NBA Thread 2022-23 Season

[OrangeDW]

So I’ve thought about this for a bit and I’m starting to like the trade for Dallas. Why? Let me lay out the logic

Preface: odds are this doesn’t work and may actually blow up in their face

-having said that:

They had zero chance at going anywhere this year. None

Kyrie is a super talented player who, if he’s bought in for just a few months, can certainly shift the tide of power in the conference. He could also sink the ship, but who cares if you have no shot this year anyway , AND you have no commitment to him beyond this year.

So I like it in so much as it’s a high variance play. Gives you a much higher ceiling at the cost of a lower floor. But who cares how low the floor is when you’ve got no shot otherwise?

As far as two ball dominant guards not being a fit…we were told that about harden and Paul and that actually worked extremely well and could have resulted in a championship had Paul not gotten injured

This “can’t have two ball dominant guys”….did they forget that LeBron and Kyrie won a championship together?

I’m sure Kyrie will do something weird within a couple years and it will end bad, but in the meanwhile they’re as dangerous of a team to play as there is.

 

[Newhouser]

So I’ve thought about this for a bit and I’m starting to like the trade for Dallas. Why? Let me lay out the logic

Preface: odds are this doesn’t work and may actually blow up in their face

-having said that:

They had zero chance at going anywhere this year. None

Kyrie is a super talented player who, if he’s bought in for just a few months, can certainly shift the tide of power in the conference. He could also sink the ship, but who cares if you have no shot this year anyway , AND you have no commitment to him beyond this year.

So I like it in so much as it’s a high variance play. Gives you a much higher ceiling at the cost of a lower floor. But who cares how low the floor is when you’ve got no shot otherwise?

As far as two ball dominant guards not being a fit…we were told that about harden and Paul and that actually worked extremely well and could have resulted in a championship had Paul not gotten injured

Exactly. They weren't winning anything as constructed why not take a flyer on Kyrie. They had to run it by Luka right?

 

[OrangeDW]

Davis and Westbrook for Durant….who says no?

 

[Melancer46]

Davis and Westbrook for Durant….who says no?

Brooklyn of course

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

and could have resulted in a championship had Paul not gotten injured

People keep saying that, forgetting that GS was not fully healthy either. If they were, they probably win that series in 5.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

This “can’t have two ball dominant guys”….did they forget that LeBron and Kyrie won a championship together?

I’m sure Kyrie will do something weird within a couple years and it will end bad, but in the meanwhile they’re as dangerous of a team to play as there is.

LeBron’s greatness is that he won with Kyrie and with JR Smith.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Every night with the Knicks is a new adventure

This is a fun one


Curry and Jokic are easy ones. Giannis is a very interesting debate. Dame? Not sure

Nets is an interesting one; Durant is obviously the best player to ever play for the Nets, but Kidd played there for so long. Plus Dr. J if we're including ABA (which why shouldn't we?)

Wilt Chamberlain might disagree.

 

[NYCCuse826]

LeBron’s greatness is that he won with Kyrie and with JR Smith.

LeBron doesn't win that title without Kyrie. We'll never see two elite players in sync like that when it mattered for a long time.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

LeBron doesn't win that title without Kyrie. We'll never see two elite players in sync like that when it mattered for a long time.

LBJ kept him mentally in tune. No one can question how good Kyrie his.

 

[Knicks411]

People keep saying that, forgetting that GS was not fully healthy either. If they were, they probably win that series in 5.

Just Iguodala right? I get it, he's a very good player, but that was the only one right? And the Rockets were up 3-2 before Chris Paul, one of the best PG ever, went down.

Both teams were hurt by injuries, which seems to happen every playoffs. But to the larger point of can two ball dominant players succeed together, that Rockets team came the closest that anyone did to beating the Warriors of that era.

I predict the Kyrie in Dallas thing won't end very well. But that is mainly because the team they already had around Luka wasn't very good.

 

[NYCCuse826]

Tsai's hate for Kyrie will set off a chain reaction across the league. An owner this petty and short sighted should not be in this business. Durant, Harden and Irving are all well liked among their peers. They're seeing how they all bolted or wanted out under his regime. Good luck attracting elite talent. He wanted a team that he was proud of even if they struggled to get in the play in game and he's going to get it after KD asks out.

 

[MikeSU02]

This “can’t have two ball dominant guys”….did they forget that LeBron and Kyrie won a championship together?

I’m sure Kyrie will do something weird within a couple years and it will end bad, but in the meanwhile they’re as dangerous of a team to play as there is.

Kyrie has played off ball for a while, at least part time. Literally since Cleveland.

He was second ball handler once Bron came back, second ball handler to Harden and without question, is second ball handler behind Luka.

They checked with Luka before the trade and if they want to give him a contract (assuming he doesn’t want the two year extension but the four year contract that can’t be given out til the summer), Luka will have sign off.

This is a Hail Mary by Cuban bc of how mismanaged the roster has been, plus Nico having a connection with Kyrie back from Nike days, they prob think he’ll be fine in Dallas.

We’ll see. Luka is good enough that Kyrie just has to keep it together the remainder of this season for them to have a legit shot.

Also, Mavs are already trying to move Wood. That dude is purely radioactive.

 

[MikeSU02]

Kyrie has played off ball for a while, at least part time. Literally since Cleveland.

He was second ball handler once Bron came back, second ball handler to Harden and without question, is second ball handler behind Luka.

They checked with Luka before the trade and if they want to give him a contract (assuming he doesn’t want the two year extension but the four year contract that can’t be given out til the summer), Luka will have sign off.

This is a Hail Mary by Cuban bc of how mismanaged the roster has been, plus Nico having a connection with Kyrie back from Nike days, they prob think he’ll be fine in Dallas.

We’ll see. Luka is good enough that Kyrie just has to keep it together the remainder of this season for them to have a legit shot.

Also, Mavs are already trying to move Wood. That dude is purely radioactive.

To be clear, I am banking on Kyrie going off the rails. But Cuban knows that the roster is so bad and they are so limited, he had to try something.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

 

[jncuse]

Davis and Westbrook for Durant….who says no?

To make the contracts work Brooklyn would also need to give up Harris and one of Curry or Mills.

I think Brooklyn says no.
Davis is younger, but Durant is healthier and may have as many near peak years left.

Westbrook doesn't really add value -- I would say Westbrook for Harris+Mills is not far from a draw

 

[jncuse]

Someone had mentioned earlier this was a high risk / low reward trade. I don't fully agree with that assessment.

This potentially is a high reward move. Kyrie is a lunatic, but he is also still one of the great players in the league in the odd times his head is not squarely up his ass. Its possible you can get good Kyrie for a run or two, and that could pay off.

Is it high risk? Yes, but not because of the trade assets they gave in my view.
The draft pick is in 2029 - Dinwiddie and DFS are nice players but that package is not going to set the franchise way back.

The risk is Kyrie is a lunatic right away, or that he behaves this year and then you are forced into giving him a long term contract which is scary.

Kyrie could certainly irk Luka at any time. But I think the team as it stood with no Kyrie, probably was irking Luka as well.

I think it was worth the risk for Dallas for this year - but as I said, the scariest part is if Kyrie behaves this year then you have to extend him.

 

[jncuse]

I heard that the Lakers did offer up two future first rounders (27+29) for Irving.

Assume the deal would have been something like Irving+Mills(or Curry) to match for Westbrook and two picks.

Assuming Brooklyn was in win now mode, the extra pick probably did not sway them.

If your Brooklyn, would you rather have
Dinwiddie, DFS, Mills
or
Westbrook

Or maybe Brooklyn just said screw Kyrie, he is not getting his way.

 

[jordville]

Suns offered CP3 and others for Kyrie...

 

[OrangeDW]

I heard that the Lakers did offer up two future first rounders (27+29) for Irving.

Assume the deal would have been something like Irving+Mills(or Curry) to match for Westbrook and two picks.

Assuming Brooklyn was in win now mode, the extra pick probably did not sway them.

If your Brooklyn, would you rather have
Dinwiddie, DFS, Mills
or
Westbrook

Or maybe Brooklyn just said screw Kyrie, he is not getting his way.

Everybody is against us! Going back to the Chris Paul veto!

* I was secretly hoping we’d get Kyrie, win it all this year, then he’d act like he always does and we’d trade everybody next summer….

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Just Iguodala right? I get it, he's a very good player, but that was the only one right? And the Rockets were up 3-2 before Chris Paul, one of the best PG ever, went down.

Both teams were hurt by injuries, which seems to happen every playoffs. But to the larger point of can two ball dominant players succeed together, that Rockets team came the closest that anyone did to beating the Warriors of that era.

I predict the Kyrie in Dallas thing won't end very well. But that is mainly because the team they already had around Luka wasn't very good.

Warriors were up 2-1 when Iguodala went out, including a win on the road. Both wins were blow outs. The Rockets would have quit after GSW went up 3-1, had Iggy played.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

Everybody is against us! Going back to the Chris Paul veto!

* I was secretly hoping we’d get Kyrie, win it all this year, then he’d act like he always does and we’d trade everybody next summer….

LeBron’s goin’ for 50 Tuesday night.

 

[Newhouser]

So who does Phoenix have to send to get KD? Same players plus who?

 

[jncuse]

It was crazy. Toronto ended up with 27 more FG attempts than Utah and still lost by three. So many times they had three or four shots in a possession due to their 25 total offensive boards. I feel bad for Raptors fans this year as they still play hard and have some great talent. Be real interesting to see what moves they make.

They are certainly going to make moves -- some at the deadline and probably some in the summer.

The team is talent but just seems dysfunctional and not happy with each other. Nick "Thibodeau" Nurse likes to play is his starters too many minutes and plays an overhelp, overchallenge defensive system that takes so much energy from the players and is not particularly efficient.

FVV is not great PG. And while Siakam, Barnes, OG are all different they run similar type of plays when they get the ball. Dribble, dribble, dribble, Try to get a double team, if not Siakam drives and does his spin roll barnes does a push shot, OG bullies... or they take a jumper if they can't create those shots. Too much of the same thing. Its just not working.

That 48 win season last year made you think there was something to build on, especially with all the picks. Perhaps they should have been more serious to go after Mitchell.

Siakam, FVV, OG were a talented young trio coming out of the 2019 champions that had been acquired for cheap (23rd, 27th, undrafted). Barnes was a nice audition. The problem is all these guys have done enough to seek $30M contracts soon (or already there)-- it just not working.

OG Anunoby seems like one of the more attractive assets at the deadline. He asked to be traded. But apparently he wants more usage, and I'm not sure he gets that. He is an elite 3+D player...probably the most elite in the entire league. But when he tries to expand his offence the analytics are not very good.

If he sticks to 3+D, he can certainly be the finishing piece for a team. He would be a great get and fit for Memphis, but Raptors don't have to move him now either.

 

[jncuse]

So who does Phoenix have to send to get KD? Same players plus who?

If Durant did not ask to get traded rrecently, I really doubt Brooklyn entertains any offers for him now. Probably wait to the summer.