Syracuse football QB Eric Dungey is healthy for spring practice

[Ish88888]

He's not really risking his future any more so than any other player on the field.

Every kid on the roster puts it on the line. Starters and non-starters, game action and practice. Its a violent sport. Kudos to them all. Stay healthy boys.

 

[OburgOrange]

The Medical staff has to have that responsibility. No coach has the strength to sit a kid that he needs to win.

Have to believe Dino is not happy with the medical staff then. Dungey's father said he could have played

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Have to believe Dino is not happy with the medical staff then. Dungey's father said he could have played

Eh... not to speak for Dino, but once the season went sideways I think the smart thing was to bench Dungey anyway, and the injury paved the way for it to happen.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

If an expert says that Dungey is 100% ready to go and this expert is hired privately by the Dungey than who the hell am I to say that he shouldn't be playing. I don see Dungeys parents as the type to advise him poorly. If he and his family are good, I am good. I'm not passing any judgement or recommending he play or sit. Not my call whatsoever and I'm not going to post doom and gloom how he's one hit away etc, who isn't in football?

 

[dasher]

If an expert says that Dungey is 100% ready to go and this expert is hired privately by the Dungey than who the hell am I to say that he shouldn't be playing. I don see Dungeys parents as the type to advise him poorly. If he and his family are good, I am good. I'm not passing any judgement or recommending he play or sit. Not my call whatsoever and I'm not going to post doom and gloom how he's one hit away etc, who isn't in football?

Families have agenda's as well. They often need the kid to make it to professional football. We had a basketball player die a few years back that should not have been playing. He went dr shopping and found one that would say he could play.

 

[orangehomer]

If an expert says that Dungey is 100% ready to go and this expert is hired privately by the Dungey than who the hell am I to say that he shouldn't be playing. I don see Dungeys parents as the type to advise him poorly. If he and his family are good, I am good. I'm not passing any judgement or recommending he play or sit. Not my call whatsoever and I'm not going to post doom and gloom how he's one hit away etc, who isn't in football?

i'm still confused. I am seeing an article that his family and their private doctor are saying eric is 100% go and ready to play. has SU said anything? is the family going to the media to try and pressure the university into clearing him? or worst case, paving the way for a transfer? or am I reading too much into this and it is just an innocent article?

 

[Ish88888]

Have to believe Dino is not happy with the medical staff then. Dungey's father said he could have played

Think dino is just fine with it. If we were chasing an ACC championship, then thats the only way you could question dino. EVEN, in that situation, He would probably do whats best for ED.

 

[orangepassion]

 

[FrancoPizza]

What is the significance of 3 concussions?

It has something to do with mocking the holy trinity. Same reason that demons leave 3 scratch marks on your back and come into your room at 3:00 AM.

 

[IthacaMatt]

No doubt about it, but, I think that's the heart of the problem is that cases should be looked at individually.

The issue, as I understand it, is that they have a family doctor, a G.P., making these decisions and not a neurologist. Get a damn expert. This isn't that hard. Sorry that somebody's feelings are going to be hurt, but you're not the person most qualified to make the decision.

 

[orangehomer]

The issue, as I understand it, is that they have a family doctor, a G.P., making these decisions and not a neurologist. Get a damn expert. This isn't that hard. Sorry that somebody's feelings are going to be hurt, but you're not the person most qualified to make the decision.

you don't have to be an absolute expert on a given topic to opine on liability issues. it might be possible to argue that a person with less expertise would be more inclined to take a conservative position, but conversely you could probably argue that a less experienced expert may be inclined to take a more aggressive position to satisfy his client. in some ways, it is up to the individual expert to determine what they feel they are qualified to testify about, which ends up being the crux of thing. a responsible expert would in theory recuse themselves if they felt their expertise were insufficient to take a position worth considering, whereas another expert may be willing to go-out-on-a-limb for lack of a better explanation, in order to appease the group paying the invoice.

no one on this board had proven that they have sufficient evidence or expertise to properly dispute the findings of the man that has been tasked by SU in this particular capacity, and no one has put their professional reputation on the line in opposition to this particular man. i'm not saying I know the answer. i'm just saying that there is a long way between some family doctor saying the kid can play football to the media, and a doctor taking the stand and saying a kid is concussion free. it might be the grayest of areas.

 

[hungrychuck]

Honestly, the media coverage provided to this topic has sensationalized it to the point where everybody is up in arms about a topic they really know nothing about.

Nobody can prove that three concussions will harm quality of life 25 years down the road.

One concussion may harm one individual and 112 may not harm another. We can be as conservative as we want as a society, but, it's up to each individual person what they're willing sacrifice for anything, not just concussions.

Common sense tells you that ramming your head into something is probably bad. But, football's not the only thing that presents an opportunity to do that. And, nobody really currently knows how it's effecting anybody other than the person who sustains the injury.

I'm pro-choice, not pro-injury.

With all respect, don't believe that is fair at all.

If you're talking about the sensationalism in some of Bud's columns, then yes. But we know Bud is Bud and I don't think anyone takes him seriously.

Syracuse.com reported in November that Eric's injury was not career-ending, and that the second opinion had only to do with whether he would return within the 2016 season. This was attributed to an anonymous source. Some speculated that source to be the Dungey family. With the current article, I would say the people who speculated such were very smart people.

Syracuse.com also went deep into the concussion issue and reported that many doctors, including one attending the Pittsburgh Steelers, said they would not disqualify a player purely based on the number of concussions -- the issue is much more nuanced and depends on severity, etc.

Just to be clear, I have no connection whatsoever to syracuse.com, except that I hate to see the messenger blamed -- and especially in a case where what they've reported is quite the opposite of what's being said on this board.

Glad Eric is OK, but once again, to my knowledge the only people who have ended his career are the Holiday Inn Express doctors on this board and on syracuse.com.

 

[kcsu]

i don't know anything about concussions but it seems weird to have an arbitrary number (3) of concussions to automatically end your Syracuse career. What is the significance of 3 concussions?

There is no significance other than we have a doctor making decisions who can't tell the difference between a vagina and an ear.

 

[orangeman410]

There is no significance other than we have a doctor making decisions who can't tell the difference between a vagina and an ear.

I actually think it's a smart move by the university. If a kid has a few concussions, he becomes in jeopardy of being medically disqualified. Let's be honest, most of these kids want to continue playing whether it's the safe thing to do or not. They decide they want to go to a third party "expert" to get a second opinion and try to get cleared to play. BOOM! liability for clearing the kid to play is no longer on Syracuse University.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Families have agenda's as well. They often need the kid to make it to professional football. We had a basketball player die a few years back that should not have been playing. He went dr shopping and found one that would say he could play.

Understood. But again athletes choice and I don't think Eric's parents "need" him to play pro ball. A families agenda is their business not mine or anyone elses. That's my whole point, in Dungeys case nobody even knows what He has been through passed or failed, it's a ton of speculation, rush to judgement and doom and gloom.

Kid is cleared to play so play, his choice

 

[Finwad32]

With all respect, don't believe that is fair at all.

If you're talking about the sensationalism in some of Bud's columns, then yes. But we know Bud is Bud and I don't think anyone takes him seriously.

Syracuse.com reported in November that Eric's injury was not career-ending, and that the second opinion had only to do with whether he would return within the 2016 season. This was attributed to an anonymous source. Some speculated that source to be the Dungey family. With the current article, I would say the people who speculated such were very smart people.

Syracuse.com also went deep into the concussion issue and reported that many doctors, including one attending the Pittsburgh Steelers, said they would not disqualify a player purely based on the number of concussions -- the issue is much more nuanced and depends on severity, etc.

Just to be clear, I have no connection whatsoever to syracuse.com, except that I hate to see the messenger blamed -- and especially in a case where what they've reported is quite the opposite of what's being said on this board.

Glad Eric is OK, but once again, to my knowledge the only people who have ended his career are the Holiday Inn Express doctors on this board and on syracuse.com.

I'm talking about sensationalism of concussions in general, not Eric or Syracuse.com individually.

And, that's not debatable. Say concussion in a crowded room and witness the reactions. People didn't form their thoughts and opinions on their own during quiet time.

And in regards to the PS, they weren't irresponsible this time around. But, they certainly were during ED's FR season. They claimed head injury and concussion on more than one occasion when it wasn't verified. Rumor and journalism don't go well together.

 

[jr4750]

The issue, as I understand it, is that they have a family doctor, a G.P., making these decisions and not a neurologist. Get a damn expert. This isn't that hard. Sorry that somebody's feelings are going to be hurt, but you're not the person most qualified to make the decision.

Almost an issue of malpractice, if this was in fact true. In general GP's are highly intelligent people, as they are forced to know about the body as a whole, and not focus on one small part, however, specialists exist for that same reason. So that a patient can get a much more seasoned professional opinion on a difficult medical case. If SU doesn't have a neurologist/neurosurgeon, making these determinations, then someone has grossly screwed up.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

With all of the attention that CTE is getting and all of the research that's going into concussions, I'm fine with an extremely conservative approach. Head injuries are BAD. Really, really bad. And while players are free to do as they please, ultimately, it's the university that provides the equipment, gives medical clearance, and employs the people who tell the players what to do on the field. So if the university and its agent, the athletic department, want to play it super careful, I'm all for it.

 

[Finwad32]

With all of the attention that CTE is getting and all of the research that's going into concussions, I'm fine with an extremely conservative approach. Head injuries are BAD. Really, really bad. And while players are free to do as they please, ultimately, it's the university that provides the equipment, gives medical clearance, and employs the people who tell the players what to do on the field. So if the university and its agent, the athletic department, want to play it super careful, I'm all for it.

A conservative approach is fine, but, if a player wants to see a specialist they should provide the resources to do so. My understanding is that they currently don't, and that's the real issue. With a decision as important as this one is to these kids, they shouldn't be paying their own way to an expert in a given field because the GP provided by the school is inexperienced in that area and err's on the side of caution to protect his ass, not because he's properly assessed the situation.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

A conservative approach is fine, but, if a player wants to see a specialist they should provide the resources to do so. My understanding is that they currently don't, and that's the real issue. With a decision as important as this one is to these kids, they shouldn't be paying their own way to an expert in a given field because the GP provided by the school is inexperienced in that area and err's on the side of caution to protect his ass, not because he's properly assessed the situation.

I think your charge of the team doctor taking a CYA approach is a little extreme. Unless you know lots about this situation that I don't (which is entirely likely), saying that someone isn't properly handling head injuries seems awfully harsh and unfair. Especially when they're erring on the side of caution.

I certainly agree with you that any and every medical resource should be provided to players.

 

[bcubs9497]

I think your charge of the team doctor taking a CYA approach is a little extreme. Unless you know lots about this situation that I don't (which is entirely likely), saying that someone isn't properly handling head injuries seems awfully harsh and unfair. Especially when they're erring on the side of caution.

I certainly agree with you that any and every medical resource should be provided to players.

Not as extreme as you might think...

 

[Finwad32]

I think your charge of the team doctor taking a CYA approach is a little extreme. Unless you know lots about this situation that I don't (which is entirely likely), saying that someone isn't properly handling head injuries seems awfully harsh and unfair. Especially when they're erring on the side of caution.

I certainly agree with you that any and every medical resource should be provided to players.

Very fair point of view.

I don't want to say he's mishandled it, I should choose my words more carefully. I'll liken it to my ability to read contracts, although I'm able to read and diagnose a contract I'm not a lawyer and shouldn't have final say on them. Much like a Doctor whose specialty is not in a given field should not in my opinion be making decisions within that field that are tied to that much consequence.

But, I still do think he's taking a CYA approach. For a multitude of reasons. And even if he wasn't, I'd still be championing for a specialist to have the say.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Time to stop running so many QB options. Huge emphasis on sliding or getting out bounds must happen this offseason. No more leaping over defenders. He is too valuable for our team (wait... some people apparently told me that DeVito would be a better option from the start, LOL). Watch film of Russell Wilson.

At the end of the day you can teach a man to fish but if he would rather dive into the lake and try to catch them by hand, that's on him. It seems like Dungey just has that mentality.

Happy to hear he will be back.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

Very fair point of view.

I don't want to say he's mishandled it, I should choose my words more carefully. I'll liken it to my ability to read contracts, although I'm able to read and diagnose a contract I'm not a lawyer and shouldn't have final say on them. Much like a Doctor whose specialty is not in a given field should not in my opinion be making decisions within that field that are tied to that much consequence.

But, I still do think he's taking a CYA approach. For a multitude of reasons. And even if he wasn't, I'd still be championing for a specialist to have the say.

That's perfectly fair and a great analogy. I'm just overly sensitive to the idea that anyone, especially in this situation, is acting in bad faith. I feel like that's always a lurking issue in message boards.

 

[TheCusian]

you don't have to be an absolute expert on a given topic to opine on liability issues. it might be possible to argue that a person with less expertise would be more inclined to take a conservative position, but conversely you could probably argue that a less experienced expert may be inclined to take a more aggressive position to satisfy his client. in some ways, it is up to the individual expert to determine what they feel they are qualified to testify about, which ends up being the crux of thing. a responsible expert would in theory recuse themselves if they felt their expertise were insufficient to take a position worth considering, whereas another expert may be willing to go-out-on-a-limb for lack of a better explanation, in order to appease the group paying the invoice.

no one on this board had proven that they have sufficient evidence or expertise to properly dispute the findings of the man that has been tasked by SU in this particular capacity, and no one has put their professional reputation on the line in opposition to this particular man. i'm not saying I know the answer. i'm just saying that there is a long way between some family doctor saying the kid can play football to the media, and a doctor taking the stand and saying a kid is concussion free. it might be the grayest of areas.

Presumably, the expert the family sought who cleared him put his reputation against the family doctor. Usually the specialist wins. That's why we should have a specialist review concussions.