Shafer Dismissed per SI

[Cuse'91]

I don't see how one week makes a difference. If we get someone like Frost/Orgeron then ok. But I'm waiting to see if the end result justifies the rather ugly means here.

Maybe not, but it seems like an unusually high number of schools will be looking for new coaches, best to start the process asap...

 

[AZOrange]

Maybe not, but it seems like an unusually high number of schools will be looking for new coaches, best to start the process asap...

Man id be surprised if Coyle doesn't already have his path laid out here. Especially with the pending renovations etc this could be a tough sell. Have to think he's got someone lined up.

 

[Yegorange]

Then why tell him last week? Why not wait .. that was my point.

To start the search ASAP, and to spare Shafer the boos on Senior day. This way he'll get a nice send off from the crowd. Makes sense.

 

[Crusty]

It's not a big deal at all. Firing is crappy for everyone whenever it happens. Coyle did right by the staff and players.

I went through 5 mergers and had to fire literally hundreds of people and I can assure you it is hell for everyone. The only thing you can do it is quick and get it over with and then stand ready to help in any way that you can.

 

[AZOrange]

To start the search ASAP, and to spare Shafer the boos on Senior day. This way he'll get a nice send off from the crowd. Makes sense.

your latter reason is THE reason

 

[nocoffee]

Where do I sign the Syracusefan.com e-card for HCSS?

 

[reedny]

Maybe not, but it seems like an unusually high number of schools will be looking for new coaches, best to start the process asap...

Agree. http://www.syracuse.com/orangefootb...use_is_competing_with.html#incart_river_index

But that doesn't mean making the decision a week early, and creating this de classe' lame duck period (which I'm sure SS will handle better than the AD did) will be worth it.

All of this hinges on the new hire (and mostly his recruiting chops). Otherwise, Coyle's painted himself into a corner.

 

[reedny]

To start the search ASAP, and to spare Shafer the boos on Senior day. This way he'll get a nice send off from the crowd. Makes sense.

Well, it makes sense in a kind of ugly, awkward way, if you think firing a coach before the season's over is a "nice touch". I doubt he would be booed. He's been all-in for SU since he got here.

At any rate, let's see if it's all worth it with the search process. As a fan, my concern is that our recruiting is no where near where it has to be in the ACC, and we'll wind up facing the same problem again in 3 years unless we get someone (e.g., Orgeron) with a magical ability to bring in talent.

 

[anomander]

Obviously sucks things didn't work out as Shafer is a top shelf person. He will land on his feet. But this was a move that needed to be made. I just couldn't have imagined going into next offseason with absolutely nothing to look forward to. Now the hope is back. Going to be an interesting few weeks. Would prefer someone with HC experience, but I could make an exception for certain a OCs

 

[reedny]

Obviously sucks things didn't work out as Shafer is a top shelf person. He will land on his feet. But this was a move that needed to be made. I just couldn't have imagined going into next offseason with absolutely nothing to look forward to. Now the hope is back. Going to be an interesting few weeks. Would prefer someone with HC experience, but I could make an exception for certain a OCs

Well said and I think you are where a lot of fans are. Personally, I don't think our personnel matches up in the ACC, not even close. And to my eye, that's the primary reason for our predicament. But recruiting is a coaching function.

So let's see if all this is worth it ... that's the key. Can we bring in someone who can compete in conference?

 

[Scooch]

Was he wearing a black leather jacket and hanging with Gait at Club 44?

I gotta tell ya, in my limited interactions with our former AD, I never walked away impressed. We can leave it at that.

 

[NKR1978]

I don't see how one week makes a difference. If we get someone like Frost/Orgeron then ok. But I'm waiting to see if the end result justifies the rather ugly means here.

I don't think it's ugly at all.

If we beat BC, Shafer leaves to a standing ovation. If we lose, it's tempered by the fealing that it has to be hard for the team.

If this was twisting in the win, and we lost, the reaction at the Dome would be a loud chorus of boos.

 

[Rocco]

 

[Yegorange]

Well, it makes sense in a kind of ugly, awkward way, if you think firing a coach before the season's over is a "nice touch". I doubt he would be booed. He's been all-in for SU since he got here.

At any rate, let's see if it's all worth it with the search process. As a fan, my concern is that our recruiting is no where near where it has to be in the ACC, and we'll wind up facing the same problem again in 3 years unless we get someone (e.g., Orgeron) who's a magical recruiter.

If the decision was made already, why delay? Firings are ugly by default, and I don't think this was a "nice touch", just a smart one, IMO. Especially since indications are it was already leaked.

As for boos, they certainly would've happened from those few in attendance. People have posted about this happening already. Imagine the frustration and dirt hurled at the staff the moment things went sour on Sat.

 

[cuseguy]

Well said and I think you are where a lot of fans are. Personally, I don't think our personnel matches up in the ACC, not even close. And to my eye, that's the primary reason for our predicament. But recruiting is a coaching function. So let's see if all this is worth it ... that's the key. Can we bring in someone who can compete in conference?

I think many overlook the talent part.

But they'll say, "The new guy needs to recruit better."

Easier said than done.

So the next guy needs to have a great scheme and be a solid recruiter.

Ball is in Coyle's hand.

 

[reedny]

If the decision was made already, why delay? Firings are ugly by default, and I don't think this was a "nice touch", just a smart one, IMO. Especially since indications are it was already leaked.

As for boos, they certainly would've happened from those few in attendance. People have posted about this happening already. Imagine the frustration and dirt hurled at the staff the moment things went sour on Sat.

Because it's awkward and punitive to fire a coach before the season's over. It's a slap in the face, beyond just being let go after the season. SS didn't win enough games. Ok. But I think he acted gentlemanly enough to be afforded the courtesy of finishing the season.

If your reasoning is that an early decision is better to start the search process, then I could understand ... as long as the results are there. If not, and the AD brings in someone mediocre who fails to break the facilities/talent- deficit cycle, the awkward early announcement will have been for nothing.

 

[TheCusian]

I think many overlook the talent part. But they'll say, "The new guy needs to recruit better." Easier said than done. So the next guy needs to have a great scheme and be a solid recruiter. Ball is in Coyle's hand.

Always was. That's the job Coyle signed up for.

 

[Scooch]

Those realities conceded, I have a few questions for the AD:

1. Why fire the HC before the last game? The timing seems unnecessarily punitive and awkward. If the reason is to get the search going early in order to get the new staff on campus and start focusing on the real problem with the program (talent), then I hope the results are worth it. If not, I'd like to hear an explanation for the timing.
2. Since it does the U no good to fire a coach as a "punishment" for his record, please tell me you're confident the next guy will be significantly better. If you can't do that, you made the wrong decision, or at least you made the decision prematurely.
3. We all know that failing to "go for it" on 4th down, and similar in-game decisions, do not constitute the primary reason for SU's record. Even the casual observer can see that our facilities are not yet at the level of our ACC peers, and obviously we have a colossal talent deficit. So now that you've cast the current staff out, what's your plan to bring our recruiting stream up to ACC levels? If you don't have one, the current cycle will be repeated, what's left of your community support will evaporate and you, yourself, may face the "firing" squad.

I'm no AD, but these are rather easily answered questions, right?

1 - It's actually a professional thing to do. It allows the staff to get started on finding their next job. It allows Shafer to have one last week with his team for closure. It lets the team try and win a last game for their coach. It lets the fans give him an appropriately positive send off for his effort. It allows Coyle to conduct a search in the light of day instead of in the shadows. It's almost entirely positive, really.

2 - Why wouldn't Coyle be confident that the next coach will be better? That's the entire point of moving on. Do you think he's just being spiteful because Shafer is 3-8, but that he believes the next coach will somehow be worse? How would that make any sense?

3 - See #2. Coyle strikes me as a smart professional who had direct experience being a key part of, and then leading, the AD at a school with distinct facilities and recruiting disadvantages. Do you think he might have been asked about his "plan" when he was vetted by the BOT and Chancellor before he was ultimately hired? Why do you think he doesn't have a plan? It's, like, his job.

 

[TheCusian]

Because it's awkward and punitive to fire a coach before the season's over. SS didn't win enough games. Ok. But I think he acted gentlemanly enough to be permitted to finish the season! If your reasoning is that an early decision is better to start the search process, then the results had better be there. If the AD's bringing in someone mediocre who's not going to break the talent deficit trend, the awkward early announcement will have been for nothing.

He is finishing the season. It's only awkward and punitive if Shafer and his staff think so.

 

[orangezen]

Maybe Coyle gave Shafer the choice of when to announce .. wait or give him a chance to have the team win one for him

 

[Rocco]

 

[Rocco]

 

[PAcuse]

Maybe Coyle gave Shafer the choice of when to announce .. wait or give him a chance to have the team win one for him

Let him go out to cheers is a classy move

 

[reedny]

I'm no AD, but these are rather easily answered questions, right?

1 - It's actually a professional thing to do. It allows the staff to get started on finding their next job. It allows Shafer to have one last week with his team for closure. It lets the team try and win a last game for their coach. It lets the fans give him an appropriately positive send off for his effort. It allows Coyle to conduct a search in the light of day instead of in the shadows. It's almost entirely positive, really.

2 - Why wouldn't Coyle be confident that the next coach will be better? That's the entire point of moving on. Do you think he's just being spiteful because Shafer is 3-8, but that he believes the next coach will somehow be worse? How would that make any sense?

3 - See #2. Coyle strikes me as a smart professional who had direct experience being a key part of, and then leading, the AD at a school with distinct facilities and recruiting disadvantages. Do you think he might have been asked about his "plan" when he was vetted by the BOT and Chancellor before he was ultimately hired? Why do you think he doesn't have a plan? It's, like, his job.

I hardly think firing a coach before season's end is "professional", and it certainly seems like the weirdest "favor" I've ever heard of. You act as if all the "benefits" described in your point "2" would not be there if Coyle had simply waited a week.

And as far as a plan, that remains to be seen. Gross had a plan too, twice.

 

[OrangePA]

Good man