Smoke or BS in CT (B1G)?

[BlazeOrange]

And on a side note - the B12 taking West Virginia over Louisville remains a head scratcher to me.

Wasn't there a timing issue involved? I think having to do with the TV contract vs. # teams in the conference.
Was WVU willing to go all out (including increased exit fees) to join the B12 immediately and Louisville wasn't?

 

[MaxwellCuse]

Wasn't there a timing issue involved? I think having to do with the TV contract vs. # teams in the conference.
Was WVU willing to go all out (including increased exit fees) to join the B12 immediately and Louisville wasn't?

You are correct. Oliver Luck was willing to bust loose from the Big East immediately and worry about the legal ramifications later. Tom Jurich wanted to give the BE their 27 months which would not meet the needs of the Big12's media partner. If Ollie Luck had been AD at Louisville many people believe the Cards would be playing football in the Great Plains.

 

[Btstimpy]

Texas is the key to this war. If the ACC were ever to land them they'd have the most fertile recruiting area in the whole country. Let the Big 10 have UConn and even OU if it came to that. This is where I feel Swofford should invest his time.

Yes. On the path to 20 with Notre Dame a full member, create 4 PODS of 5:

Texas
Baylor
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Tulane

Florida State
Georgia Tech
Clemson
NC State
Wake Forest

Duke
North Carolina
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Louisville

Notre Dame
Syracuse
Boston College
Pittsburgh
Miami

Nice and Neat. Good Scheduling possibilities. National Coverage for an ACC Channel. Competitive. Would be the 9 game schedule because Notre Dame would be part of the league and not an extra game.

 

[Scooch]

Yes. On the path to 20 with Notre Dame a full member, create 4 PODS of 5: Texas Baylor Oklahoma Oklahoma State Tulane Florida State Georgia Tech Clemson NC State Wake Forest Duke North Carolina Virginia Virginia Tech Louisville Notre Dame Syracuse Boston College Pittsburgh Miami Nice and Neat. Good Scheduling possibilities. National Coverage for an ACC Channel. Competitive. Would be the 9 game schedule because Notre Dame would be part of the league and not an extra game.

Why stop there?!

Add the Giants, Jets, Pats, Steelers and Ravens.

Plus the Knicks, Celtics, Manchester United, New Zealand national rugby team and the Monstars from Space Jam.

Lock it up!

 

[Alsacs]

Yes. On the path to 20 with Notre Dame a full member, create 4 PODS of 5:

Texas
Baylor
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Tulane

Florida State
Georgia Tech
Clemson
NC State
Wake Forest

Duke
North Carolina
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Louisville

Notre Dame
Syracuse
Boston College
Pittsburgh
Miami

Nice and Neat. Good Scheduling possibilities. National Coverage for an ACC Channel. Competitive. Would be the 9 game schedule because Notre Dame would be part of the league and not an extra game.

I doubt this will happen. Conferences will stop at 16. The Big XII will get divided by the Pac-12, B1G, ACC, SEC. I could see Oklahoma State, Baylor going to the SEC, Oklahoma, Kansas going to the B1G, Texas getting 5 games from the ACC.

 

[Noexcuse]

Yes. On the path to 20 with Notre Dame a full member, create 4 PODS of 5:

Texas
Baylor
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Tulane

Florida State
Georgia Tech
Clemson
NC State
Wake Forest

Duke
North Carolina
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Louisville

Notre Dame
Syracuse
Boston College
Pittsburgh
Miami

Nice and Neat. Good Scheduling possibilities. National Coverage for an ACC Channel. Competitive. Would be the 9 game schedule because Notre Dame would be part of the league and not an extra game.

I'd rather see West Virginia than Tulane. Coach Ben would agree.

 

[HtownOrange]

I'd rather see West Virginia than Tulane. Coach Ben would agree.

Maybe for football but definitely not for the fan experience.

 

[IthacaMatt]

No college team meaningfully registers in the NYC market.

The concept that a UConn/Rutgers combo would "lock it up" is hilllllarious.

Not necessarily. NYC TV viewers are front runners when it comes to college sports. If there is a national contender, they'll pay attention. But the team has to be really good.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Why stop there?!

Add the Giants, Jets, Pats, Steelers and Ravens.

Plus the Knicks, Celtics, Manchester United, New Zealand national rugby team and the Monstars from Space Jam.

Lock it up!

Chelsea instead of United, but hell yeah.

 

[TerryD]

You're putting way too much stock into "recruiting grounds".

So how exactly were ND alums going to react when your AD told them that this was their upcoming basketball schedule and your home for all sports aside from football?:

Texas
Texas Tech
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Iowa State
Baylor
Kansas
Kansas State
TCU
West Virginia

Come on. If for some reason the ACC balked at admitting ND with the 5 game football commitment then you know what ND would have done? Maintained total football independence and joined up with the new Big East for hoops and other sports. They weren't sending all their non-football sports to Manhattan, Kansas and Lubbock, Texas.

ND sends the baseball team to places like Corpus Christi, Houston and San Antonio every year, even when it was in the Big East.

All ND sports are used to traveling all over the place. ND would have sacrificed its minor sports a bit to stay football independent.

The Big East does not have enough programs or schools that play certain sports.

Sure, It would have been a last ditch, fallback spot for ND (but only that) to keep football outside of a conference and only if neither the ACC or the Big 12 would have given a partial deal.

 

[omniorange]

Now that SU is safely in the ACC, I find that conference realignment isn't quite as meaningful to me as it once was.

IF the ACC ever does add another team (regardless of whether or not ND joins full-time or not, since a change in the divisional rule might be on the horizon, 15 can be just as workable as 14), of the realistic candidates I like both UConn and Cincy. I do think UConn has the vastly superior athletics department and deserves it more so than Cincy, but a lot can happen between now and whenever this does happen, indeed - if it ever does happen.

As for ND and the ACC/Big 12/Big East partial membership debate in this thread...

Let's not forget that ND only wanted 4 games and the ACC wanted 6. The Big 12 supposedly was willing to do the 4 since they only have 10 members with Texas being a permanent partner and ND cycling through the remaining 9 members over a 6 year period. But ND agreed to go to up to 5 games to get into the ACC which they knew in advance was basically going to mean the end of all their mostly regular Big Ten match-ups that BK now laments are gone.

That, to me anyway, demonstrates how inconsequential the Big 12's offer for partial membership was to ND. The Big 12 offered them nothing since the Irish could have developed a near-annual game with Texas or even a Texas/Oklahoma combo by keeping their other sports in the Big East. And by doing that they also could have kept those Big Ten games early in the season as well.

But ND was willing to sacrifice not only their mostly regular meetings with Michigan, Michigan State, and Purdue but in addition to that sacrifice a shot at a similarly set-up potential annual rivalry with Texas (since it appears they felt their true annual rivalries with Navy, USC, and now Stanford was more important to them) to get their other sports into the ACC.

ND has never put that much emphasis on their other sports in their entire existence.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Btstimpy]

Now that SU is safely in the ACC, I find that conference realignment isn't quite as meaningful to me as it once was.

IF the ACC ever does add another team (regardless of whether or not ND joins full-time or not, since a change in the divisional rule might be on the horizon, 15 can be just as workable as 14), of the realistic candidates I like both UConn and Cincy. I do think UConn has the vastly superior athletics department and deserves it more so than Cincy, but a lot can happen between now and whenever this does happen, indeed - if it ever does happen.

As for ND and the ACC/Big 12/Big East partial membership debate in this thread...

Let's not forget that ND only wanted 4 games and the ACC wanted 6. The Big 12 supposedly was willing to do the 4 since they only have 10 members with Texas being a permanent partner and ND cycling through the remaining 9 members over a 6 year period. But ND agreed to go to up to 5 games to get into the ACC which they knew in advance was basically going to mean the end of all their mostly regular Big Ten match-ups that BK now laments are gone.

That, to me anyway, demonstrates how inconsequential the Big 12's offer for partial membership was to ND. The Big 12 offered them nothing since the Irish could have developed a near-annual game with Texas or even a Texas/Oklahoma combo by keeping their other sports in the Big East. And by doing that they also could have kept those Big Ten games early in the season as well.

But ND was willing to sacrifice not only their mostly regular meetings with Michigan, Michigan State, and Purdue but in addition to that sacrifice a shot at a similarly set-up potential annual rivalry with Texas (since it appears they felt their true annual rivalries with Navy, USC, and now Stanford was more important to them) to get their other sports into the ACC.

ND has never put that much emphasis on their other sports in their entire existence.

Cheers,
Neil

A couple of other things to keep in mind that Notre Dame wants for football are:

1. Playing a national schedule where they have the ability to play in all of the major population centers as often as possible. Between the ACC, Big Ten, and Big XII, the ACC gives Notre Dame the most access to major centers of the three as Conference Games if Notre Dame would eventually join. The ACC gives Notre Dame Miami, Atlanta, Pittsburgh, and Boston. And UVA is not far from Washington, DC even with the loss of Maryland. Then the Carolinas and Louisville are growing areas. They are playing Syracuse in New York. The Big XII offers Kansas City and possibly Dallas. The Big Ten offers Chicago, and now Washington and New York. Notre Dame doesn't really need Chicago.

2. Having access to a good bowl line up is essential for Notre Dame in years they don't have the opportunity to be in one of the Major Bowls. The ACC has a good bowl line up. The AAC does not. The Big East doesn't have any bowls.

Taking all of this into perspective and factoring in that the ACC has a good mix of private schools of similar size to Notre Dame, it's not hard to understand why Notre Dame made the decision that they made to join the ACC. Plus many former Notre Dame administrators from athletic as well as academics are now employees of ACC schools like Duke, UNC, Wake Forest, etc. They were very accomodating and welcoming.

You are correct in that if the ACC gets approval to schedule as it likes and still hold a championship game, the ACC may sit at this configuration of 15 for a long time.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I'm going to finally say it.

Who cares.

 

[kirbivore]

I don't care what internet rumors have been floated, or what people think they know, but ND was never, ever, ever going to join the Big 12. The concept is laughable on it's face.

That one of the many pieces of crap the dude was throwing against the wall

 

[TerryD]

Now that SU is safely in the ACC, I find that conference realignment isn't quite as meaningful to me as it once was.

IF the ACC ever does add another team (regardless of whether or not ND joins full-time or not, since a change in the divisional rule might be on the horizon, 15 can be just as workable as 14), of the realistic candidates I like both UConn and Cincy. I do think UConn has the vastly superior athletics department and deserves it more so than Cincy, but a lot can happen between now and whenever this does happen, indeed - if it ever does happen.

As for ND and the ACC/Big 12/Big East partial membership debate in this thread...

Let's not forget that ND only wanted 4 games and the ACC wanted 6. The Big 12 supposedly was willing to do the 4 since they only have 10 members with Texas being a permanent partner and ND cycling through the remaining 9 members over a 6 year period. But ND agreed to go to up to 5 games to get into the ACC which they knew in advance was basically going to mean the end of all their mostly regular Big Ten match-ups that BK now laments are gone.

That, to me anyway, demonstrates how inconsequential the Big 12's offer for partial membership was to ND. The Big 12 offered them nothing since the Irish could have developed a near-annual game with Texas or even a Texas/Oklahoma combo by keeping their other sports in the Big East. And by doing that they also could have kept those Big Ten games early in the season as well.

But ND was willing to sacrifice not only their mostly regular meetings with Michigan, Michigan State, and Purdue but in addition to that sacrifice a shot at a similarly set-up potential annual rivalry with Texas (since it appears they felt their true annual rivalries with Navy, USC, and now Stanford was more important to them) to get their other sports into the ACC.

ND has never put that much emphasis on their other sports in their entire existence.

Cheers,
Neil

They still don't put THAT much emphasis on the other sports. ND does not have a separate basketball practice facility and plays in an arena that is 46 years old.

ND baseball has faltered since Paul Mainieri left for LSU. ND made a couple of uninspired hires from Evansville and BC since then.

All non-football sports have to have donors come up with the cost of constructing new facilities.

Meanwhile, ND has committed $450 million to upgrade/expand Notre Dame Stadium.

I think that the ACC deal had more to do with 5 late season games, minor bowl access and playing in the Southeast regularly for football recruiting purposes than it did with the other ND sports programs.

I am not saying that the other sports were not a factor, they certainly were, just that football aspects of the deal were more important.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This thread is still happening?

 

[shantydaze]

With the ACC removing BYU as a P5 matchup, it will be interesting to see how long they continue to be independent. It is more than just simply scheduling, it also has to do with access to the football playoffs. If the ACC does not consider than one of the big boys, it will never get an invite and BYU football, which has not been relevant for a while, will not be again for a long time.

The PAC has already decided against inviting them (which was the impetus for their independence). The B1G, ACC and SEC have no reason to ask them to join. This leaves the XII. I would not be surprised if BYU has already started talking to the XII Presidents. If the XII teams are slighted (either by being left out or getting a lower seed) from the play-offs as a result of being in a smaller conference with no CCG and no requirement its teams schedule a P5 team OOC, I can see the XII listening to BYU's overtures. They will need one more team to get back to the number in their name, which I think gets Cincy taken off the table.

If pods are allowed and the ACC wants to get to 15, it leaves them with UConn, Temple, and Tulane as potential targets. As I mentioned above, I do not think it makes sense for the ACC to bring in a team from a state in which it already has a presence, so no directional Florida school, East Carolina, etc. Out of these teams, I would be disappointed if Temple was picked, but would not mind UConn or Tulane. If Tulane can guarantee it will be focusing on athletics, I would prefer it and it would have a natural SEC rival in LSU.

 

[omniorange]

With the ACC removing BYU as a P5 matchup, it will be interesting to see how long they continue to be independent. It is more than just simply scheduling, it also has to do with access to the football playoffs. If the ACC does not consider than one of the big boys, it will never get an invite and BYU football, which has not been relevant for a while, will not be again for a long time.

The PAC has already decided against inviting them (which was the impetus for their independence). The B1G, ACC and SEC have no reason to ask them to join. This leaves the XII. I would not be surprised if BYU has already started talking to the XII Presidents. If the XII teams are slighted (either by being left out or getting a lower seed) from the play-offs as a result of being in a smaller conference with no CCG and no requirement its teams schedule a P5 team OOC, I can see the XII listening to BYU's overtures. They will need one more team to get back to the number in their name, which I think gets Cincy taken off the table.

If pods are allowed and the ACC wants to get to 15, it leaves them with UConn, Temple, and Tulane as potential targets. As I mentioned above, I do not think it makes sense for the ACC to bring in a team from a state in which it already has a presence, so no directional Florida school, East Carolina, etc. Out of these teams, I would be disappointed if Temple was picked, but would not mind UConn or Tulane. If Tulane can guarantee it will be focusing on athletics, I would prefer it and it would have a natural SEC rival in LSU.

Here's a novel idea. Let Tulane focus on athletics and turn itself into the next Stanford, Baylor, Vandy, etc before even entertaining them as an expansion candidate.

Tulane?!? Oh Lord

Cheers,
Neil

 

[HtownOrange]

Here's a novel idea. Let Tulane focus on athletics and turn itself into the next Stanford, Baylor, Vandy, etc before even entertaining them as an expansion candidate.

Tulane?!? Oh Lord

Cheers,
Neil

Agreed. The big draw with Tulane is the Away Game weekend in NOLA. Beyond that, unless Tulane improves their athletics, there really should be no talk of any P5 conference bringing them in.

 

[shantydaze]

Agreed. The big draw with Tulane is the Away Game weekend in NOLA. Beyond that, unless Tulane improves their athletics, there really should be no talk of any P5 conference bringing them in.

Which is the reason I would I would prefer it over UConn and Temple. It would be great road trip and opens up LA for recruitment.

In the end, it will likely be about markets for the new ACC channel.

 

[Opus]

This thread is still happening?

Sadly, I guess the football board is as infatuated with UCONN as the bball board. Of course the people who run this board are as well (surprise!) so I guess we have to deal with it.

 

[WickedOrange]

Let me also add... I have no doubt, NJ politicians will plunder any windfall from the big ten deal.

Already trying to get in position...

Bill increasing Trenton appointees on Rutgers' board raises ire on campus
http://www.nj.com/education/2014/05...ht_bill_to_expand_university_board_to_19.html

 

[BlackKnight76]

Nobody "owns" the NYC college market.

A winning (meaning annual NC contender) Rutgers would have the best chance to own it. But that ain't gonna happen.

An annual NC contender Rutgers is ever so slightly more realistic than a football team comprised entirely of unicorns (Emmert would never allow it).

 

[sdhusky]

An annual NC contender Rutgers is ever so slightly more realistic than a football team comprised entirely of unicorns (Emmert would never allow it).

What if Rutgers recruited a team of unicorns?

 

[HtownOrange]

What if Rutgers recruited a team of unicorns?

Anything can happen, we all know that Rutgers recruited only 5 star kids* for years, why not unicorns.

* Secret intel discovered on Rutgers sports sites wherein well intentioned but overly excited Scarlet Knights fans (all three of them) inadvertently disclosed that every kid on the team is 5 stars and will dominate in the pros. Of course, we have yet to determine which planet(s) these fans may be from, but based on records readily available they are not discussing the NFL. NASA is attempting to locate their home planet(s); however, an official NASA spokesman has reported that no nearby planets admit to being aware of Rutgers, let alone acknowledging their fans.