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Notre Dame Gameday...

It's an issue of coaching and senior leadership.

What's the standard you're holding everyone else to? That you're holding yourself to?

How are you handling the little moments in practice and treating everything like game day. Every moment in a game matters. Every moment in practice should too. You need constant focus. The talent is not the issue here. Wanting to win isn't enough.

Winning takes work. No one's going to hand you a championship because you feel like "it's your year".

The issue has been laid bare all season (and the last few seasons imo). Plain to see and easy to fix if you put in the work. But the sun is setting on this season and this senior class and the issues persist. Not sure if they've shown they can turn it around in the time they have left. I hope they do.
 
I'm hoping we get away from the 2 middie lines getting equal runs. The lines aren't equals. It should be 2 for 1. In the fourth when we are down by 1 the 1st line needs to be in the game. The defense put their offense to sleep for a long stretch and the offense did nothing during that time. Quick shoots and turnovers seem to be the theme when the defense gets stops.

Defensively we are still struggling with communication on switches and picks. Bowen is going to have to step up with his physicality on ball. I still think that other than Chuck, Jake and Fig we are soft on ball and let guys get their hands free.

Does Dwan have the ability to get physical on ball? Haven't seen it. We will need someone that is physical on ball covering guys like Dom.
 
It's an issue of coaching and senior leadership.

What's the standard you're holding everyone else to? That you're holding yourself to?

How are you handling the little moments in practice and treating everything like game day. Every moment in a game matters. Every moment in practice should too. You need constant focus. The talent is not the issue here. Wanting to win isn't enough.

Winning takes work. No one's going to hand you a championship because you feel like "it's your year".

The issue has been laid bare all season (and the last few seasons imo). Plain to see and easy to fix if you put in the work. But the sun is setting on this season and this senior class and the issues persist. Not sure if they've shown they can turn it around in the time they have left. I hope they do.
I don't think you can blame it all on the Senior leadership. They've brought the program back from the brink over the last 4 years. These guys literally have been starting since they were Freshman. That's where we were at.

I harp on this a lot, but this time of year is won by younger leadership stepping up. They're not going to do the brunt of the work, but those 2-3 goals that your Freshman and Sophmore class can get in May are what will win you dog fights.

Where is the guy on offense who wants this team to be HIS next year. Besides Anderson maybe, we haven't seen anyone yet.
 
It's an issue of coaching and senior leadership.

What's the standard you're holding everyone else to? That you're holding yourself to?

How are you handling the little moments in practice and treating everything like game day. Every moment in a game matters. Every moment in practice should too. You need constant focus. The talent is not the issue here. Wanting to win isn't enough.

Winning takes work. No one's going to hand you a championship because you feel like "it's your year".

The issue has been laid bare all season (and the last few seasons imo). Plain to see and easy to fix if you put in the work. But the sun is setting on this season and this senior class and the issues persist. Not sure if they've shown they can turn it around in the time they have left. I hope they do.
These guys WORK and play through injury. They want to win as much as the fans.
 
I don't think you can blame it all on the Senior leadership. They've brought the program back from the brink over the last 4 years. These guys literally have been starting since they were Freshman. That's where we were at.

I harp on this a lot, but this time of year is won by younger leadership stepping up. They're not going to do the brunt of the work, but those 2-3 goals that your Freshman and Sophmore class can get in May are what will win you dog fights.

Where is the guy on offense who wants this team to be HIS next year. Besides Anderson maybe, we haven't seen anyone yet.

Certainly not blaming it all on senior leadership (there's a big "and coaching" right before it) :)

If anything, I will always blame coaching more than anything else. Coaches are adults and paid professionals. They should be able to push the team in the right direction, identify problems, and work to fix them. Really don't think that's happening here.

Players are just college kids.

But I do think as seniors, they're almost college graduates and should take some accountability. I hear you about the younger players, and they should find ways to step up. I do think it's hard to do when a senior class like this has such a large presence and prominent position on a team. Hard to ask an 18 or 19 year old kid to respectfully push a 22 year old who's been starting for 4 years to be better or different. Not that it can't happen, it's just hard.

The seniors set the tone. The younger players learn from them.
 
These guys WORK and play through injury. They want to win as much as the fans.

Of course, and at no point did I say they don't want to win. Obviously they do.

Just like they are obviously working hard. They wouldn't be on this team, and this team wouldn't be where it is, if they weren't working hard.

All I'm saying that the standard of work to win a national championship is insanely high. It will take a level of focus to win it all that the team has at times struggled with this season.

Turnovers and sloppy, careless play at times have been a topic of conversation on this board throughout the season by many, many posters. These will need to be cleaned up if they're to win the whole thing, and they still have some more work to put in to get that buttoned up.

This team has shown it has the talent and ability to win it all through some really incredible performances this season. But there's still room to get better and it's going to take more effort (beyond all the great work they've already done) to get there.
 
I really do not think some undisciplined moments are a sign that we have some next level kind of leadership problem. People zoom in on our sloppy moments and don't step back and realize that every team we play has guys making the exact same type of mistakes and undisciplined plays at a similar or higher rate than us. I am a broken record with this line, but it is hard as hell to play clean lacrosse for 4 quarters, and people here act like every other team has figured it out. If we had the amount of turnovers we had Saturday every game of the season, we would be a top 10 team in fewest turnovers per game. When one guy on our team flubs a pass, here it is an indictment of all our older leadership/staff and their mentality. Other teams do it and it is just some kind of fluke not worth reading into.

The O had a couple crucial turnovers in the second half that put a tired defense on the ropes. Yes those were frustrating as hell, yes you cannot afford that in the playoffs, but the main problem was still an atrocious day on the defensive end against a team that has struggled all season to put the ball in the cage. ND has only gone above 11 goals twice all year against non-scrubs and we were lucky they did not drop 20! That is insanely bad D from us compared to peer programs! We get nowhere without a 180 turnaround on that end in the upcoming games. Meanwhile UVA at home is the only other offense to put up 11 goals on this team all year! UNC and Duke just put up 11 goals on their D combined! I do not know how people watch our guys get cooked off the dodge left and right/slide all over the place and the chatter here is almost entirely about leadership coaching and discipline, with focus if anything on the other end of the field. Our lacking depth of athleticism at D, ssdm, and wing play is larger than any leadership issue IMO.
 
I really do not think some undisciplined moments are a sign that we have some next level kind of leadership problem. People zoom in on our sloppy moments and don't step back and realize that every team we play has guys making the exact same type of mistakes and undisciplined plays at a similar or higher rate than us. I am a broken record with this line, but it is hard as hell to play clean lacrosse for 4 quarters, and people here act like every other team has figured it out. If we had the amount of turnovers we had Saturday every game of the season, we would be a top 10 team in fewest turnovers per game. When one guy on our team flubs a pass, here it is an indictment of all our older leadership/staff and their mentality. Other teams do it and it is just some kind of fluke not worth reading into.

The O had a couple crucial turnovers in the second half that put a tired defense on the ropes. Yes those were frustrating as hell, yes you cannot afford that in the playoffs, but the main problem was still an atrocious day on the defensive end against a team that has struggled all season to put the ball in the cage. ND has only gone above 11 goals twice all year against non-scrubs and we were lucky they did not drop 20! That is insanely bad D from us compared to peer programs! We get nowhere without a 180 turnaround on that end in the upcoming games. Meanwhile UVA at home is the only other offense to put up 11 goals on this team all year! UNC and Duke just put up 11 goals on their D combined! I do not know how people watch our guys get cooked off the dodge left and right/slide all over the place and the chatter here is almost entirely about leadership coaching and discipline, with focus if anything on the other end of the field. Our lacking depth of athleticism at D, ssdm, and wing play is larger than any leadership issue IMO.
what's ironic is the defense was carrying the team in the 1st half of the season. on the internets anyway, the uva fanbase also can't help but point to turnovers committed as the flash point that needs correction.
- we proceeded to have 2 of our lowest turnover days and lost both games.
- years that the hoos' won championships in 2019 and 2021? highest turnover rate since tiffany arrived.
- it has been consistently between 14-16 per game since he got there. i don't suspect it'll change.

what uva lacrosse is doing, maybe different than 'cuse or others -- is trying to get teams to play that type of game. get them sped up. get them to be taking the bait a la loyola marymount basketball years ago. and the straight opposite of uva basketball under bennett. strangling games and taking care of the ball. it was very effective overall in his time.

what does that sound like? well, it sounds like b1g 10 lacrosse! what has worked in winning championships since the shot clock came on the scene? well, low scoring teams have need not apply.

so i'm past the turnovers. i get what we're doing. lars' obsession with causing cto's on the 6 v 6 d end has ramped up it seems, and that gives me some heartache. they don't seem able to or instructed to delineate at all and needlessly put themselves out of position and create offense. but it can be enough of an outlier for an opponent to face (just like uva hoops) that it can be effective on the right day.

notre dame will know what's coming, come nc$$ time i'm hoping for a fresh new opponent if they get there.
 
The defense seems to be playing way too conservative imo. Meaning their more trying not to give up ground or just staying with their guy rather then forcing their men into where they want them or where goalie would like to see shots from. Where the defense go that played vs maryland where they were aggressive n just all over them. They were all on their guy so there wasn’t outlets to pass to n guy with ball got winded from trying get away n ended up forcing something that resulted in To.

Why we are playing this super soft D like they’re so worried bout each other instead of trusting each other. Dwan for how big he is should be all over his guy but he just trots with his man never making much contact or get into the body. As said seems their just trying not to make a mistake n playing so soft they end up making more mistake cause their overly worried. Not to mention also possible playing this style to limit the penalties rhey gotten early on. But can’t just go total end of spectrum have to least find somewhere in middle of aggressive n also not getting flagged. Rather then this wet toilet paper D rhey have been playing.

They give up on gbs very quickly which could be them again be cause know they struggle with it n worry getting beat or given up something if go out to try. They need to want it bad n have to play that way. Like leo after some of his piss poor TO does he ride hard to get it back ? No he doesn’t just jogs or fastly walks with barely any effort. Either way if this entire team don’t start playing like they wanna earn it then they will be cooked in first round.

Talent will only get ya so far n when going against teams who are just as talented or even little more talented (unc, ND, princeton) you need to want it more n take it. You also have to play nearly perfect to overcome those more talented teams by out hustling them n wanting it more. It’s not gonna be given it will be earned.
 
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Also as many of us have stated you need other guys than the main ones to step up. Look at how many diff scorers in that ND game ? You need least say 6-7 diff scorers during playoffs or big games. Your first two lines have to contribute. First line should do a lot of it but need your second line to least produce say every third time on field. So not every other but just under it. We just arnt getting ton from 2nd line.
 

Looks like the article tags Cam Ryan for a goal against isn't he out for the season lol? Gary can come off as so feckless at times. Could just be sour grapes, but genuinely has he ever called a timeout while another team is on a run? We all noticed the team took their foot off the gas when ND came out and scored three in a row. Why not call a TO and have Odierna drop kick one of our SSDMs or waft some sage around Mullen.

A game like this shows why the TO stat isn't really worth paying attention to. Both teams had a similar amount, but they were not equal. Without any context or massive discrepancy the stat is at best meaningless and at worst misleading. An errant pass into the stick of an attackman riding who then scores immediately is equal to an attackman rolling the ball to the corner as the shotclock expires so the defense can set up.
 
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Gait doesn't seem like he can win a big game especially on the road and I don't think we're going to out X and O anyone. Sometimes I wonder how he is as a motivator?

We make a lot of dumb offensive mistakes, I think the creative backyard style of play lends to taking chances, but I also think you can still have that style and play smarter. At times we make really poor decisions with the ball and don't value possessions as much as I think we should.

McCool is an enigma. 55% but goes hot and cold and he doesn't see the ball well imho. Looks to me like he's hedging a lot (guessing). I couldn't do it so I don't want to bag on him but id love to see what Ippolito has in a big game start to finish. Would also be interested to know what the practices look like as far as keepers go.
 
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I wonder if this team is suffering a bit from burnout. This senior class has played a ton of minutes, and it's all been pretty high pressure. This program was coming off a four win season when they stepped on campus. They were supplemented over the years by some really good transfer players, but I don't think that's the same as stepping into a team with strong veteran leadership that has been on campus for a number of years. They've had a lot of their shoulders, and perhaps sometimes this season, that's gotten to them.

They've managed to go from that four win season, to a final four in three years. Most programs would take that as a huge accomplishment. But of course Syracuse has higher standards. Hopefully they can take that final step in the next few weeks. I'm not sure I understand what's going on with the defense. They started off the season strong, and McCool has been playing well these past few weeks (shouldn't have to ask your goalie to make 18 saves in a game). I think the biggest question is if Mullen can pull out of the rut that he's in. Remains to be seen.
 
I wonder if this team is suffering a bit from burnout. This senior class has played a ton of minutes, and it's all been pretty high pressure. This program was coming off a four win season when they stepped on campus. They were supplemented over the years by some really good transfer players, but I don't think that's the same as stepping into a team with strong veteran leadership that has been on campus for a number of years. They've had a lot of their shoulders, and perhaps sometimes this season, that's gotten to them.

They've managed to go from that four win season, to a final four in three years. Most programs would take that as a huge accomplishment. But of course Syracuse has higher standards. Hopefully they can take that final step in the next few weeks. I'm not sure I understand what's going on with the defense. They started off the season strong, and McCool has been playing well these past few weeks (shouldn't have to ask your goalie to make 18 saves in a game). I think the biggest question is if Mullen can pull out of the rut that he's in. Remains to be seen.
This got me thinking about the Harvard, UNC, and Notre Dame losses. What is similar offensively between those 3 teams. Athletic midfielders who can run by their guy. What is our biggest weakness on defense? I'd probably say teams that can make out SSDMs uncomfortable. Even the Duke game they put up 15 on us. If their goalie was able to make more than what felt like 2 saves in the first half, we probably lose that one.

I was looking at our efficiencies to see if there is a trend. Defensively speaking, Cuse is consistently okay but not great against top flight offenses but that kind of comes with the territory against good teams.

What really sticks out is OUR offensive efficiency in the second and fourth quarters. The fourth quarter will always be a drop off as the game slows down, players are tired mentally and physically, etc. The second quarter is real red flag.

The two ways I can see it is:
1.) Our conditioning is bad and we run out of steam super early get a second wind in the third then die completely. Or like you said maybe there is just some level of burnout mentally once the adrenaline wears off.
2.) Teams are adjusting on defense and we cannot make counter adjustments quick enough. We come out strong in the first, they make second quarter adjustments. We come out again with some success in the third, they make 4th quarter adjustment and slam the door.
 

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Obviously not the right place but if the NCAA is going to 5 years to play 5 should they let Peck play? Could he bring something to the 2nd line?
 
Obviously not the right place but if the NCAA is going to 5 years to play 5 should they let Peck play? Could he bring something to the 2nd line?

Doesn't seem like that will kick in until next season.
 
It has been a long asz gauntlet of a season and our depth at certain spots is lacking. To me that combo is the main issue. If anything I would guess we are closer to physical burnout than mental burnout. But there is also the fact that we are basically locked into a top 5 seed at this point in the year so there is not a sense of desperation like we needed last year in the ACC tourney. Part of the reason we are in a safe tourney spot is because of our difficult schedule, but it is also the main reason for the fatigue this time of year. ND has played 4 less games than us this season. That is absolutely a factor this time of year.

I would hope that people have learned their lesson from last year about giving up on this team/the staff now. If we come out looking slow and disinterested in the actual playoffs than I would agree with more of these takes. This time last year we went on to win three big games on the road (ND/Duke in the ACC tourney and Princeton). That really makes the road narrative tough for me to put stock in. Also three of our road losses are against the literal 1-3 seeds in the tourney. That is a much bigger factor than where the games have been played.

My main concerns going forward are Mullen and the depth at wings/ssdm. McCarthy and Jake Spallina cannot be expected to be lockdown ssdms on 5 star second line middies and our only wing guys at the same time. We have to give them a break on the wing, especially since they are not even all that strong there in the first place. Would love to see McIntee back on the wings. That seems like such an obvious move at this point with his speed and size. Wish we had more athletes we could trust there. If Ochoa is healthy I would try him there to keep him involved.
 
I wonder if this team is suffering a bit from burnout. This senior class has played a ton of minutes, and it's all been pretty high pressure. This program was coming off a four win season when they stepped on campus. They were supplemented over the years by some really good transfer players, but I don't think that's the same as stepping into a team with strong veteran leadership that has been on campus for a number of years. They've had a lot of their shoulders, and perhaps sometimes this season, that's gotten to them.

They've managed to go from that four win season, to a final four in three years. Most programs would take that as a huge accomplishment. But of course Syracuse has higher standards. Hopefully they can take that final step in the next few weeks. I'm not sure I understand what's going on with the defense. They started off the season strong, and McCool has been playing well these past few weeks (shouldn't have to ask your goalie to make 18 saves in a game). I think the biggest question is if Mullen can pull out of the rut that he's in. Remains to be seen.

Good post Powell. I think you maybe onto something, be it burnout or what not they at times look a step slow from what we saw earlier in the year, Johnny being a prime example, you wonder if this gauntlet schedule has finally caught up with them a bit and also if they are holding something back for the start of both tourneys.

That said this also follows a pattern we have seen the last 3 years under Gait with tourney teams, it's a lack of consistency from week to week. Two weeks ago the team overall and the defense looked excellent against a very good UVA team. Last week against Colgate the Defense was good especially at SSDM but the offense seemed out of sorts and the faceoff unit (especially the wings) was out of sorts. This past week it was faceoffs and both sides of the ball especially the defense and turnovers in the 2nd half. The one consistent thing we have seen is that this team really struggles to put together a 60 min game. It goes back again two years ago when you look at the Cornell game that year, the UNC game etc, we just continue to have a stretch each game (up to a qtr + when it's bad) when all facets are just completely out of sorts and it can vary from the 1st qtr to the 3rd or even the 4th.

Now as you noted some of this criticism if because the expectations are so high here. The team is 11-4 vs an absurd schedule and the ACC gauntlet. Even the Powell area teams didn't rip off undefeated seasons. I think the issue is that the team has continue to mistakes the last 3 years and this is such a Sr laden team this really our best shot at a potential tile for probably at least the next few years (if we're being honest).

To me the concerns are as follows:

The play of the SSDM's this past weekend felt a lot like last year and was disappointing as they had played great the previous two games. You hope this was a bad one off but it's also hard not to worry about a repeat performance in the tourney. Another performance like that and it's season over.

I noted it before but Johnny looks worn out. I think the grind of the season has caught up to him. He's faced a lot of top end FOGO's and taken a lot of draws, just doesn't look right. This weeks matchup isn't exactly what you want either in facing the nations top FOGO. Gotta hope for a bounce back in a big way from him and Angelo who after a string of really good games is also scuffling.

2nd mid line looks like it has hit the Freshmen wall. McIntee and Hahn have both struggled to get in the score sheet and were not setting up Kellogg for success by having him up to just passing the ball around. Syracuse really needs to go to a mixed 2nd line. Run Hottle with McIntee and Kellogg or Hahn and McIntee or Bear Rhoa and Kellogg, try and give some different looks and change things up a bit.

Team also has to clear up the issues with the unforced turnovers. They are gonna see a ton of 10 man on Sat, have to be able to clear and stop throwing the ball with zero pressure.

Overall this is a very solid team with a chance to win a title but it's hard to trust them fr0m game to game. Every time you think they have put it together you get a game where it all reverts back. See last year after an outstanding 2 day stretch in the ACC tourney and then needing a miracle comeback vs Harvard despite winning about 80% of the faceoffs.
 
Doesn't seem like that will kick in until next season.

What happens with that will be fascinating to be honest. I suspect if they try and not include the current graduates you'll see a # of lawsuits. It's just a coincidence but it would obviously hurt SU significant if the current 26 graduates don't count and a major boost for the other ACC teams who are mostly 27 graduate heavy. I hope they either start for the incoming freshman in 26 or open it up for everyone. I don't know how many of the current graduates would return but I assume at least a few would.
 
What happens with that will be fascinating to be honest. I suspect if they try and not include the current graduates you'll see a # of lawsuits. It's just a coincidence but it would obviously hurt SU significant if the current 26 graduates don't count and a major boost for the other ACC teams who are mostly 27 graduate heavy. I hope they either start for the incoming freshman in 26 or open it up for everyone. I don't know how many of the current graduates would return but I assume at least a few would.
I know one that was hoping to return for another season if the change included the senior class. Several were drafted so not sure how that would work.
 
What happens with that will be fascinating to be honest. I suspect if they try and not include the current graduates you'll see a # of lawsuits. It's just a coincidence but it would obviously hurt SU significant if the current 26 graduates don't count and a major boost for the other ACC teams who are mostly 27 graduate heavy. I hope they either start for the incoming freshman in 26 or open it up for everyone. I don't know how many of the current graduates would return but I assume at least a few would.

The guys in 26 had no expectation of being granted a 5th year when they committed to college.

Good luck trying to sue to demand something you were never supposed to get.
 
The guys in 26 had no expectation of being granted a 5th year when they committed to college.

Good luck trying to sue to demand something you were never supposed to get.

Well neither did the 27 or 28 or 29 guys but under the current plan they would get one. The only way to avoid that would be to start it with the incoming guys this fall but that appears unlikely.
 
What happens with that will be fascinating to be honest. I suspect if they try and not include the current graduates you'll see a # of lawsuits. It's just a coincidence but it would obviously hurt SU significant if the current 26 graduates don't count and a major boost for the other ACC teams who are mostly 27 graduate heavy. I hope they either start for the incoming freshman in 26 or open it up for everyone. I don't know how many of the current graduates would return but I assume at least a few would.

5 for 5 in a sport that really pushes re-classes will be something.

There's supposed to be reform (I thought) with the club class system, but who knows.
 

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