NBA Thread 2020-21 Season

[Day2]

I mean, yeah, of course Butler receiving first team votes helped him make it lol. That is pretty nuts though. I can only assume it must have been some of the advanced stats guys; Butler's metrics were through the roof this year.

At any rate, Tatum receiving votes at guard (if he did; we don't actually know the split by position as far as I know) would help. It's not like the NBA says Tatum had 69 points at forward and 65 at guard, and therefore he ended up with just 69 points at forward. They add up the player's total votes and then pretend they all came from the position that they received the most votes in.

Simple fact is that voters could list Tatum at guard or forward and they simply didn't vote for him at either. Even if you removed all of Butler's 1st team votes, and kept Tatum's 1st team votes (which are also ridiculous), Butler still would have made it over Tatum.

I understand the argument that he maybe should have received more votes than Butler, but that's a totally different argument than saying the system itself screwed him, which it didn't.

Also, again, Butler is in the same boat as Tatum where he's listed at both guard and forward. I would bet that Butler received more votes at guard than Tatum did; if anything, Butler's eligibility at guard might have ultimately been the reason he ended up with more votes than Tatum because I think voters were much more likely to treat Butler as a guard than Tatum and guard was the weaker position this year.

If a player is eligible at multiple positions and the NBA combines the votes, then they should take it a step further and put the players with the most votes wherever they fit. Butler, George, and Tatum should have all made it over Irving, with one of them at guard.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Jazz looked slow, timid and weak in the second half last night.

Also, Clarkson's shot selection makes Alan Griffin look disciplined, in comparison.

What upset me the most down the stretch was that the Jazz finally had some success driving the ball and got it down to four with possession, but then threw up a couple really bad 3's to basically end the game. Friday could be ugly.

 

[Melancer46]

If a player is eligible at multiple positions and the NBA combines the votes, then they should take it a step further and put the players with the most votes wherever they fit. Butler, George, and Tatum should have all made it over Irving, with one of them at guard.

I think that would be fine, though at this point I kinda wonder if it would just make more sense to not have positions anymore.

At any rate, Tatum shouldn't have even been eligible for votes at guard in the first place. He spends the vast majority of his minutes at SF or PF at this point.

 

[Day2]

I think that would be fine, though at this point I kinda wonder if it would just make more sense to not have positions anymore.

At any rate, Tatum shouldn't have even been eligible for votes at guard in the first place. He spends the vast majority of his minutes at SF or PF at this point.

Yeah, Tatum at guard is weird. I’m all for eliminating positions, or maybe require one guard, one forward, one center, and two flex spots.

 

[Newhouser]

Just interested in the Board's feelings on Simmons? He impacts the game but always leaves me wanting more especially in terms of actual buckets and FT's. What's he make 35 million per? Sort of glad that isn't my team carrying that contract.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

What upset me the most down the stretch was that the Jazz finally had some success driving the ball and got it down to four with possession, but then threw up a couple really bad 3's to basically end the game. Friday could be ugly.

I feel like the Jazz training staff and front office could look a LOT different next season if they don't rally and get to the WCF.

Also, what's with the Jazz and sucking when another team's best player is out? I swear their win % has got to be terrible when they face shorthanded teams. Just seems like they blow it way too often. It's weird.

 

[MikeSU02]

Just interested in the Board's feelings on Simmons? He impacts the game but always leaves me wanting more especially in terms of actual buckets and FT's. What's he make 35 million per? Sort of glad that isn't my team carrying that contract.

I get why non-max guys get the max, you have to give it to who you have (to an extent). But I just don't know how valuable anyone is in the NBA if they cannot shoot at all.

I dont care if he is out there with three shooters and Embiid (who can shoot), you are still giving the other team a way out on D and it's magnified in the playoffs.

The FTs on top of it all are just devastating.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Just interested in the Board's feelings on Simmons? He impacts the game but always leaves me wanting more especially in terms of actual buckets and FT's. What's he make 35 million per? Sort of glad that isn't my team carrying that contract.

He bothers me. I don't like him. It's not rationale. Something about him offends me.

 

[Melancer46]

I get why non-max guys get the max, you have to give it to who you have (to an extent). But I just don't know how valuable anyone is in the NBA if they cannot shoot at all.

I dont care if he is out there with three shooters and Embiid (who can shoot), you are still giving the other team a way out on D and it's magnified in the playoffs.

The FTs on top of it all are just devastating.

I think it's one thing if they can't shoot, but Simmons basically can't score in the halfcourt at all and if you're going to be a player like that, you have to at least be the primary creator for your team and the offense runs through Embiid now so it just really makes him a liability offensively.

Like Rubio for example similarly struggles as a shooter and isn't very good creating his own shot around the rim either, but when he was a +/- darling, his teams put the ball in his hands and let him run the team, get everyone else in the right positions, etc. Simmons can't really offer that with how Embiid-centric the team has become (and for good reason, he's obviously an incredible player).

Edit: "Similarly struggles as a shooter" probably isn't the correct phrase. Rubio is a bad shooter. Simmons literally doesn't shoot the ball.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

I feel like the Jazz training staff and front office could look a LOT different next season if they don't rally and get to the WCF.

Also, what's with the Jazz and sucking when another team's best player is out? I swear their win % has got to be terrible when they face shorthanded teams. Just seems like they blow it way too often. It's weird.

It's sad. The Conley injury is sad. Leaving your 3 time DPOY defending on the perimeter is sad when they should be fighting through screens to not have him defending more agile guys. Gobert has had minimal impact and he is 5 inches taller than anyone but because they are leaving him on an island he can't use his height properly to impact the game. Except for Clarkson, the bench which was so key all season has been outplayed. The 1st half wss great, except for the turnovers.

 

[shandeezy7]

Just interested in the Board's feelings on Simmons? He impacts the game but always leaves me wanting more especially in terms of actual buckets and FT's. What's he make 35 million per? Sort of glad that isn't my team carrying that contract.

In a pivotal game 5 last night, he took exactly one shot in 20+ minutes of playing time in the second half. No one getting paid at that level should ever have a stat like that in a playoff game (or any game, really).

 

[Cusefan0307]

Ben Simmons is a healthier, bigger, worse shooting MCW.

Late to this thread as it’s been a busy morning, but he’s JAG. Can’t believe everyone and their brother was comparing him the Lebron 5 years ago. He’s the same player he was at LSU.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I think Atlanta closes this out in game 6. They got nothing from Capela, Huerter and Bogdanovic and still won yesterday. Have to think all 3 play much better in game 6.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

It's sad. The Conley injury is sad. Leaving your 3 time DPOY defending on the perimeter is sad when they should be fighting through screens to not have him defending more agile guys. Gobert has had minimal impact and he is 5 inches taller than anyone but because they are leaving him on an island he can't use his height properly to impact the game. Except for Clarkson, the bench which was so key all season has been outplayed. The 1st half wss great, except for the turnovers.

I want to know how the training staff/FO is screwing up communication on the injuries so bad.

Mitchell isn't on the injury report, late scratch in game 1 against Memphis, immediately listed as playing the day after.

Conley listed as "questionable" game after game this series, meaning a 50/50 to play, isn't dressing, sounds like he maybe hasn't ever been close.

What the crap is that.

 

[Trueblue25]

Who goes after Zion if he leaves NO?

 

[chugg21]

Late to this thread as it’s been a busy morning, but he’s JAG. Can’t believe everyone and their brother was comparing him the Lebron 5 years ago. He’s the same player he was at LSU.

It somewhat made sense then. He was pretty incredible at 18 running point at 6'10 averaging 19, 12 and 5. The bizarre thing with him is having not added anything to his game since then and still won't take jumpers. Don't think anyone in the world could have predicted he'd have 5 career 3 point makes through 4 years since I don't think anyone else has ever been this odd.

 

[chugg21]

Who goes after Zion if he leaves NO?

Think you're 2-3 years early with this First Take topic.

 

[Knicks411]

I think that would be fine, though at this point I kinda wonder if it would just make more sense to not have positions anymore.

At any rate, Tatum shouldn't have even been eligible for votes at guard in the first place. He spends the vast majority of his minutes at SF or PF at this point.

Pretty sure this is the answer.

Seems like it started when there were no good C (2016 Deandre Jordan first team all league???) but now the best players are relatively evenly distributed (as if that matters anyway). But its not like the All NBA team will be 5 PG or somehting

 

[Melancer46]

Who goes after Zion if he leaves NO?

Everybody?

 

[Melancer46]

Pretty sure this is the answer.

Seems like it started when there were no good C (2016 Deandre Jordan first team all league???) but now the best players are relatively evenly distributed (as if that matters anyway). But its not like the All NBA team will be 5 PG or somehting

Yeah, I don't really have a problem with them just doing the top 15 players regardless of position.

 

[Trueblue25]

Think you're 2-3 years early with this First Take topic.

Only asking because BR’s sending notifications about his family wanting him out. Lord knows Zion listens to his Mom

 

[Knicks411]

It somewhat made sense then. He was pretty incredible at 18 running point at 6'10 averaging 19, 12 and 5. The bizarre thing with him is having not added anything to his game since then and still won't take jumpers. Don't think anyone in the world could have predicted he'd have 5 career 3 point makes through 4 years since I don't think anyone else has ever been this odd.

It makes no sense really. In this day and age, you have to actively try and not develop a 3 point shot.

Remember Quincy Acy from Baylor? Power forward, inside guy, dunked all the time? He's not in the league anymore, but he ended his career as a corner 3 specialist. He took 80% of his shots in his final NBA season (made 35%) from 3! He's just a random guy I remember from the Knicks. Everyone can shoot 3's now. Except Ben Simmons

 

[OttoinGrotto]

It makes no sense really. In this day and age, you have to actively try and not develop a 3 point shot.

Remember Quincy Acy from Baylor? Power forward, inside guy, dunked all the time? He's not in the league anymore, but he ended his career as a corner 3 specialist. He took 80% of his shots in his final NBA season (made 35%) from 3! He's just a random guy I remember from the Knicks. Everyone can shoot 3's now. Except Ben Simmons

Well that's because Simmons is a special talent.

 

[Cusefan0307]

It makes no sense really. In this day and age, you have to actively try and not develop a 3 point shot.

Remember Quincy Acy from Baylor? Power forward, inside guy, dunked all the time? He's not in the league anymore, but he ended his career as a corner 3 specialist. He took 80% of his shots in his final NBA season (made 35%) from 3! He's just a random guy I remember from the Knicks. Everyone can shoot 3's now. Except Ben Simmons

Forget 3’s, he can’t even shoot a 10 footer.

 

[Newhouser]

In a pivotal game 5 last night, he took exactly one shot in 20+ minutes of playing time in the second half. No one getting paid at that level should ever have a stat like that in a playoff game (or any game, really).

and it wasn't just him but the D the Sixers played in the 4th - Thybault and Simmons and others and the Hawks scored on what 20 of 22 possessions? I mean come on - get a stop.