Scheyer at Duke, Davis at UNC

[UnknownOrange]

I doubt he takes the Coach K approach, announcing a season in advance to allow for the "farewell tour".

Roy Williams announced his retirement on April 1.

Yeah I could see him announcing in May or June of 2091 that his previous season was his last

 

[Zelda Zonk]

I’ve read a lot of these posts and I’m not sure I’m getting the full picture.

Seems like the prevailing argument is “JB picking his successor would be bad” but the reasons seem unclear at best?

You seem to have the full picture.

 

[AlaskaSU]

Literally, there aren’t 5 other people who follow hoops who believe that.

Another dismal season and Hop will be a coach who has been fired. Do you know his record over the last 2 years?

 

[FrancoPizza]

Another dismal season and Hop will be a coach who has been fired. Do you know his record over the last 2 years?

Maybe hop should step down for “personal reasons” to avoid being fired and make it easier for us to offer him in 1-2 years - similar to how slick Rick took a sabbatical

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Maybe hop should step down for “personal reasons” to avoid being fired and make it easier for us to offer him in 1-2 years - similar to how slick Rick took a sabbatical

'Back problems' flaring up again...

 

[SBU72]

I’m not necessarily saying that I agree with it, but I think there is zero to no chance that the next coach comes from the outside. Some reasons why:

1) Are there any coaches that would undoubtably elevate Syracuse to elite status who are actually available? Jay Wright isn’t leaving Nova. I’d feel very confident hiring Nate Oats, but is he available? Bobby Hurley...no thanks, he hasn’t proven anything and is a maniac on the sidelines. His act would wear thin pretty quick. Boyton hasn’t proven anything and only got Cunningham because his brother was on staff. There are some other up and comers and will be more in the coming years, but no one who has proven that they can lead a power 5 team to elite status.

2) JB will see to it that the next hire comes down to either Hop, Gmac, or Red. I’m certainly not the biggest JB fan, but with that said he is loyal sometimes to a fault. He’s even said that about himself in press conferences. I’m sure he will have conversations with Hop in the near future about his availability. If it takes stepping down in September to assure Gmac or Red getting the job, I think that’s what he’d do.

3) Syracuse basketball begins and ends with JB, and therefore the program is one big family. Former players talk about that all the time. If they hire an outsider, there is little chance Gmac and Red would stay on staff. Maybe Griff does, and the new coach could look to hire other Syracuse alum to fill their spots, but I just don’t see JW breaking up “the family” at this point in time.

4) UNC and Duke just laid out the blueprint. Although those programs are a notch above ours, they are very similar in history, tradition, and having alums make up the coaching staff.

Again, I’m not saying I agree with this, and I truly hope JW conducts a national search when the time comes and hires the best coach possible, regardless of program affiliation. And if Gmac and Red leave for head coaching jobs elsewhere while JB is still at the helm, these reasons all become moot. However, if things stay status quo between now and then, I just don’t see any way that our next coach isn’t either Hop, Gmac, or Red. The interesting development will be if Hop turns it down and the choice comes down to Gmac or Red. Red is the associate head coach which might hold some weight in JW’s eyes, but from what I’ve gathered I think Gmac would be JB’s recommendation. Either way, as Jeff Goodman mentioned on a recent podcast, that will be a very interesting decision if it comes down to that.

I think many would agree that if/when the next coach is one of the 3 mentioned he gets an assistant that has tons more experience teaching how to play m2m. Hop obviously has head coaching experience to understand the complete complexity of the position. Red has experience under another coach but even Hop lacks dosen't have that much m2m teaching experience. That said if that is the way it goes sorry to say that Deve and Nichols get sort a left out.

 

[longtimefan]

I am convinced that JB will do exactly that.

That's what Dean Smith did.

 

[Cusefan69]

Yeah so I just don’t see JB doing the sudden retirement thing without JW not being aware of it in advance. So my guess would be if JB indicated he was going to do that he would recommend to JW that Red should close the season out and then guess what? JW still does a national search after the season and has an updated data point with Red. So even if JB retires early to give a staff member a shot, it does not in any way, shape or form limit JW in doing what he needs to do. So I have zero problems with JB doing it, because it doesn’t guarantee a thing other than Red or whomever getting a partial trial run at most.

 

[longtimefan]

The "SU Coaching Succession" has been debated on this board (and elsewhere) for years. I don't want to beat that horse right now.

Rather, I'll respond to the OP re: the UNC and Duke moves. I don't think they are the same. Davis has been exposed to influences outside the UNC family during his years in the NBA. Scheyer has been attached to K's hip his entire coaching career. UNC also has been through the same drill 25 years ago, when Dean Smith retired, albeit under a different AD. This is all new to Duke.

And look at what happened in Chapel Hill when they replaced Smith--they were able to win (at a lesser level) with Smith's players for a couple of years, then eased Guthridge out, then suffered with the Doherty abomination. Fortunately for them, they had Ol' Roy waiting in the wings. In other words, UNC's internal hire move didn't work so well, and Williams bailed them out. If Davis doesn't cut it, I expect they will go national.

I know very little about Scheyer. And obviously K has endorsed him. But, Duke is gambling here. Despite claims that they did a thorough search, 10 days doesn't scream "thorough".

With a very limited knowledge base, I think UNC is more likely to work out. The bigger point is, I think both of those programs are likely to take a step back over the next 5 years. Which means SU has a chance to move up in the ACC, which might encourage JB to stick around a bit longer.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Jon Scheyer just lost Nolan Smith as an assistant to Kenny Payne at Louisville.

It will be very interesting to see who he hires now that he has 2 openings.

Smith was responsible for bringing in some of that top 20 talent at Duke. It would appear Louisville is going all in a shady shenanigans to try and win again.

 

[dasher]

Jon Scheyer just lost Nolan Smith as an assistant to Kenny Payne at Louisville.

It will be very interesting to see who he hires now that he has 2 openings.

Smith was responsible for bringing in some of that top 20 talent at Duke. It would appear Louisville is going all in a shady shenanigans to try and win again.

Wait. Are you suggesting that there was any period of time in the last 30 years that Louisville wasn't going all in on shady shenanigans? I honestly can't remember a time when they weren't.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Wait. Are you suggesting that there was any period of time in the last 30 years that Louisville wasn't going all in on shady shenanigans? I honestly can't remember a time when they weren't.

lol no joke there.

I do think losing Smith and K in the same year are huge losses for Duke. Scheyer is going to have to do a lot of this all on his own early. We will find out if he's good enough soon.

I would have liked to see Smith go to a non ACC school.

 

[dasher]

lol no joke there.

I do think losing Smith and K in the same year are huge losses for Duke. Scheyer is going to have to do a lot of this all on his own early. We will find out if he's good enough soon.

I would have liked to see Smith go to a non ACC school.

He has his recruiting just about done with the Jr class. That gives him a leg up on the soph class.

 

[Cusefan0307]

He has his recruiting just about done with the Jr class. That gives him a leg up on the soph class.

One of those kids Duke recruited and is a top 15 kid while arguably being the best PG in the class is Caleb Foster. Caleb Foster's lead recruiter is Nolan Smith. Does he still go to Duke, or does he follow Smith to Louisville.

That's how this might hurt...

 

[dasher]

One of those kids Duke was recruited and is a top 15 kid while arguably being the best PG in the class is Caleb Foster. Caleb Foster's lead recruiter is Nolan Smith. Does he still go to Duke, or does he follow Smith to Louisville.

That's how this might hurt...

Don't they already have the Jr pt guard from Oak Hill? That is Foster. I thought he was already a Duke verbal.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Don't they already have the Jr pt guard from Oak Hill? That is Foster. I thought he was already a Duke verbal.

Yep. That's my point...I wonder if he would flip?

 

[HoustonCuse]

Louisville just keeps quadrupling down. It’s kind of amazing to watch. We were completely cowed by the NCAA and Louisville just keeps cheating harder and harder. We really mismanaged the NCAA and our risk posture since 2012.

 

[SUGIANT]

Alright sports fans, let's be honest here:

Scheyer and Davis as assistants have been around more winning, better recruiting, deeper tournament runs, have coached more NBA players, and overall have accomplished more than our assistants, and DUKE AND UNC ARE INSANE FOR NAMING THEM AS HEAD COACHES FOLLOWING LEGENDS.

We can take the crazy crown though if we name Red or GMAC to be HC when JB is done. Is that what we want? The crazy crown? Because let me tell ya, heavy is the head...

Alright sports fans, let's be honest here:

Scheyer and Davis as assistants have been around more winning, better recruiting, deeper tournament runs, have coached more NBA players, and overall have accomplished more than our assistants, and DUKE AND UNC ARE INSANE FOR NAMING THEM AS HEAD COACHES FOLLOWING LEGENDS.

We can take the crazy crown though if we name Red or GMAC to be HC when JB is done. Is that what we want? The crazy crown? Because let me tell ya, heavy is the head...

similar things were said when JB was hired. Let’s just get the best person for the job. no one will be liked by all. Of course that’s when JB does step down and I’ve seen no announcement yet.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Louisville just keeps quadrupling down. It’s kind of amazing to watch. We were completely cowed by the NCAA and Louisville just keeps cheating harder and harder. We really mismanaged the NCAA and our risk posture since 2012.

Kansas is probably going to be the National Champion. Rules don’t mean sht. Break them as much as you need to.

 

[djorange1989]

hey just because they recently hired Will Wade as director of compliance doesn't mean Louisville is shady

 

[djorange1989]

Louisville just keeps quadrupling down. It’s kind of amazing to watch. We were completely cowed by the NCAA and Louisville just keeps cheating harder and harder. We really mismanaged the NCAA and our risk posture since 2012.

we bent over for the NCAA. never cooperate with the NCAA. throw lawyers and lawsuits at them.

 

[jimmyT]

we bent over for the NCAA. never cooperate with the NCAA. throw lawyers and lawsuits at them.

Let’s be honest here. In today’s game, dose a really good basketball player want to play zone ? Based on the last few years quality of recruits SU has signed I think not. So basically if they hire from within when JB retires then it really doesn’t matter who the assistant coach is who gets the HC job.

 

[MikeSU02]

One of those kids Duke recruited and is a top 15 kid while arguably being the best PG in the class is Caleb Foster. Caleb Foster's lead recruiter is Nolan Smith. Does he still go to Duke, or does he follow Smith to Louisville.

That's how this might hurt...

Weren't they trying to get him to re-classify (or at least at one time)?

 

[Briancuse]

One of those kids Duke recruited and is a top 15 kid while arguably being the best PG in the class is Caleb Foster. Caleb Foster's lead recruiter is Nolan Smith. Does he still go to Duke, or does he follow Smith to Louisville.

That's how this might hurt...

Is lands still committed to lville? Or is he opening up his recruitment

 

[hoopsupstate]

Is lands still committed to lville? Or is he opening up his recruitment

He said he was staying.