Symir Torrence Transferring from Marquette to Syracuse

[OttoinGrotto]

I think Symir will be fine, in the sense that when he's out there he won't do anything to hurt us. I'm glad we have that.

I don't expect that he'll change the game when he's in. Maybe on the defensive side.

Basically I'll count any plus contribution as gravy.

I'd still like another guard on scholarship that brings something a little more dynamic.

 

[Orangezoo]

How do you miss on all those recruits?Washington had one decent year . And Joe still has two more years to show us something.

Joe needs to improve but come on.

 

[Orangezoo]

I think Symir will be fine, in the sense that when he's out there he won't do anything to hurt us. I'm glad we have that.

I don't expect that he'll change the game when he's in. Maybe on the defensive side.

Basically I'll count any plus contribution as gravy.

I'd still like another guard on scholarship that brings something a little more dynamic.

I think he can change the game situationally where pressure defense makes things difficult. Beyond that we will have to see how he meshes with the others. Washington was a pass first PG too but wasn't quite the athlete Symir is or as big and strong. I'm intrigued at least to see what Symir brings. I agree essentially with everyone that if Alan does leave as expected we need to bring in another guard.

 

[DoctorBombay]

Despite the poor Marquette stats I'm sure he'll be better than those guys. I include Girard as the flaws in his game aren't going anywhere Id be surprised if people don't want Symir starting.

Long athletic guy with some skill who will know hes the 4th option offensively when hes on the floor. He should be a Duany/Pace type of contributor I'd expect and quickly a fan favorite (even though we'll all be wishing we had an NBA quality PG.)

I think JG3 comes back and has a strong year.
Again, when he took the Marquette job Shaka Smart’s first priority was to reach out and try to keep this kid. That tells me we have a lot to work w/ here.
Folks are still salty about Kadary so there’s gonna be a spotlight on the PG’s but JB made his choice. We shall see.

 

[SUskibum]

When you have scorers/shooters at the 2/3/4 then you need a point guard like Edelin not Flynn

If this guy can protect the ball vs pressure, get the offense set up and periodically beat his man off the dribble to penetrate, then he will be perfect for what we have at the rest of the positions offensively

At 6-3 and in his 3rd year of P6 Bball I bet his D will be good to great

 

[sutomcat]

I found this thread on a Marquette message board interesting. It mostly discusses Symir and his time at Marquette.

They talk about his pass first orientation, said some nice things about his defense (he has a 6’8 wing span) and his shooting slump as a sophomore. He is apparently very good running the pick and roll.

He was stuck behind Howard, MU’s all time leading scorer, as a frosh and then Carton, a 4 star transfer from OSU, as a sophomore.

He should get a lot more consistent playing time at Syracuse.

From the film I have seen, he is good passing the ball around the perimeter. Not sure how well he can penetrate and if he is capable of getting into the paint and dumping it back out to an open player on the perimeter. That would be a skill that would really come in handy on the team next season, Also not sure how well he can get the ball to Edwards (and hopefully Q) down low.

I am confident he will be good defensively from the start. Not sure I have ever seen a player drop from 37.5% from 3 to the teens in one season before. If GMac can get him to shoot near 40% from 3 next season, it will make us a lot harder to defend.

Shooting Slump (SYMIR TORRENCE, DEXTER AKANNO, JUSTIN LEWIS

Shooting Slump (SYMIR TORRENCE, DEXTER AKANNO, JUSTIN LEWIS

247sports.com

 

[djcon57]

yes, he was a 37.5 percent shooter from 3 the year before.

9-24

For reference, Kadary was 7-21 last year.

 

[Day2]

How do you miss on all those recruits?Washington had one decent year . And Joe still has two more years to show us something.

Carey was the only real miss. Nowhere near as good as advertised. Goodine wasn’t patient enough to stick around. Washington had to practically beg for us to take him.

As for Girard, did anyone really think he would be the starting PG his first two years? This coming season is probably the time when most of us envisioned him making an impact.

 

[TheCusian]

I think JG3 comes back and has a strong year.
Again, when he took the Marquette job Shaka Smart’s first priority was to reach out and try to keep this kid. That tells me we have a lot to work w/ here.
Folks are still salty about Kadary so there’s gonna be a spotlight on the PG’s but JB made his choice. We shall see.

I don’t think JB “made his choice.” I think KR made his.

 

[oTTo113445]

I could see us running some strange sets this year with a lineup of 6'6 and three guys above 6'8. I like the idea of Symir/Joe running some sideline pg action against taller guards with Buddy + Benny or Cole or Jimmy uptop in the backcourt. I could see Buddy trying out some of Hughes' game also.

 

[sutomcat]

yes, he was a 37.5 percent shooter from 3 the year before.

9-24

For reference, Kadary was 7-21 last year.

Symir was also 43.1% from 3 his last year of prep ball. I don’t have stats from the years before that but he was an excellent outside shooter when he played in Syracuse as well. Don’t have his percentage but I know he made 60 3 pointers in one season when he was in HS here.

He is a legitimate excellent outside shooter.

I hope Kadary does well at Seton Hall. It is time to let him go. He is gone and isn’t coming back.

 

[kcsu]

I think JG3 comes back and has a strong year.
Again, when he took the Marquette job Shaka Smart’s first priority was to reach out and try to keep this kid. That tells me we have a lot to work w/ here.
Folks are still salty about Kadary so there’s gonna be a spotlight on the PG’s but JB made his choice. We shall see.

PG is the most important position in basketball. Lets hope this kid can play the position well because we are an average team at best without one and unless Joe makes a dramatic improvement we wont go far.

 

[20plus]

If Kadary didn’t want to be here then a dead guy (channeling my inner JB press conference here) would be better for us than him. We got a live guy, seemingly a huge upgrade on that count alone, and half this board has their faces melt off.

I like this a lot and I like how fast JB is moving. Get these guys on the team ASAP and start teaching.

It’s not fair to say simply he didn’t want to be here so we don’t want him. It’s more reasonable to say he didn’t want to be here when he won the competition with Joe and wasn’t rewarded with six or seven more minutes but six or seven less than Joe!

 

[Cusefan69]

At the end of the day Symir wants to be at Syracuse and just like every year before that I will support the team that is on the floor. Maybe it's me but some of you all take this sport fandom stuff a bit far. It's a game. It's here for our entertainment. My guess is the majority of these young guys work their tails off to get better. If that's not good enough for you that's your issue, not theirs. So instead of all the comments of how are players are not good enough or won't be good enough, why don't those of you who are extreme fans try being a "better fans" because this constant negativity is over the top.

 

[Orangezoo]

Symir was also 43.1% from 3 his last year of prep ball. I don’t have stats from the years before that but he was an excellent outside shooter when he played in Syracuse as well. Don’t have his percentage but I know he made 60 3 pointers in one season when he was in HS here.

He is a legitimate excellent outside shooter.

I hope Kadary does well at Seton Hall. It is time to let him go. He is gone and isn’t coming back.

That slump he had was bad- it also was in the pandemic year and we saw Buddy shooting 25 pct from 3 at one point only to finish for the year at 40. Hopefully that outlier is past Symir.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Not saying we will be the same type of team, but the goal should be to get 2010 Triche/Scoop production out of the position from when they shared pg duties, were efficient and averaged a combined a little over 17 and 7 after Flynn left and fans thought we were in trouble then.

 

[Orangezoo]

Not saying we will be the same type of team, but the goal should be to get 2010 Triche/Scoop production out of the position from when they shared pg duties and were efficient and averaged a combined a little over 17 and 7 after Flynn left and fans thought we were in trouble then.

Bingo. It's not at all unrealistic either even if a little different.

We head more into next season with here is how we are going to win games vs- I think this is how we are going to win games. At least as per how things look now.

My only fear is that there was excitement and Hype as we brought in Andrew White and Gillon and then... So my optimism while on the upward swing- is still holding off until we see things on the court and how the roster finishes portal season.

 

[oTTo113445]

With Marek at the 5 playing Point forward because he was our only center for 90% of the year, we didn't have room for 3 pg's on the floor together. Kadary lost an awesome opportunity to play with Benny, Edwards and three 6'8 forwards, but we are even less likely to see a guard at forward this year. I wish him well, but Bless Joe for fighting through with literally under half the support and Joe was tied for our second-best player this tournament with Marek behind only Buddy. As a soph that's pretty impressive.

 

[orangejunkie]

Symir was a 4 star coming out of high school and was offered by SU. I don't see all the fuss about his recruitment. The issue isn't a comparison with Kadary but my question is what other top rated 4* type PG's were available and realistic recruits for SU? How many top rated transfer PG's would SU be able to attract when the there are two guards who are already two year starters?

I think that Symir was a no brainer pick up for SU. He's not going to be the shooter that Girard or Buddy are but he brings some other valuable assets. He appears to be a superior defensive/physical type of player that will provide SU with a valuable alternative.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Symir was a 4 star coming out of high school and was offered by SU. I don't see all the fuss about his recruitment. The issue isn't a comparison with Kadary but my question is what other top rated 4* type PG's were available and realistic recruits for SU? How many top rated transfer PG's would SU be able to attract when the there are two guards who are already two year starters?

I think that Symir was a no brainer pick up for SU. He's not going to be the shooter that Girard or Buddy are but he brings some other valuable assets. He appears to be a superior defensive/physical type of player that will provide SU with a valuable alternative.

This is all spot on, but two thoughts.

1, he makes sense as an addition on so many levels, but I do wish that with the portal it felt more like we really won a guy and convinced a player he belongs. Torrence is a local guy, makes sense for our roster, always wanted to be here... I'm not saying it was easy, but I mean, as these things go, probably pretty easy. Swider had the history, probably had a pretty clear idea where he'd fit... again, not easy, but did we need to do a lot of convincing? Same thing assuming Jimmy Jr. coming. The part in bold above is the thing I wonder about. Dasher has alluded to the possibility that maybe JB is fine with what we have going forward. That makes me a little uncomfortable. I'd like to see us add a guard that pushes our starters (I don't mean to bring up Kadary, but that's exactly what Kadary did). Torrence profiles like a guy that will be a bench piece but isn't a serious candidate to start. So he helps, but there's a ceiling to the impact.

2, people keep bringing up the highschool rankings, but looking at Torrence and Swider, realistically they haven't performed in college hoops to their ranking, and basically, what we're envisioning for them is that they do play up to their ranking. I'm not sure what to make of that.

 

[shu 49]

My thing with Joe is he is purely a 2 guard being forced to be a pg. He does lack some athleticism but u can make that up with pure hustle. He can pass but doesn’t a lot cause he is looking for his shot. If he gets his hands up on d, goes full speed, and makes passing a choice we can be ok.

 

[Orangezoo]

This is all spot on, but two thoughts.

1, he makes sense as an addition on so many levels, but I do wish that with the portal it felt more like we really won a guy and convinced a player he belongs. Torrence is a local guy, makes sense for our roster, always wanted to be here... I'm not saying it was easy, but I mean, as these things go, probably pretty easy. Swider had the history, probably had a pretty clear idea where he'd fit... again, not easy, but did we need to do a lot of convincing? Same thing assuming Jimmy Jr. coming. The part in bold above is the thing I wonder about. Dasher has alluded to the possibility that maybe JB is fine with what we have going forward. That makes me a little uncomfortable. I'd like to see us add a guard that pushes our starters (I don't mean to bring up Kadary, but that's exactly what Kadary did). Torrence profiles like a guy that will be a bench piece but isn't a serious candidate to start. So he helps, but there's a ceiling to the impact.

2, people keep bringing up the highschool rankings, but looking at Torrence and Swider, realistically they haven't performed in college hoops to their ranking, and basically, what we're envisioning for them is that they do play up to their ranking. I'm not sure what to make of that.

I think I've thought more about your first point than the second myself. A lot in fact. It's also why while I want another guard for next year, I'm skeptical we get it done.

As for the second bullet, I think Swider has huge potential and talent that was on display and I the tape he just wasn't on a team that fit him to give him the chance to max out.

Symir is a little different as he didn't showcase a lot, played around or behind high usage guys and played for a coach who might have some learning to do yet before being effective in high major. There was also talk about an injury he struggled with too last year which was the first I heard that and it would make sense.

Symir's case is like Elijah's in that we go back to his HS/Prep to more so than play in college. Symir may be coming home but you have to admire a kid who even after two years of things going not so much as planned he is all in for the challenge. You are seeing good players drop down to less heralded programs every day and Symir could have done the same and said bring it on.

 

[Orangezoo]

My thing with Joe is he is purely a 2 guard being forced to be a pg. He does lack some athleticism but u can make that up with pure hustle. He can pass but doesn’t a lot cause he is looking for his shot. If he gets his hands up on d, goes full speed, and makes passing a choice we can be ok.

Joe needs to watch tape of Trevor Cooney all summer. He needs to be relentless on defense every possession and work his tail off and be smart on offense. His big problem is when he isn't playing well on offense or even when he is- on defense he goes from 8-9 great possessions to 3 or 4 straight where he takes the play off. It's one thing for a kid to not be able to- it's another to simply decide not to. That needs to change and if it does we will be much better for it.

Add that to being able to move north/south and get the ball out of his hands quicker.

 

[oTTo113445]

I'd like to see us add a guard that pushes our starters (I don't mean to bring up Kadary, but that's exactly what Kadary did). Torrence profiles like a guy that will be a bench piece but isn't a serious candidate to start. So he helps, but there's a ceiling to the impact.

Agree. 3 forwards (Jimmy) 3 Guards is a bit thin. Would still like to see a 6'6-6'7 freshmen with some extra wingspan and a real motor with some ready handles to push the ball (forget shooting) who wants to take the ball away. A pure runner who has played the game and doesn't mind waiting a year or two, but could give us 10-15 if we have no choice. Unless we have something else in mind. Don't need 4 star stat lines.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Agree. 3 forwards (Jimmy) 3 Guards is a bit thin. Would still like to see a 6'6-6'7 freshmen with some extra wingspan and a real motor with some ready handles to push the ball (forget shooting) who wants to take the ball away. A pure runner who has played the game and doesn't mind waiting a year or two, but could give us 10-15 if we have no choice. Unless we have something else in mind. Don't need 4 star stat lines.

This is why I'm kind of curious if there's any possibility of Copeland reclassifying to 2021.