Random Thoughts on the Season So Far

[IthacaMatt]

As JB said last season and it just makes so much sense. If a player turns the ball over 8 times in practice, how many would he turn it over in a game?

The issues we see in the court with these guys are the same the coaches see at practice day in and day out, nothing is going to change from practice one day and suddenly get better the next during a game situation.

I'm sure the coaching staff is playing the players who help us win the most, I'm sure they aren't thinking "you know what, let's keep these guys who can help us win on the bench".

The problem with this thinking is that players DEVELOP. Their skill level is not static, it changes. Hopefully it improves. It can improve to a certain extent in practice (knowing where to be on the floor and the right thing to do in a certain situation). But nothing accelerates the process like live competition with someone in game conditions from another team, who you are not familiar with from playing against them every day in practice.

If you doubt this, as several people seem to be doing in this thread, just look at football. The back-up quarterback may look great in practice, but you don't know what's going to happen until you actually put him in a game.

 

[Shenexon]

March results are probably the one area where it is probably fair-? to criticize JB's performance. Given the quality of talent we have had, the records of our teams etc. we only have one championship. Just because his results have been terrific, do we have to settle and not strive for better?

JB coached well enough to have two championships but for the heroics of Keith Smart and poor FT shooting. We've been in the game five times in my life and expect another opportunity before JB retires. The beauty of the college game for me is how the coaches and players grow during the season or sometimes digress. I'm looking forward to how this team can improve and strive for better. We've got some wonderful young players, a few veterans, and good coaches who can meld as the season progresses. Will they? That's the fun...

 

[billsin01]

Intellectually dishonest? Seriously? I don't get this view at all. You seem to be taking the stance in your posts that by developing a deeper bench by giving regular minutes (for some reason you seem to think this must mean a platoon with equal minutes among all players) to guys is going to reduce the effectiveness of the top 5 players. In most seasons, our first 5 are going to be ready mentally and physically to contribute to team success. Last year and this year are exceptions at PG because we had/have a freshman running the offense. But, we certainly have inexperienced guys vying for the 2/3 role and the fact is, most of them were on the team last year and would have benefitted from more meaningful game experience. If you don't believe that game experience counts WAY more than practice time, I won't debate this topic any more.

Speaking of practice vs game experience, I think a lot of people have misconceptions about what takes place at typical team practices. From a lot of comments on this thread, such as "BJ got a lot of experience going against CJ in practice", I get the impression that people think a practice is one long scrimmage where the bench players are getting experience playing against the first team. That's not how practices go. There is a lot of instruction and drilling of both individual skills and team concepts (i.e. where to be in the zone in certain circumstances, full-court press, inbounds plays, fast breaks, etc). I would bet that most practices have very little scrimmaging (10-15 minutes) where they might also be limited to only employing what they learned during that session. While some practices have more intensity than others, it is far different from the intensity of a real game.

Baye was capable as a defender and rebounder, as you point out, but he was an absolute offensive liability that year. As for Riley, I absolutely believe that he would have been more ready to handle stepping in for AO in March had he played more minutes during the season. I guess we will have to acknowledge different viewpoints on this topic, which by your reasoning makes me intellectually dishonest.:bat:

Dude, I think you're frustrated with me because you don't get what I'm saying. Don't get me wrong, that was a really cute emoticon, but I don't think you needed to use it. Let's reset this point by point:

-- At no point have I ever said that developing a deeper bench meant playing everyone equal minutes nor did I ever suggest it would limit the effectiveness of the starters. In fact, I've said that I'd love to see JB regularly go deeper than the 7.5 rotation and I've said forever that playing Cooney 40 mpg when he's a jump shooter who uses a lot of legs in his shot is crazy.

-- At not point have I ever said practice is more valuable than game minutes. I've said the following: What happens off the court -- which encompasses entire off-seasons playing with international teams, working in the weight room, practices, the natural maturation of kids who 18, 19, 20 years old, etc. -- plays a far greater role in the development of a player than what happens after tip-off 40 times a year. The games are where you see what all the hard work has led to. In no way, shape or form does this mean game minutes aren't valuable -- it's just that they are a small part of the overall development AND that you can't draw a direct line between minutes and improvement. Minutes are good, they're valuable, they help a kid figure out what he needs to do, but they don't inherently make a kid better from Nov. to February.

-- Baye was an offensive liability b/c he was BAYE. That's the whole point. You could go back in time and give Baye 40 mins a game as a frosh and he still doesn't catch the ball well and has no post move. I love him, but all the minutes in the world weren't going to change that. That's the whole point of this discussion.

-- And finally ... ahhh ... Dash Riley. So your contention is literally that Dash Riley 'would have been more ready to step in for AO in March had he played more minutes during the season'. So, I'm not sure I agree but let's concede the point that Dash getting 15 mpg in every game we play would have made him a bit better by the end of the season. Your argument is that somehow the Dash Riley who went on to average 4 ppg and a handful of rebounds for the next three seasons at EMU -- against MAC competition -- was going to help mitigate the loss of AO on that team? Then yes, we are very, very much on different sides of that ocean.

 

[billsin01]

The problem with this thinking is that players DEVELOP. Their skill level is not static, it changes. Hopefully it improves. It can improve to a certain extent in practice (knowing where to be on the floor and the right thing to do in a certain situation). But nothing accelerates the process like live competition with someone in game conditions from another team, who you are not familiar with from playing against them every day in practice.

If you doubt this, as several people seem to be doing in this thread, just look at football. The back-up quarterback may look great in practice, but you don't know what's going to happen until you actually put him in a game.

Why do we keep comparing practice vs. game? This is not the point. We're talking about development and development happens all the time. I absolutely agree that game minutes are very valuable, but how many players have we had that completely transformed due to minutes during the season? I'm genuinely asking. I seem to remember Z Sims taking a big leap in his offensive production over the course of the 96 season, though he was a veteran. I remember Hak getting few minutes early then blowing up during the NIT in 02. I seem to remember Damone Brown really coming along.

But the point is there are far more examples of guys who drastically improved year over year -- the Jason Hart's and Etan Thomases. CJ Fair, Rony, Hak (for his career) ...

 

[billsin01]

I understand the developmental questions here, but I don't see anyone addressing the physical breakdown issues that we have seen. Our players who average 35 or more minutes a game look TIRED come mid to late season. This is yet another reason to allow some of the younger guys time on the floor when we are playing Canisius and Cornell. And when we get an actual injury, the guy coming off the bench always makes a mistake within the first minute and we hear the same old - 'See, told you he wasn't ready." It's a cycle that needs to be broken. I'm not asking for Buss to play half the minutes (especially with the way he's been shooting), but I definitely think Roberson should have gotten more minutes last year.

For my part, VT, I'm only questioning the notion that players develop noticeably within the season. For me, most improvement happens when we're not watching. However, the notion that playing more players would keep our rotation fresher in February is hard to disagree with. I can live with mistakes but I'm not really sure losing games early translates to winning more games late. I think you need to find a way to develop enough players that you can simply go 8.5 instead of 7.5 without losing too much. Easier said than done, I suppose.