The cupboard was bare defensively for this staff

[Oswego93]

If you can't tell the difference between the garbage that we've had on the field for so long and what we're seeing on offense now then I really don't know what to tell you.

Yes, that was a stellar performance tonight. I've been an avid folllower of the program since 1988. I won't say that this is the worst I have ever felt about the program, but I will say that this seems like groundhog day. Are we better on O? Unquestionably. We are not THAT much better on O to offset how much worse we are on D.

 

[two3zone]

Yes, that was a stellar performance tonight. I've been an avid folllower of the program since 1988. I won't say that this is the worst I have ever felt about the program, but I will say that this seems like groundhog day. Are we better on O? Unquestionably. We are not THAT much better on O to offset how much worse we are on D.

We lost 8 games in a row last year by an average of 2 touchdowns. Our defense wasn't good last year either.

I don't think anybody expected our defense to be at any sort of respectable level, but I have no problem saying that I believe our offense is such a difference maker than years past that we're going to be winning games where the opponent scores 35+ points in a game.

We need serious help on the defensive end, I'm sure our coach agrees, but he isn't going to come out and say it.

 

[TheCusian]

Yes we do and yes we will. Sorry but this staff inherited a roster devoid of talent in many areas. They will do well but this isn't a quick fix. Marrone left Shafer with mediocre talent and Shafer left Babers with mediocre talent. That kind of thing doesn't get fixed in two games. Look at our roster and tell me who will be playing at the next level. Teams like Louisville blow our talent away.

Agreed. Too big a talent deficit. The staff will recruit better kids for this system.

I think Z.Franklin, Slayton, Clark, and Winfield could be next level guys.

 

[orangehomer]

That is my point. When GRob came aboard, the excuse was that P left the cupboard bare. Likewise, when FHCDM came on, GRob had left us with nothing. Now I'm learning that when Shafer took the helm, he had nothing, and of course babers has been left with nothing now.

But THIS TIME, I'm supposed to believe it will be different! Just as soon as the new guy gets his recruits here?

Exactly

 

[TheCusian]

Yes, that was a stellar performance tonight. I've been an avid folllower of the program since 1988. I won't say that this is the worst I have ever felt about the program, but I will say that this seems like groundhog day. Are we better on O? Unquestionably. We are not THAT much better on O to offset how much worse we are on D.

Key component that you forgot: a top 5 O and maybe the Heisman winner. And their D will be top 15. So yeah - you should be encouraged by the O and it will eclipse our issues on D in about half of the games left.

 

[Digger]

Not one pro on the roster. (unless a true frosh emerges out of nowhere)

I think Slayton has a legit chance.

 

[TheCusian]

Exactly

Come back next year, hopefully there will be space left on the bandwagon

 

[two3zone]

Exactly

The reason I think this will be different this time is that Babers is doing something different. For one thing is recruiting outside of New England. He has a plan. He's a playing a fun brand of football. Being a fan since the Coach Mac days, I can honestly say I haven't have had this much belief in a coach since freaking Y2K.

 

[McNabb2Brominski]

I wish Marrone never left.

There, I said it.

 

[sdhall01]

Exactly

We have two starting defensive ends that have never played at this level, and the best player on our defensive line left. Also, we dismissed 2 DEs last year. The cupboard is bare, and it is Shafer's fault.

 

[sdhall01]

I wish Marrone never left.

There, I said it.

I wish Marrone never left either, but he did. He left and he saddled us with Scott Shafer, and Scott Shafer squandered this team's momentum. So we need a guy like Babers who can build us back from oblivion.

 

[RF2044]

Seems like I have have heard this story before...just wait until the next few classes come in...until they do...and nothing changes

Give me a break.

You've heard this story before with coaches who were inadequate. If you don't think that Dino Babers puts us in a different competitive position, or that we're not going to be a helluva lot better in 2 years under this coaching staff with the way they're recruiting, I'm not sure what to tell you.

 

[iommi]

I think Slayton has a legit chance.

Okay, yeah, he's a maybe. I agree.

 

[two3zone]

I wish Marrone never left.

There, I said it.

Neither do the Bills.

 

[djorange1989]

That is my point. When GRob came aboard, the excuse was that P left the cupboard bare. Likewise, when FHCDM came on, GRob had left us with nothing. Now I'm learning that when Shafer took the helm, he had nothing, and of course babers has been left with nothing now.

But THIS TIME, I'm supposed to believe it will be different! Just as soon as the new guy gets his recruits here?

Anyone who made excuses for GROB should be drug tested. Marrone was successful. Babers has head coaching experience and success coming over here which none of the last three had when they got here. I understand your skepticism however, our fan base has been kicked in the groin way too many times. I do believe in Babers, however

 

[RF2044]

I wish Marrone never left either, but he did. He left and he saddled us with Scott Shafer, and Scott Shafer squandered this team's momentum. So we need a guy like Babers who can build us back from oblivion.

Agreed. Marrone's departure--coupled with him ransacking the staff on the way out the door--was crippling. BTW, the team hadn't turned the corner in 2012, people's perception of that year are clouded by the great "close" to that season, and overlook that we were 4-5 at one point and in danger of not qualifying for a bowl.

We finished 2012 with a flourish, and the future seemed bright. But the program was in a precarious position, and losing the best four players [Nassib, Lemon, Sales, and Pugh] who were the principals of the offensive resurgence. Recruiting hadn't replenished the coffers, either, and we were in a position where making the wrong hire could easily undo the progress we'd gained and cause the program to backslide.

We made the wrong hire.

 

[orangezen]

We just ran into a well oiled machine equipped with a new turbo ...

 

[djorange1989]

Agreed. Too big a talent deficit. The staff will recruit better kids for this system.

I think Z.Franklin, Slayton, Clark, and Winfield could be next level guys.

Agree about Clark and Slayton. Possibly Ish. I think Franklin is too small. Winfield is possible.

 

[Bortukal]

That is my point. When GRob came aboard, the excuse was that P left the cupboard bare. Likewise, when FHCDM came on, GRob had left us with nothing. Now I'm learning that when Shafer took the helm, he had nothing, and of course babers has been left with nothing now.

But THIS TIME, I'm supposed to believe it will be different! Just as soon as the new guy gets his recruits here?

You said it. Different year, same story.

 

[sdhall01]

Agreed. Marrone's departure--coupled with him ransacking the staff on the way out the door--was crippling. BTW, the team hadn't turned the corner in 2012, people's perception of that year are clouded by the great "close" to that season, and overlook that we were 4-5 at one point and in danger of not qualifying for a bowl.

We finished 2012 with a flourish, and the future seemed bright. But the program was in a precarious position, and losing the best four players [Nassib, Lemon, Sales, and Pugh] who were the principals of the offensive resurgence. Recruiting hadn't replenished the coffers, either, and we were in a position where making the wrong hire could easily undo the progress we'd gained and cause the program to backslide.

We made the wrong hire.

I still cannot believe we went in house and chose Shafer instead of Hackett.

 

[sdhall01]

You said it. Different year, same story.

No! No we didn't! People—people that don't know what they're talking about—said that Shafer needed time to "build his team." He didn't. Shafer was a continuity hire not a rebuilding hire. Dino Babers is a rebuilding hire, Doug Marrone was a rebuilding hire. You have to let those people rebuild. That's the difference between the statement "he needs his players" last year verses this year.

 

[Digger]

That was obviously a horrific defensive performance, but I don't get how that's the takeaway for some fans. Our defense sucks. No s&@t.

Our brand new offense tho (which is the only thing that matters this year) absolutely flashed against a legit top 10 team with pro talent all over the place on defense.

We're watching the installation of an offensive system that is going to single-handedly turn the football program around. Enjoy it.

 

[Finwad32]

I mean we have a couple of nice players on defense but this staff is going to need 2-3 recruiting classes to bring in the talent we will need on the defensive side of the ball.

The problem isn't scheme. It this is the roster right now.

Bs

You want to lay this on depth and less talent, fine. But don't act like a 62 burger is on the feet of the players, because it's just not true.

 

[RF2044]

I still cannot believe we went in house and chose Shafer instead of Hackett.

When Marrone left, I implored the AD [on this forum, not suggesting I had any influence] to conduct a national job search, and to not be afraid to open up the coffers with the ACC revenues we'd soon be earning to bring in a qualified candidate with head coaching experience.

Instead, we made an inside hire citing "continuity" as the basis. Then, 75% of the coaching staff left, so continuity went out the window. What made matters worse--in addition to Shafer not having any proven qualifications--was that he went out and cobbled together a staff that was more about putting the band back together instead of getting more proven commodities.

I don't know that Hackett would have been any more successful, frankly. I think the offensive concept would have been more competent, but the previous staff did not replenish the offensive talent that departed in 2012. It would have been an uphill challenge.

 

[sdhall01]

When Marrone left, I implored the AD to conduct a national job search, and to open up the coffers with the ACC revenues we'd soon be earning to bring in a qualified candidate with head coaching experience.

Instead, we made an inside hire citing "continuity" as the basis. Then, 75% of the coaching staff left, so continuity went out the window. What made matters worse--in addition to Shafer not having any proven qualifications--was that he went out and cobbled together a staff that was more about putting the band back together instead of getting more proven commodities.

I don't know that Hackett would have been any more successful, frankly. I think the offensive concept would have been more competent, but the previous staff did not replenish the offensive talent that departed in 2012. It would have been an uphill challenge.

That's a fair point about Hackett. I always assumed he would have been better because I remember what happened to our recruiting class when he left. Specifically, I remember a bunch of our touted offensive recruits looking at other places. I just assumed we would have been better off if the offensive players stayed committed as opposed to the defensive players. Especially considering that Hackett seemed like he had a good head on his shoulders.