These kids deserve better….

[rrlbees]

rrlbees said: ↑ I don't blame the fans. It's a history of poor decisions made by SU.] I do. They don't get to reference Kenneth Shaw forever. The success of this program rests in their hands. They haven't earned the right to complain if they are not willing to drop a few dollars into this program's coffers. Sorry. I totally disagree, the fate of the program rest in the hands of the administration. THEIR lack of support shows in the lack of funding and sub par facilities. This is far far worse that 21K fans in the stands.

One more point about your post. While I give some heat to the non local alumni here, I believe in reality attendance should be expected more of CNY (not agreeing they don't have a reason to attend) than alumni. We just don't have a huge alumni base like the large state schools where many stay nearby. BUT, when it comes to donations to the program and/or school, that responsibility falls MUCH more on alumni than local yocals. Locals may go to games and might even donate for preferred seating. But it is for entertainment purposes even if some are diehards. But it is not "their school". It is THE school of the alumni and financial support lies there.

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[Louie&Bouie]

One more point about your post. While I give some heat to the non local alumni here, I believe in reality attendance should be expected more of CNY (not agreeing they don't have a reason to attend) than alumni. We just don't have a huge alumni base like the large state schools where many stay nearby. BUT, when it comes to donations to the program and/or school, that responsibility falls MUCH more on alumni than local yocals. Locals may go to games and might even donate for preferred seating. But it is for entertainment purposes even if some are diehards. But it is not "their school". It is THE school of the alumni and financial support lies there.

I think you're misinterpreting what I was trying to say, or I said it poorly, Bees. I'm not suggesting that a non-alumni should be held responsible for the financial well-being of the program. On that point, I agree with you 100%.

But I am tired of locals who sit around and complain about the program, and NEVER attend a game or support the kids. If you're not willing to invest in a game ticket, and stand up and cheer for a group of young men who are busting their assess and putting their best efforts in, regardless of the outcome, then it is my opinion that your voice doesn't, and shouldn't, count. There are always tickets to be had. Hell, I couldn't give two away last weekend. That's a joke.

Last year a family friend (non-alum) called me in the middle of hoops season and told me that the basketball team was full of quitters (his exact words). He also sat on my couch and cheered endlessly as the team made their way to Atlanta. That type of attitude towards our sports programs is a joke. Plain and simple.

 

[rrlbees]

I think you're misinterpreting what I was trying to say, or I said it poorly, Bees. I'm not suggesting that a non-alumni should be held responsible for the financial well-being of the program. On that point, I agree with you 100%. But I am tired of locals who sit around and complain about the program, and NEVER attend a game or support the kids. If you're not willing to invest in a game ticket, and stand up and cheer for a group of young men who are busting their assess and putting their best efforts in, regardless of the outcome, then it is my opinion that your voice doesn't, and shouldn't, count. There are always tickets to be had. Hell, I couldn't give two away last weekend. That's a joke. Last year a family friend (non-alum) called me in the middle of hoops season and told me that the basketball team was full of quitters (his exact words). He also sat on my couch and cheered endlessly as the team made their way to Atlanta. That type of attitude towards our sports programs is a joke. Plain and simple.

I didn't quote your post. But I agree with the above. I don't even listen to anyone that goes to no games but complains all the time.

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[Bayside44]

One more point about your post. While I give some heat to the non local alumni here, I believe in reality attendance should be expected more of CNY (not agreeing they don't have a reason to attend) than alumni. We just don't have a huge alumni base like the large state schools where many stay nearby. BUT, when it comes to donations to the program and/or school, that responsibility falls MUCH more on alumni than local yocals. Locals may go to games and might even donate for preferred seating. But it is for entertainment purposes even if some are diehards. But it is not "their school". It is THE school of the alumni and financial support lies there.

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SU had NO program to reach out to alumni. It should be run like the political parties run their low and mid dollar fundraising - every now and then some of those people with break through for the 6 figure checks.

 

[SF Cuse]

One more point about your post. While I give some heat to the non local alumni here, I believe in reality attendance should be expected more of CNY (not agreeing they don't have a reason to attend) than alumni. We just don't have a huge alumni base like the large state schools where many stay nearby. BUT, when it comes to donations to the program and/or school, that responsibility falls MUCH more on alumni than local yocals. Locals may go to games and might even donate for preferred seating. But it is for entertainment purposes even if some are diehards. But it is not "their school". It is THE school of the alumni and financial support lies there.

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I think this is dead on. Not only to we have a much smaller alumni base than the publics, most other private schools have a much higher percentage of alumni that stay local - BC, Northwestern, USC, etc.

 

[rrlbees]

SU had NO program to reach out to alumni. It should be run like the political parties run their low and mid dollar fundraising - every now and then some of those people with break through for the 6 figure checks.

Oh I agree. The way they run things makes one wonder sometimes.

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[TheCusian]

No. You don't have to win those teams when you're still learning to walk as a program and crawl as a team. Get pissed we lost to Pitt. Shrug that we lost to fla st, no matter how big. If thats the standard then the bottom line is CNYers are entitled, primadonas with an incredibly high floor and misguided views of how the school should perform. It's sad, they're not bills. They need to thank the alumni four tv ratings thus keeping them nationally relevant, and do their part and show up. It's 6, fluckin 6, afternoons of top level college football for cryin out loud.

Look - I'm not defending them. I did exactly what you suggest - disgust at Pitt, shrug of the shoulders at FSU. The truth remains: fair weather fans are the difference between a sell out and 30,000. They don't follow college football close enough to care that it would have required a miracle to win vs FSU. They just see us getting our a#% kicked and write off the team - they lack the proper perspective.

We need to schedule some wins and be more competitive vs the top shelf with an exciting playmaker or two on offense ...

It's the same thing that happens with the media, BTW. Blowouts give the perception that we are worse than we are. While BC and Rutgers win some easy games, throw in a decent win vs VT or Arkansas - and get tons of love. It's the perception that matters.

 

[CuseOnly]

Who referenced Shaw? The success of this program lies with SU, not the fans. You have it backwards.

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Check post #23

You said this:I don't blame the fans. It's a history of poor decisions made by SU.]

Louie and Bouie referenced Shaw...

I responded by saying the below, I was actually agreeing with you. I just couldn't figure out who said what.
I totally disagree, the fate of the program rest in the hands of the administration. THEIR lack of support shows in the lack of funding and sub par facilities. This is far far worse that 21K fans in the stands.

 

[CuseOnly]

One more point about your post. While I give some heat to the non local alumni here, I believe in reality attendance should be expected more of CNY (not agreeing they don't have a reason to attend) than alumni. We just don't have a huge alumni base like the large state schools where many stay nearby. BUT, when it comes to donations to the program and/or school, that responsibility falls MUCH more on alumni than local yocals. Locals may go to games and might even donate for preferred seating. But it is for entertainment purposes even if some are diehards. But it is not "their school". It is THE school of the alumni and financial support lies there.

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Bees, I was agreeing with you...Louie and Bouie made the Shaw comment.

It seems that the majority of fans that I encounter are locals at the games, I am not an alum but I have missed 1 home game in the last 4-5 years.

I fault the school because their lack of support is pretty evident. The worst part about their lack of support is that it is seen by everybody. This is the reason for the lack of support from the fans, lack of financial support from the alums and donors. How long does anybody think that locals or alums are going to donate and attend games when it is a one way street.

It's like being in a bad relationship. One side takes and takes while the other side keeps giving until they have had enough. Whether it be their time, support or money. Eventually everyone has their breaking point where they say THIS, if they won't show the same level of commitment that they ask of fans.

Show some commitment and do something WITHOUT the fans, donors or alums having to pay for it. I have yet to see this in all my years of being a fan. For a Billion dollar University and the largest employer that is tax exempt, they have their hand out an awful lot.

 

[Scooch]

We had 48,000 for a game last month.

Just win some freakin' games and try not to be dead ass boring and ugly doing it.

It really is that simple.

 

[Dcuse]

Why should fans invest in a product that is mind numbing to watch. The university clearly doesn't reinvest into its own program. That shows with the money they pay their own coaches, the lack of an ipf, and lack of excitement through advertising. Just look at the mcnabb jersey retiring. Other than the people on this board who knew about it. Hate to say it but if the university treats the team like a joke then why should the casual fan treat it any other way. And this is from a guy who goes to 90% of the home games and tries to hit at least one road game a year. The product on the field and in the stands is a direct result of the universities lack of input.

Can you please,please,please tell us all what else you would like them to do? Honestly I am so sick and tired of the lame blame on the University. We have the freakin cheapest tickets in the country in a good venue,they are efforting an IPF,they pay their coaches what they can with the lame-ass gate they get. Do you want a billboard in your front lawn advertising the next game? Does McNabb need to knock on your door and invite you to his ceremony? Honestly,what would make you all interested in going?

 

[two3zone]

it's too boring they're not leaving because Syracuse can't win down a point they're leaving because it sucks to sit through these games

I went to one game this year and the only game I've been to since before 1997. While not a huge football fan I try to catch as many on tv as I can but I really do not enjoy watching the games at the dome. The atmosphere is awful, parking is awful and expensive, it's bitter cold outside, and being a tall guy the seats are very uncomfortable. The product on the field is god awful and doesn't help. Money as well, I'd rather go to the bar and throw down 25 bucks on a few pitches and watch the game than blow 60+ dollars on tickets, food, parking, beer, all while being surrounded by geriatrics who look at you when you stand up and cheer.

 

[Jeremy L.]

I can't speak on people not going to games. But I can speak on the reasons that I go to a game.

1. I love Syracuse athletics, and I love Syracuse football. Do I love it as much as I love basketball? No. But I have season tickets and I still go to every game and I support the team.

2. It's fun. Does it cost money? Yeah it does, but nowadays what doesn't cost money? You can spend $100 (break that down into how many hours you'd have to work to make that. It isn't much.) and get season tickets. I personally hate the "it costs too much" excuse. For single game tickets yeah it does, but spend $100 on the season tickets and you aren't spending THAT much.

3. Football is great to watch. Who cares who Syracuse is playing? Who cares if Syracuse is winning? You go because you love the sport and you support your team. You can be frustrated, but one shouldn't say "WELL IF THEY ACTUALLY WON SOME GAMES MAYBE I'D INVEST." You should go because it's fun to go and watch football. A lot of people on these boards are Buffalo Bills fans. News flash, the Bills suck. But I guarantee that if you could you'd go to a Bills game in a heartbeat because they're you're favorite team, no matter who they're playing. Buffalo does a great job of selling out that stadium and they're pretty mediocre. The fans care about their team, and so should we.



This topic really frustrates me. Fans can do what they want. But sometimes it's more than wins and losses that should make your decision about supporting our team.

 

[storange]

That is a huge exaggeration. I go outside every single halftime. Not a single person left at halftime thru the gate I was outside of.

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yep attendance is disappointing, I'm not debating that, but its not as bad as we think as I look at other mediocre programs in the ACC and their half empty stadiums

 

[SF Cuse]

I can't speak on people not going to games. But I can speak on the reasons that I go to a game.

1. I love Syracuse athletics, and I love Syracuse football. Do I love it as much as I love basketball? No. But I have season tickets and I still go to every game and I support the team.

2. It's fun. Does it cost money? Yeah it does, but nowadays what doesn't cost money? You can spend $100 (break that down into how many hours you'd have to work to make that. It isn't much.) and get season tickets. I personally hate the "it costs too much" excuse. For single game tickets yeah it does, but spend $100 on the season tickets and you aren't spending THAT much.

3. Football is great to watch. Who cares who Syracuse is playing? Who cares if Syracuse is winning? You go because you love the sport and you support your team. You can be frustrated, but one shouldn't say "WELL IF THEY ACTUALLY WON SOME GAMES MAYBE I'D INVEST." You should go because it's fun to go and watch football. A lot of people on these boards are Buffalo Bills fans. News flash, the Bills suck. But I guarantee that if you could you'd go to a Bills game in a heartbeat because they're you're favorite team, no matter who they're playing. Buffalo does a great job of selling out that stadium and they're pretty mediocre. The fans care about their team, and so should we.



This topic really frustrates me. Fans can do what they want. But sometimes it's more than wins and losses that should make your decision about supporting our team.

Thanks for saying this. Agree with everything you said, except liking hoops more than football Seriously, great post.

Go Orange.

 

[CuseOnly]

Can you please,please,please tell us all what else you would like them to do? Honestly I am so sick and tired of the lame blame on the University. We have the freakin cheapest tickets in the country in a good venue,they are efforting an IPF,they pay their coaches what they can with the lame-ass gate they get. Do you want a billboard in your front lawn advertising the next game? Does McNabb need to knock on your door and invite you to his ceremony? Honestly,what would make you all interested in going?

I don't think that the attendance has anything to do with the offense being boring, nothing to do with coaching, nothing even to do with prices or parking or what they pay the coaches. These are just excuses that will eventually disappear when we have a program that the alums and community can be proud of. That doesn't just mean wins on the field. That means facilities that make us competitive in every aspect of recruiting, wins on the field, gameday experience. Give me a program where I CAN'T point a finger and say "...THAT right there is why we are behind everyone else." And if I can point a finger at something, then change it immediately, not 5-10 years too late.

Yes, I will Blame the university.

I think it has everything to do with the Universities lack of support. Believe it or not, the fans see it, hear it and read about it and say "...well, if they won't support their own program enough to invest in winning, why should I?" Precisely why people change their thinking with SU basketball and will walk the hill in a blizzard, tons of support which down the road equals wins.

If fans go to the games and show support, that condones the behavior and the behavior continues. Maybe we have reached a point where fans won't support the program unless the school does.

With the money being spent on facilities by schools these days, the old way of waiting on donations is on life support and fading fast as we are in the midst of learning now with SU Football. Doing things "The way we have always done it" has led to multi-billion dollar banks and companies falling behind and going under.

Attitudes at the top of the Hill need to change first before attitudes at the bottom of the Hill will.

What happens if nothing changes...that's right, nothing.

 

[NineOneSeven]

sorry, thats fluckin stoopid.

who the cares??!

people actually use that as reason???

getting beat by the potential NCAA Champ, hurts attendence??

puhinleaz

im sick of these blowout loss bullshlit excuses

florida got beat by a d3 team, will they play before an empty house soon??

screw the no shows.

this will be turned around and them then too.

reminds me of a raider game i went too about 20 years ago.

they had been down for a bit but were on a rise that basically went nowhere but,

pulled into the lot and there was darth raider, spike shoulderpad guy, some guy with a sword right out of pulp fiction and the rest of that gang with a huge ass banner spraypainted with black letters that read.....

BANDWAGON FANS GO HOME

i agreed then and agree now. i was also scared to death and bought a underground, black raider tshirt out of some guys pantleg for $10 in a preemptive survival effort, i digress but the point remains...

it says alot

Interesting rant.

TheCusian was spot on though. The people who most are referring to in this thread, ie the "casuals", are easily manipulated by simplicity. They see a score like ga tech, like Clemson, like FSU, and form their own opinions of the team."wow, typical Syracuse. We suck."

Whether you like it or not, it's reality.

 

[OttoForLife]

But sometimes it's more than wins and losses that should make your decision about supporting our team.

Nope. It's a business not a charity. Don't tell people how to spend their money "for the greater good." The product isn't good enough and/or isn't being packaged well enough for people to pony up.

 

[Bayside44]

Our basketball team scored 92 points in 2 hours, our football team 16 in 4 hours...

 

[Chip]

it's too boring

they're not leaving because Syracuse can't win down a point

they're leaving because it sucks to sit through these games

That's ridiculous. They shouldn't go in the first place, (and I know many of them aren't). But to take the time to actually go to the game and then leave a close game with 8 minutes left because you find it too boring? That is the worst.

 

[Chip]

Our basketball team scored 92 points in 2 hours, our football team 16 in 4 hours...

Again, apples and newspapers. One could argue that our basketball team gave up 81 points in 2 hours and our football team gave up 17 points in 4 hours.

 

[Bayside44]

Again, apples and newspapers. One could argue that our basketball team gave up 81 points in 2 hours and our football team gave up 17 points in 4 hours.

A lot more entertainment and skill in half the time. There's a joke there somewhere...

 

[Ozcuse]

Can you please,please,please tell us all what else you would like them to do? Honestly I am so sick and tired of the lame blame on the University. We have the freakin cheapest tickets in the country in a good venue,they are efforting an IPF,they pay their coaches what they can with the lame-ass gate they get. Do you want a billboard in your front lawn advertising the next game? Does McNabb need to knock on your door and invite you to his ceremony? Honestly,what would make you all interested in going?

I go to every home game so I don't rationally fit into the following comparison but hear me out.

My wife tries to get me to go to stupid Rom-Com movies all the time. I hate them and think it's a waste of 2+/- hours of my day/night. She could tell me the movie is half price, no price, will buy me dinner to go, etc. and I wouldn't willingly go to it. Why? Because it's not entertaining to me and it's a waste of my time.

Now think of that when looking at this through the lens of a casual fan. Your argument that the tickets are the cheapest in FBS football doesn't matter when the product is not appealing to someone. Throw in the cost to travel, inconvenience of parking, crappy food choices, etc. and it's not that hard to believe that some people may not want to spend their afternoons or evenings supporting something they don't enjoy at the moment.

We are fanatics. That's why we spend our time on this board. WE ARE A SMALL MINORITY OF THE FANBASE. People here need to understand that we are the irrational ones, not the casual fans.

Win, make it exciting, and make it as appealing as possible and you will get fans back.

BTW- I don't care what Kaiser says about how the FSU score shouldn't matter - it matters to the casual fan who has choices how to spend their weekends and the opportunity cost to attend a football game.

 

[Chip]

A lot more entertainment and skill in half the time. There's a joke there somewhere...

I get that, and hopefully SU is well aware by now that offense sells tickets (even if defense has won us a couple of games). The offense will get there. I still think the place should be more than half full, but not much else can be said. I'd expect a slightly better showing this weekend.

Also, if SU is going to schedule 2 home games to end the season, they need to cut back the Thanksgiving break to what it was when we were there, classes Monday and Tuesday. We turned out ok with that schedule. Imagine 1992 if we had the week off, how many students miss the Miami game? I can't blame students for wanting to go home for the week.

 

[Millhouse]

I go to every home game so I don't rationally fit into the following comparison but hear me out.

My wife tries to get me to go to stupid Rom-Com movies all the time. I hate them and think it's a waste of 2+/- hours of my day/night. She could tell me the movie is half price, no price, will buy me dinner to go, etc. and I wouldn't willingly go to it. Why? Because it's not entertaining to me and it's a waste of my time.

Now think of that when looking at this through the lens of a casual fan. Your argument that the tickets are the cheapest in FBS football doesn't matter when the product is not appealing to someone. Throw in the cost to travel, inconvenience of parking, crappy food choices, etc. and it's not that hard to believe that some people may not want to spend their afternoons or evenings supporting something they don't enjoy at the moment.

We are fanatics. That's why we spend our time on this board. WE ARE A SMALL MINORITY OF THE FANBASE. People here need to understand that we are the irrational ones, not the casual fans.

Win, make it exciting, and make it as appealing as possible and you will get fans back.

BTW- I don't care what Kaiser says about how the FSU score shouldn't matter - it matters to the casual fan who has choices how to spend their weekends and the opportunity cost to attend a football game.

that's a pretty good comparison. i don't care what romantic comedies cost, they all suck and i know i'm not going to like them

that's where we're at, it's hard to drag new victims to these games.

some of it is not their fault. i'll never forget one of my friends quietly on the cell phone "i have to talk quietly. we're going to be late. i think the ref just dropped dead. I think the ref dropped dead... JESUS OPEN YOUR EARS I SAID I THINK THE REF DROPPED DEAD" and that was a pretty entertaining performance, what, 11 years ago