ND AD Says D1 Breakup is Inevitable | Page 8 | Syracusefan.com

ND AD Says D1 Breakup is Inevitable

If playing college football no longer requires the player to be enrolled and completing a college degree, it is de facto no longer “college football.” The academic schools should do everything possible to reinforce this narrative.
Yet the Football Grifters need the kids tied to the universities for branding and a loyal fan base. Otherwise paying 19 year olds to play a game for some random made up team sponsored by some billionaire and endorsed by the NFL will draw flies like the G league.
 
Yet the Football Grifters need the kids tied to the universities for branding and a loyal fan base. Otherwise paying 19 year olds to play a game for some random made up team sponsored by some billionaire and endorsed by the NFL will draw flies like the G league.
Exactly. Lost in all the rhetoric about how the players are responsible for the popularity of college football and the money coming in, is the fact that there is so much loyalty to the schools from the fans. When a player transfers, the fans don't follow them to the new school, they stay with the school. This is more of a symbiotic relationship than people have acknowledged. The schools have given the athletes the vehicle. If they just went to a semipro league, nobody would care about them until/unless they made it to the NFL.
 
Exactly. Lost in all the rhetoric about how the players are responsible for the popularity of college football and the money coming in, is the fact that there is so much loyalty to the schools from the fans. When a player transfers, the fans don't follow them to the new school, they stay with the school. This is more of a symbiotic relationship than people have acknowledged. The schools have given the athletes the vehicle. If they just went to a semipro league, nobody would care about them until/unless they made it to the NFL.
Exactly. That’s why IMO, if an entire of smaller, academic institutions are left out of the pay for play league, those schools should do everything possible to reinforce the concept of athletics tied to education. They don’t have to go full Ivy League mode, but make it clear that these are students first, with athletic scholarships. Not professional athletes.
 
Exactly. That’s why IMO, if an entire of smaller, academic institutions are left out of the pay for play league, those schools should do everything possible to reinforce the concept of athletics tied to education. They don’t have to go full Ivy League mode, but make it clear that these are students first, with athletic scholarships. Not professional athletes.
Schools can and should do certain things to keep control on this. First, they should make the players student athletes and employees as through an employment contract they can exercise a degree of control
 
Yet the Football Grifters need the kids tied to the universities for branding and a loyal fan base. Otherwise paying 19 year olds to play a game for some random made up team sponsored by some billionaire and endorsed by the NFL will draw flies like the G league.
And that is what is going to happen, the first few years these schools will make a lot of money. But reality will set in that this is semi pro, and no where near the NFL. There will be half the 40+ schools with losing records. Fans will tune out, ratings will go down, and then tv and streaming will dry up.
 
And that is what is going to happen, the first few years these schools will make a lot of money. But reality will set in that this is semi pro, and no where near the NFL. There will be half the 40+ schools with losing records. Fans will tune out, ratings will go down, and then tv and streaming will dry up.
I've said that too

If you bring in the Top 32 or 40 Brands into an insular, exclusive club the records of teams will resemble more like the NFL. How will those Bama and Ohio State fans feel with 4 straight years at around .500%?

This exclusive club will put rules in place to promote parity...salary caps (or should I say NIL caps) and wait until the portal draft happens.
 
Great thread. Personally I have no sympathy for the schools (and its governing body the NCAA) or fans who are bummed that the players, who create the product, are now getting rewarded in a real way.. This train has been barreling down on the system for years, and blame falls on the greed, egos, and incompetence of the adults who sat idle and did nothing except to cry "woe is me, the glory of college sports is ruined forever". Pleeeeeaaaassse - this has been a big business since the 70's at least for everyone but the players. The UNC scandal outed the fraud of the "free education" piece, and the players and their handlers are now demanding more. The gravy train is over and schools need to decide what they are and then fans will have to do the same self-assessment.

The earlier post on gambling was on the mark - the sport is thriving because of the gambling involved. Reduced interest in live sports, lack of even competition, time commitment, costs, are all having a much bigger negative impact on the sport than the "I refuse to support it because now it's professional crowd". To me that is faux outrage that I don't understand.

Not sure how it plays out but I have been pretty solid in saying that in 20 years SU's football and sports programs outside of basketball look more like Colgate than Clemson.
 
Those people were clueless or intentionally ignorant. I and others said this is nearly exactly what would happen. And I'm no insider.
There are a lot of naïve people out there.

I wonder if the players are happy with what has happened so far?

I wonder how they will view things 5 or 10 years down the road?

The scumbag boosters who live to try and buy their teams championships are the winners here.

I hope they all bid themselves into bankruptcy.
 
How would you feel if you are John and Laura Lally or any of the other donors for the athletics campaign if a few years later it is for a deemphasized athletics program? So much money pumping into the dome from the state, JMA wireless etc. Syracuse seems to really be trying to compete, it would be a lot of wasted doe for a glorified high school club situation!
I would feel terrible but I think through the rubble of this decision IMO we will have the contours of a reasonable athletic alliance with other like minded schools that won't be spending cap ex on athletic salaries to support programs.

I am not saying this is the end of athletics period at SU. I am saying that it's the end of us being on par with the football heavyweights. I would be shocked in say 2040 we are playing the likes of NC State/Clemson/Louisville in any capacity. I think the end of us going to a bowl and seeing Auburn or Houston will be forever over.

This may be the best thing ever because we'll align geographically and educationally with the schools that make the most sense. Just saying we won't be the same thing as an Alabama.
 
There are a lot of naïve people out there.

I wonder if the players are happy with what has happened so far?

I wonder how they will view things 5 or 10 years down the road?

The scumbag boosters who live to try and buy their teams championships are the winners here.

I hope they all bid themselves into bankruptcy.
I think the players at those programs are probably happy because they're gonna get paid. I think boosters will try to find ways to keep things even enough that everyone stays relatively happy. It'll be interesting to see what things look like in 5-10 years. I anticipate I won't be paying as much attention to college sports. Just like I don't pay as much attention now as I did 10-15 years ago. To be fair, that's not all because of the landscape changes, but they have certainly contributed.
 
I think the players at those programs are probably happy because they're gonna get paid. I think boosters will try to find ways to keep things even enough that everyone stays relatively happy. It'll be interesting to see what things look like in 5-10 years. I anticipate I won't be paying as much attention to college sports. Just like I don't pay as much attention now as I did 10-15 years ago. To be fair, that's not all because of the landscape changes, but they have certainly contributed.
Alabama made $100 million, so each of their players gets $1 million.

Wait until the Rutgers and UConn players get their bills for last season. I hope they all have good lawyers.
 
I would feel terrible but I think through the rubble of this decision IMO we will have the contours of a reasonable athletic alliance with other like minded schools that won't be spending cap ex on athletic salaries to support programs.

I am not saying this is the end of athletics period at SU. I am saying that it's the end of us being on par with the football heavyweights. I would be shocked in say 2040 we are playing the likes of NC State/Clemson/Louisville in any capacity. I think the end of us going to a bowl and seeing Auburn or Houston will be forever over.

This may be the best thing ever because we'll align geographically and educationally with the schools that make the most sense. Just saying we won't be the same thing as an Alabama.
Do you think NC State and Louisville will fall amongst the heavyweights when things split and the dust settles? I wouldn't have put them there. Then again, I hadn't really thought about the specifics of who would end up where.
 
Alabama made $100 million, so each of their players gets $1 million.

Wait until the Rutgers and UConn players get their bills for last season. I hope they all have good lawyers.
Oh, let me clarify. Things will be even enough within a given team (olineman make enough to keep from being ticked that the QB makes more), not from team to team.
 
Do you think NC State and Louisville will fall amongst the heavyweights when things split and the dust settles? I wouldn't have put them there. Then again, I hadn't really thought about the specifics of who would end up where.

I think it comes down to the investment of the players and the appropriate salaries. I look at who will want to make the plunge. I'm just cherry picking two larger state schools we play yearly. I have no idea what their motivation is.

I do think we'll be aligned with our private school brethren in the future which will be good academically for Syracuse. We should want to be as close as possible to BC/ND/Ivy's.

I look at BC w their terrible recent record in big time sports. Their application pool was ~45k this year. It didn't impact the educational push to attend BC by 1%. The school will look at it as a reason to never ever push forward into a pay for play model unless things change drastically
 
Oh, let me clarify. Things will be even enough within a given team (olineman make enough to keep from being ticked that the QB makes more), not from team to team.
When some of these schools lose their tax exempt status as an educational school, they will change their mind. The sham of student athletes will be completely gone, and the tax man will get millions of dollars
 
If they used a 50k attendance and $50k minimum pay per player then you could get it down to about 40 schools.

AAC- None

ACC
Yes- Clemson, VA Tech, NC State, FSU
Probably- UNC, Louisville
Maybe- UVA

B12
Yes- Iowa State, WV, Okie State, Texas Tech, BYU
Maybe- K State

B1G
Yes- Michigan, Penn State, Ohio State, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Michigan State, Iowa, Purdue

CUSA- None

Indy
Yes- Notre Dame

MAC- None

MWC- None

P12
Yes- Washington, USC, Oregon, UCLA
Probably- Colorado, Arizona State

SEC
Yes- Bama, LSU, A&M, Texas, Oklahoma, UGA, Tennessee, Auburn, Florida, South Carolina, Miss State, Mizzou, Kentucky, Arkansas, Ole Miss

Sunbelt- None


That cuts it to 37-43 teams. Poor P12 schools would have a lot of travel.
You need to put UVa and ND in the "No" group because the "play for pay" division will not require players to go to class and that's a mile-wide Red Line that won't be crossed by either. UVa football no longer has the boosters willing to write big checks that basketball has. There was one, but he died. It took a really long while for an anonymous alum to put up $40M toward the new football building, while Paul Tudor Jones readily stepped forward with his checkbook to build the b-ball arena.

I'm not 100% sold on UCLA, Purdue, or Wisconsin as being in the "play for pay" division, especially if the players don't have to go to class.
 
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So far not discussed are the ramifications of no longer having an 85 scholarship limit in the new era of semi-pro ball.
I do not think this will be an issue if a division of college football truly becomes a minor professional league. I would see there being a union of the players just like in the NFL and a CBA that limits the number of players on a team. I also would not be surprised if there were multi-year contracts to stop college free agency, I mean transfers.

The real question is whether an age limit/eligibility restriction will be in place or will guys be able to play in "college" football into their 30s?
 
The issue is why wouldn't the semi pro football school also want a semi pro BBall division? Then does SU join just BBall? Both? Neither?
That won't be allowed. The semi-pro division members will want "all or nothing" for football, both basketballs, and baseball/softball in order to protect their investment. That would also cut out Duke.
 
I’ll think players are okay with the system as it is developing because, as someone said, they think they’ll get paid. Also, we have so diluted the value of an education, that the fee bucks they can make means more to them than a degree, a career and an educational accomplishment.

I have never watched a G League game, and likely never will.

I follow/support Syracuse athletics because it is my alma mater, not because I am so enamored with any particular set of athletes.

If pay for play is a thing, and SU is a part, they become nothing more than the Syracuse Chiefs to me - namely folks playing a sport who hope I am interested.

If this shakes out, and SU is relegated to the level of Colgate instead of Clemson, I’m okay with that.
 
Hope they are withholding federal and state taxes from the player’s money - doubt these kids are saving money from their proceeds to pay it. These players will need accountants unless their NIL deals include those services.

I find it highly unlikely any of the "charities" that are funneling money into NIL recruiting would pay a player as an employee and be subject to employment regulations, as well as the employer portion of social security and medicare taxes.
 
There are a lot of naïve people out there.

I wonder if the players are happy with what has happened so far?

I wonder how they will view things 5 or 10 years down the road?

The scumbag boosters who live to try and buy their teams championships are the winners here.

I hope they all bid themselves into bankruptcy.
One aspect where loyal student-athletes are suffering is the Transfer Portal where teams quickly bench their players in favor of guys they bring in from the portal. You have a guy who pays his dues and then a different guy who thumbed their nose at the school the 1st time around jumps right ahead of them after not starting at their factory.
 
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Exactly. Lost in all the rhetoric about how the players are responsible for the popularity of college football and the money coming in, is the fact that there is so much loyalty to the schools from the fans. When a player transfers, the fans don't follow them to the new school, they stay with the school. This is more of a symbiotic relationship than people have acknowledged. The schools have given the athletes the vehicle. If they just went to a semipro league, nobody would care about them until/unless they made it to the NFL.

This is a point I have made as well. There is a G-League team within 25 minutes of my house. I have never been to a game. This season, I have been to a game at my undergrad alma mater (2 hour drive), a game at Syracuse (a flight), and two tournament games for my undergrad alma mater (1.5 hour drive). I have no connection to the G-League team even though it is connected to my state's NBA team (which I only casually follow).

In football, I have season tickets to the NFL team 25 minutes away and typically get to one game a year at my undergrad and one Syracuse game every three to four years. If Syracuse and Wisconsin go to the pro model, I am not sure how much I am going to care. Without a draft, the southern teams are still going to be dominant in recruiting talent so I don't see either team truly challenging for a National Title.

So, at what point does the football team just become a minor league team playing in the cities I went to school? As my attention gets further stretched by other options, probably not long. When I was in school, I watched a lot of college football. I remember spending 10 hours at Tully's on a Saturday (of course, I had friends in my program from Notre Dame, Nebraska, Colorado, and FSU, so there were a lot of games to watch). Now, I watch (sometimes after the fact on the DVR) Syracuse and Wisconsin. In the end, I just do not see myself spending time and money watching a inferior professional product if the connection to my alma maters is tenuous.
 
I’ll think players are okay with the system as it is developing because, as someone said, they think they’ll get paid. Also, we have so diluted the value of an education, that the fee bucks they can make means more to them than a degree, a career and an educational accomplishment.

I have never watched a G League game, and likely never will.

I follow/support Syracuse athletics because it is my alma mater, not because I am so enamored with any particular set of athletes.

If pay for play is a thing, and SU is a part, they become nothing more than the Syracuse Chiefs to me - namely folks playing a sport who hope I am interested.

If this shakes out, and SU is relegated to the level of Colgate instead of Clemson, I’m okay with that.
Agree with your whole post. I love SU sports because 1)I grew up there, and 2)I did both my undergrad and grad work at SU. Still, my greatest love for SU has to do, not with sports, but the education I received and how it affected my career and thus my life. I may have Ernie Davis' autograph on my desk but the diploma on my wall is more meaningful.

College basketball is fast becoming the equivalent of the Syracuse Chiefs...aren't they the Syracuse Mets now?...or perhaps even a A or AA team. By that, I mean that the roster turns over at an accelerated rate as does a minor league baseball roster. Players who stay in one place for 4 years are becoming dinosaurs.

My grand-niece competed in a sport at SU. They got shockingly little funding and in fact the women had to pay for a number of things out of their own pockets. But they loved their sport and were all excellent students. My grand-niece got her degree from The Maxwell School. There is a kind of purity in that which has long since left the "money sports" and will evaporate entirely before long.

Even if SU does not end up falling into the "pro league" of universities, they will still be impacted. The times, they are a' changing as Bob Dylan so eloquently described bigtime college athletics...or perhaps he was referring to other things. He has always been kind of vague on that in those few (no) occasions when he and I have actually spoken.
 

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