provide some scoring too.

I hope I'm wrong, but I honestly don't think CJ is capable of being the center of the offense unless he really works on his ball-handling or becomes a dependable scorer in the post or something. I don't really see either of those things happening.

Ennis
Gbinije
CJ
Grant
Coleman

I don't know whether Rak returns or not, but I don't envision him starting even if he does. Off the bench, Keita / Cooney, maybe Patterson and / or BJ Johnson.

So where do the points come from? I think Gbinije will be double figure scorer. Grant might, as well. And Coleman could get there. But there will be a lot of points to make up, and CJ is this year's team top scorer. He's already averaging 14 and 7, and that's with him not pressing early in the season and putting up a ton of single digit games. there is no way that his "upside" is 14 points.

And CJ being the focal point of the offense is a lot more likely than all of the things you list above falling into place.

The kid is a gamer--don't bet against him. He's proven a lot of critics wrong this season.

 

[Melancer46]

Ennis
Gbinije
CJ
Grant
Coleman

I don't know whether Rak returns or not, but I don't envision him starting even if he does. Off the bench, Keita / Cooney, maybe Patterson and / or BJ Johnson.

So where do the points come from? I think Gbinije will be double figure scorer. Grant might, as well. And Coleman could get there. But there will be a lot of points to make up, and CJ is this year's team top scorer. He's already averaging 14 and 7, and that's with him not pressing early in the season and putting up a ton of single digit games. there is no way that his "upside" is 14 points.

And CJ being the focal point of the offense is a lot more likely than all of the things you list above falling into place.

The kid is a gamer--don't bet against him. He's proven a lot of critics wrong this season.

We'll see. Like Dion has by improving his shot selection over the past couple months, I hope Fair proves me wrong and improves his game to the point where he can be a legitimate go-to scorer and NBA prospect instead of just being one of a bunch of scorers. I don't think this year's CJ is capable of being that guy if we want to contend in the ACC next year. Hopefully he comes back a less limited scorer.

 

[jdubs30]

Ennis
Gbinije
CJ
Grant
Coleman

I don't know whether Rak returns or not, but I don't envision him starting even if he does. Off the bench, Keita / Cooney, maybe Patterson and / or BJ Johnson.

So where do the points come from? I think Gbinije will be double figure scorer. Grant might, as well. And Coleman could get there. But there will be a lot of points to make up, and CJ is this year's team top scorer. He's already averaging 14 and 7, and that's with him not pressing early in the season and putting up a ton of single digit games. there is no way that his "upside" is 14 points.

And CJ being the focal point of the offense is a lot more likely than all of the things you list above falling into place.

The kid is a gamer--don't bet against him. He's proven a lot of critics wrong this season.

Kind of like how our offense was last year and 2 years ago. A bunch of guys around 8ppg with CJ around 14.

I see no reason why Coleman, Grant, and Cooney can't get to 8ppg next year (I think Grant will be closer to 10). Then throw in 12 or so from Gbinjie. I expect Ennis to be around 6 or so. That should be enough.

Fair= 14
Gbinjie=12
Grant= 10
Cooney, Coleman= 8
Ennis= 6
BMK/Rak/Patterson/Johnson= 12
Total= 70

 

[moqui]

The kid is a gamer--don't bet against him. He's proven a lot of critics wrong this season.

Like who? I can't think of anyone who ever said CJ was not going to be a productive and valuable player

 

[NineOneSeven]

CJ is, and has always been, a four year player.

 

[NineOneSeven]

CJ would be wise to enter the draft with no agent. Do a couple workouts and test the waters. All it takes is one [ ] to like him. If he doesn't like what he sees, pull out.

Sounds like a typical Friday night HEY YO!

 

[RF2044]

Like who? I can't think of anyone who ever said CJ was not going to be a productive and valuable player

There have been PLENTY of detractors, and truism opinions asserted as fact about what CJ's capabilities are, and what he ostensibly can and cannot do.

He's a power forward in a small forward's body.

He can't shoot beyond 10 feet.

He can't put the ball on the floor.

He's a black hole.

He'll never be an effective three point shooter.

I'm not attributing all of the above to any one poster, but let's not pretend that all of these opinions weren't stated as fact at one time or another this season.

I continue to enjoy reading what CJ is incapable of doing, then watch him go out and score 18 on 5/8 shooting, hit a bunch of deep jumpers, and go 7-7 from the line while also hauling in 9 rebounds.

Not saying he's perfect. He DEFINITELY has areas that he can improve. For example:

--Being more aggressive / demonstrating more versatility by being able to create off the bounce
--Playing with his back to the basket more often to exploit size mismatches in the post, providing a complimentary low post threat
--Demonstrating improved ability to finish with his right hand

But this kid has emerged as a fantastic player who is one of the top players in the conference. And I expect improvement this offseason as he heads into his senior year.

End of rant.

 

[UnderHisOwnPower]

There have been PLENTY of detractors, and truism opinions asserted as fact about what CJ's capabilities are, and what he ostensibly can and cannot do.

He's a power forward in a small forward's body.

He can't shoot beyond 10 feet.

He can't put the ball on the floor.

He's a black hole.

He'll never be an effective three point shooter.

I'm not attributing all of the above to any one poster, but let's not pretend that all of these opinions have been stated as truth at one time or another this season.

I lost count of the "What's wrong with CJ?" threads from Nov and Dec. Looking back, it was like reading the funny pages.

 

[jncuse]

Yeah, I definitely think Fab would have improved his draft stock had he stayed, but obviously he had other reasons for making the jump as soon as he did.

Dion made the right decision to leave, and MCW likely is making the right decision as well, though if not for his age, I feel like he'd improve his draft stock by coming back to play with a more talented group next year while working on his shooting in the offseason to get it back to the way it was in high school for him.

I'm not sure if Melo would have improved his draft stock at all - in fact there was more risk for him to stay. His stock was heavily based on the level of improvement he had made as a soph, and the "assumption" that he had much more progression to do based on the fact he was improving. This assumption is often erroneous.

If he had stayed, and only improved a little bit, he is no longer a first rounder. Its always best to leave when you have a big jump in performance -- it shows you are on a real upward path rather than flatlining... when in reality it just may have taken you a year longer to progress.

 

[moqui]

There have been PLENTY of detractors, and truism opinions asserted as fact about what CJ's capabilities are, and what he ostensibly can and cannot do.

He's a power forward in a small forward's body.

He can't shoot beyond 10 feet.

He can't put the ball on the floor.

He's a black hole.

He'll never be an effective three point shooter.

I'm not attributing all of the above to any one poster, but let's not pretend that all of these opinions weren't stated as fact at one time or another this season.

I continue to enjoy reading what CJ is incapable of doing, then watch him go out and score 18 on 5/8 shooting, hit a bunch of deep jumpers, and go 7-7 from the line while also hauling in 9 rebounds.

Not saying he's perfect. He DEFINITELY has areas that he can improve. For example:

--Being more aggressive / demonstrating more versatility by being able to create off the bounce
--Playing with his back to the basket more often to exploit size mismatches in the post, providing a complimentary low post threat
--Demonstrating improved ability to finish with his right hand

But this kid has emerged as a fantastic player who is one of the top players in the conference. And I expect improvement this offseason as he heads into his senior year.

End of rant.

those were all legitimate critiques, and they were all true last year. and, to his great credit, he has expanded his game this year.

You have long predicted that CJ would be the best player on the team, and you are arguably correct now and will almost certainly be correct next year.

But last year, you were attributing aspects to his game that he did not add until this season. That is a fact.


now, I find this curious:

I continue to enjoy reading what CJ is incapable of doing, then watch him go out and score 18 on 5/8 shooting, hit a bunch of deep jumpers, and go 7-7 from the line while also hauling in 9 rebounds.

where are you reading all this? this board is an unequivocal CJ fan zone. you are referencing things that were written last season.

 

[Melancer46]

I'm not sure if Melo would have improved his draft stock at all - in fact there was more risk for him to stay. His stock was heavily based on the level of improvement he had made as a soph, and the "assumption" that he had much more progression to do based on the fact he was improving. This assumption is often erroneous.

If he had stayed, and only improved a little bit, he is no longer a first rounder. Its always best to leave when you have a big jump in performance -- it shows you are on a real upward path rather than flatlining... when in reality it just may have taken you a year longer to progress.

I agree, but I don't think there's a chance in hell he would have flat lined. He would have come back and proven to be possibly the best defensive big in the country, and he would have been the recipient of a ton of MCW alley oops and dishes this year. I think his stock would have risen without question if he had been able to keep his head on straight. I firmly believe he would have been at worst the #3 or 4 center in the class (depending on how you feel about Rudy Gobert).

 

[RF2044]

those were all legitimate critiques, and they were all true last year. and, to his great credit, he has expanded his game this year.

But last year, you were attributing aspects to his game that he did not add until this season. That is a fact.

No, it isn't a fact. He's had this type of versatility all along, and I caution that there is a difference between not being able to do something and not showing that you can do it.

I told you three years ago that CJ showed a much more expanded game in practice, and that he had the tools to be this type of player. You and others insisted that he was only an undersized 4 with a limited game. Well, now everyone is beginning to see CJ demonstrate what his capabilities actually are. And thankfully, his game doesn't bear much resemblance to many of the things that were predicted about his potential, skill set, etc. by many on this site.

now, I find this curious:

where are you reading all this? this board is an unequivocal CJ fan zone. you are referencing things that were written last season.

That might be true of the stuff posted lately, but it isn't an accurate assessment of what was said about CJ as recently as earlier this season. Every one of the things I list in the previous post--he is a 4 not a 3, he can't hit mid range jumpers, he can't shoot the three, etc.--were declarative statements made about CJ's game this year. All of those predictions seem ridiculous in hindsight, but that's what some were posting.

He's won fans over because he's proven those attributions to be false, while getting the job done in efficient fashion. And I believe--my opinion only, I'll own this--that he's capable of more.