Musings on the Defense

[orangefog]

Most of the kids on Houston's 2 deep are high 2 star, low 3 star kids out of high school. Has nothing to do with Texas 2 star/3 star recruits being "better" than a 2/3 star kid out of Wisconsin. Also, those kids have the benefit of working the same system the past few years (despite their coaching changes - they promoted from within). In a few years, we could very well be "Houston-esque".

I would bet on it. Dino Babers is a winner, he will get us there. He has given us the timetable and still people panic after the third freaking game. This offense will be flying in about a year and the defense will continue to improve as guys learn their roles and we fill every position with guys who are more physically suited for this defense. In the meantime we have a bunch of guys that chose to come to Syracuse and they are working their asses off. I am looking forward to them taking out some frustration on UConn this Saturday.

 

[cuse309]

Man I love this post! The kids are super talented but there's too many moving parts. This is the exact point I was trying to make in the USF game thread and it somehow got misconstrued into me personally having low expectations.

For the life of me, I can't figure out why there are people who are already seemingly writing off Babers, this defense, and our bowl hopes this year. Teams are dynamic throughout any given year, especially when they are very young, and learning a brand new offensive scheme, and a COMPLETELY different defensive concept, one in which they were not recruited to play. This offense, and defense is not a finished product for this year. This team is not even close to a finished product, in terms of what Dino wants to accomplish. Most everybody expected a defense that would struggle this year given the changeover, and an offense that could put up points. That is pretty much EXACTLY what is happening, but now, for some, that's unacceptable.
I would love nothing more than a bowl game this year, but if that doesn't happen, we should all still be very excited about what Dino could do for this school in the next 2-3 years. Success should be measured in positive changes and improvements throughout the year, not really in wins, and losses, and where do we rank in "category x". What I've already noticed is an offense that has improved vastly, that still has a long way to go, a seemingly more disciplined team as far as procedural penalties, and a total change in the mentality in play calling, (going for it on 4th without even thinking about it.) and better clock management. To sound cliche', Rome wasn't built in a day and Syracuse football won't be built in 3 games. Dino didn't ask for patience just to hear himself talk.

 

[sufandu]

I don't think this is right at all. His post is helpful in understanding that those 15 years are all history to the players and the new staff. They should get wiped from our memories too. They are irrelevant and not helpful in getting to where we want to be. Much like attendance threads should be placed on moratorium, out right venting over years and years of pain should too.

The last two weekends sucked. But they were steps 2-3 in a rebuilding process under a new coach.

What if we kept the past in the past and just judged based on year one of a new system and staff?

Wiping memories is easier said than done. Your dealing with fans, short for fanatics.

I'm not one of the posters that has said anything about our talent on defense, if you look at my comments they've been very even keeled. I've been quite judicious with both praise and ridicule, especially with regards to the talent, because I don't think anyone knew exactly what to expect. Look back at what I've said and you'll see I've been hopeful about the offense and questioned the decision to go Tampa 2, but since the start of the season said very little that has been specific about either.

There were a lot of people on here convinced we could throw a scare into Louisville and hang with Louisville light. When people like that thump their chest and raise expectations, then we have games like we've had, the negative reactions should be expected.

If you don't expect people to vent on a public forum I think you may need to take a break too. It's gonna happen, and not just here. It happens everywhere. If people don't want it they'll have to go to Alabama's, Ohio State's, or Louisville's boards. But, you know what, I bet you'll see it there too. Probably could've found it this weekend during the Alabama vs Ole Miss game.

I was merely pointing out a reality that exists, even though I rarely subscribe to the actions I described. Don't lecture people about how they should feel about something that is meant to be an emotional event.

 

[dollarbill44]

Your son is not the problem the kid plays his butt.

:rolling:

 

[HtownOrange]

Bcubs, thank you for your OP and subsequent posts. HCDB has a plan that works. The kids are all in on it. Thee schedule is a very tough schedule. The offensive scheme is new. The defensive scheme is new. The kids on the team were recruited for a different scheme.

Lots of variables. However, HCDB has the kids already improving weekly, I can see it their play, their efforts and understanding. The Defense will improve significantly by the end of the year, they are improving weekly. The offense is improving weekly and HCDB stat it takes at least 1.5 years to click. We will face some easier teams in the next few weeks; growth in the system and weaker teams should result in observable improvements.

Fans getting upset will not help the situation. We get out of hand and need a reality check every now and then, like the one you provided..

 

[Alsacs]

View attachment 76297:rolling:

My phone cut the word off from my post. It should have been plays his butt off. My point was clearly understood.

 

[orange44]

Posted this in another thread; didn't want itto get lost in the noise.

What's Houston ranked right now? 6th. Anyone take a look at what their recruiting classes looked like the past several years? 2015: 92nd. 2014: 76th. 2013: 56th.

This year: 35th.

The recruiting ratings of their starting front 7:
Jerard Carter: 2 star
Ed Oliver: 5 star
Cameron Malveaux: 2 star

LBs:
Tyus Bowser: 3 star
Matthew Adams: 3 star
Steven Taylor: 2 star
D'Juan Hines: 2 star

Most of them are 3+ years into the program. Only one, Ed Oliver, is an underclassman (and highly rated).

If anyone wants to read up on their bios, here's the link: UHCOUGARS.com :: University of Houston Official Athletic Site :: Football

The point of this post? 1st, to defend these kids. S T with the "lack of talent" crap. Most of our guys are 1-2 years into SU, and they've already have had to deal with 2 coaching staffs, two totally differing defensive schemes, and lots of injuries. Our kids, coming out of high school, pretty much match what Houston's got, and, as we can all see, Houston doesn't suck. 2nd. Implementing a new D and a new O is traumatic. Sht's gonna happen. They're ALL learning (including the staff). So, for those btching about how much we suck, cut them some goddamn slack. It's going to be a train wreck, interspersed with flashes of what this team will become by 2018. BE PATIENT and a bit more understanding of what's happened, and what's going on with these boys.

Love what you have to say and totally agree with you!

 

[cuse309]

I think matching the players to the scheme, is much more important than stockpiling "Talent" as measured by our fine recruit ranking sites. Take a look at the top 25 poll at the conclusion of every season, and you will see schools whose rosters are made up of 2-3 star payers, whose classes ranked similarly to our classes in the 45-70 range. Hell, Marshall was a top 25 with classes ranking in the 100's. Coaching, and players fit to that scheme are infinitely more important that loading up on 4-5 star guys. Every year there are teams loaded with 4 and 5 star guys, who finished unranked.

 

[TheCusian]

Wiping memories is easier said than done. Your dealing with fans, short for fanatics.

I'm not one of the posters that has said anything about our talent on defense, if you look at my comments they've been very even keeled. I've been quite judicious with both praise and ridicule, especially with regards to the talent, because I don't think anyone knew exactly what to expect. Look back at what I've said and you'll see I've been hopeful about the offense and questioned the decision to go Tampa 2, but since the start of the season said very little that has been specific about either.

There were a lot of people on here convinced we could throw a scare into Louisville and hang with Louisville light. When people like that thump their chest and raise expectations, then we have games like we've had, the negative reactions should be expected.

If you don't expect people to vent on a public forum I think you may need to take a break too. It's gonna happen, and not just here. It happens everywhere. If people don't want it they'll have to go to Alabama's, Ohio State's, or Louisville's boards. But, you know what, I bet you'll see it there too. Probably could've found it this weekend during the Alabama vs Ole Miss game.

I was merely pointing out a reality that exists, even though I rarely subscribe to the actions I described. Don't lecture people about how they should feel about something that is meant to be an emotional event.

Fair enough. I just think if we're allowing for emotional venting, we should probably be cool with reasoned posts calling for patience (which I think you are).

The way Louisville is playing we may have gotten them the closest to "scared"... they are way better than what everyone thought.

 

[dollarbill44]

My phone cut the word off from my post. It should have been plays his butt off. My point was clearly understood.

Just trying to have a little fun with a typo. It shouldn't all be doom and gloom and arguments on here. Sports are entertainment, so we should be allowed to laugh now and then.

 

[CuseLegacy]

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Talent is a problem. Not one player would start for our 2009 team when Marrone took over.

 

[orangefog]

Talent is a problem. Not one player would start for our 2009 team when Marrone took over.

Of course not, they would have been like 12 years old in 2009.

 

[bcubs9497]

Talent is a problem. Not one player would start for our 2009 team when Marrone took over.

Bull squeeze.

 

[sufandu]

Talent is a problem. Not one player would start for our 2009 team when Marrone took over.

Hyperbole. None of Marrone's teams played anyone as good as this Louisville team either.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Hyperbole. None of Marrone's teams played anyone as good as this Louisville team either.

Not talking production, talking talent. Who from this team would you start over a 2009 D player? Maybe Slayton. Maybe Thomas. That is it. When the 2009 team had at least 9 position players (maybe all 11) that are better than the 2016 team, you have a talent issue.

 

[NineOneSeven]

If UConn scores 30+, we will officially know what to expect the rest of the way from this team.

 

[AgentOrange44]

I would bet on it. Dino Babers is a winner, he will get us there. He has given us the timetable and still people panic after the third freaking game. This offense will be flying in about a year and the defense will continue to improve as guys learn their roles and we fill every position with guys who are more physically suited for this defense. In the meantime we have a bunch of guys that chose to come to Syracuse and they are working their asses off. I am looking forward to them taking out some frustration on UConn this Saturday.

Couldn't agree more! Absolutely love Dino's plan. We're simply at a competitive disadvantage this year as the kids work to assimilate new schemes - it's kind of like everyone is a freshman, and we're going up against players with several years of experience in their respective systems. A couple weaker recruiting cycles are also coming home to roost, so it's kind of a double whammy effect. But there's lots of reasons to be optimistic about where we are headed.

 

[DoctorBombay]

Posted this in another thread; didn't want itto get lost in the noise.

What's Houston ranked right now? 6th. Anyone take a look at what their recruiting classes looked like the past several years? 2015: 92nd. 2014: 76th. 2013: 56th.

This year: 35th.

The recruiting ratings of their starting front 7:
Jerard Carter: 2 star
Ed Oliver: 5 star
Cameron Malveaux: 2 star

LBs:
Tyus Bowser: 3 star
Matthew Adams: 3 star
Steven Taylor: 2 star
D'Juan Hines: 2 star

Most of them are 3+ years into the program. Only one, Ed Oliver, is an underclassman (and highly rated).

If anyone wants to read up on their bios, here's the link: UHCOUGARS.com :: University of Houston Official Athletic Site :: Football

The point of this post? 1st, to defend these kids. S T with the "lack of talent" crap. Most of our guys are 1-2 years into SU, and they've already have had to deal with 2 coaching staffs, two totally differing defensive schemes, and lots of injuries. Our kids, coming out of high school, pretty much match what Houston's got, and, as we can all see, Houston doesn't suck. 2nd. Implementing a new D and a new O is traumatic. Sht's gonna happen. They're ALL learning (including the staff). So, for those btching about how much we suck, cut them some goddamn slack. It's going to be a train wreck, interspersed with flashes of what this team will become by 2018. BE PATIENT and a bit more understanding of what's happened, and what's going on with these boys.

 

[CanadianSU]

Musing ?

The only thing that will save us is an invocation to the muses !!!

(anyone take first year Greek mythology ?) lol

 

[orangeinjersey]

Hyperbole. None of Marrone's teams played anyone as good as this Louisville team either.

I don't like this excuse, we played who was on the schedule. We could take this back and forth even further, marrone didn't have any facility upgrades, see what I did there?

 

[cuse309]

Talent is a problem. Not one player would start for our 2009 team when Marrone took over.

Really? Dungey wouldn't start over Paulus? Etta Tawo wouldn't start? I know that team had Mike Williams, but c'mon

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Really? Dungey wouldn't start over Paulus? Etta Tawo wouldn't start? I know that team had Mike Williams, but c'mon

This is a thread on defense.

 

[721Comstock]

This is a thread on defense.

So it has a lot of holes in it?

/rimshot.

 

[GoCuse14]

Talent is a problem. Not one player would start for our 2009 team when Marrone took over.

Wrong